Originally Posted by NYMafia
Originally Posted by RollinBones
Originally Posted by NYMafia
You have your "Indigenous" rights because of the written constitution of this great country, which was developed after it got its start on day #1 from those brave sailors of the Nina, Pinta, and Santa Maria.
lol Wow

The same Constitution that considered Black people to be 3/5 of a person?

Columbus was a savage himself. Pure and simple. The list of Italians that are far more deserving of the type of recognition Columbus receives is a mile long. I'm part Italian and have no problem admitting this, because I don't tie my pride of my heritage to a single figure.


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Rolling bones, this is getting silly now. Our constitution is not perfect, nor is our country. But I dare say that you still fair better here than ANY other country in the world. If you don't think so, then go try and get a taste of another country and see. We have come a long way baby, but admittedly have a long journey still ahead of us to make a "more" perfect union.

I don't know if you are aware of our history (since you are part Italian), but although maybe not to the degree that blacks were, did you know that Italians in this country faced HUGE prejudice. Do you know how many times Italians were lynched in this country just like blacks were? Do you even know that nearly ALL newspapers and periodicals across the country at one times referred to Italians as "non-white" and as "worse than blacks"? The New York Times, etc.and other major periodicals.

In fact we were considered "black", and "worse than the negro" which was actual phrases repeatedly written in major daily's. We had NO rights. For many years in fact.

So don't blame Columbus, or any other Italian for slavery or any other atrocities committed to Blacks, Jews, Chinese, Spanish, etc.... because the Italian people (your Italian people) stood in the front of the line for kicks in the ass, and a rope around their necks!
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And FYI, my Italian identify is not solely tied to Columbus but a whole host of Italians and our history dating back to antiquity. Columbus is but one such name I am proud of. As far as "savage" ? Lol.... you've been brainwashed by all this current "political correctness" thats so popular nowadays. I think (I can just feel) that I'm a bit older than you. And I come from a different mindset and viewpoint. Your views are fine and you are entitled to them as I said to BF. They're just not mine.

I know I will never change your outlook, its too engrained in you. (I'm not even trying to).

Let's agree to disagree thats all. Ok? At the end of the day "it is what it is" as the man said.

Good night.



Yes I know the history of Anti-Italian discrimination in America, that wasn't excusable or acceptable just like many of Columbus' actions weren't. One doesn't cancel out the other. I also know our Constitution isn't perfect, which is why I found it funny that you credited it with providing rights that wouldn't need providing if it wasn't for colonization in the first place.
It's interesting to me that you think I'm brainwashed by the "political correctness" of today, because these sentiments about Columbus are hardly anything new. The "Christopher" episode of The Sopranos that explores this topic is almost 20 years old at this point, and these are conversations that have been happening for longer than that. Just because it's new to you, doesn't mean it's new to everybody. The guy was a slave trader at the end of the day, was hardly even a competent explorer or "colonial governor", and wasn't as popular as you make it seem he was back in those days. That's why he was removed his post in Hispaniola at one point and forcibly sent back to Spain. I have no illusions about who this man was, but like I said, people tie their own personal self-worth to things like this so when challenged, they can't see it any other way. I see it in the older Italians every year, they take anything except praise for Columbus personally because the holiday is like an unofficial Italian-American day, but we have many figures more worthy of that recognition, whose reputations are not questionable at best.