Originally Posted By: CabriniGreen
Ivey, I'm seriously starting to wonder about you.......

First of all, I've kinda made a reputation as the poster who talks narcotics, BIG PERCENT OF THE TIME, yet you act like I haven't posted ad nauseum about all this shit, it's really funny. You are the one ALWAYS TALKING ABOUT FUCKIN GAMBLING LOL.. Like every time I bring up drugs it's always, " The five families have been marginalized" , " the biggest money maker is gambling", all of a sudden now here you go......

And what I said is all true. You can look at narcotics alone if you want, and it certainly is the most lucrative racket in terms of total dollars, but not for the LCN. Gambling is a bigger money maker for the American mob, not because it's more lucrative than drugs, but because the mob has more involvement and control in gambling than it does in the drug trade.

Remember the discussion about the Rizzutos, when I broke down how all or this shit revolves around the drug trade, I didn't hear any of this shit from you then, yet you think you know more about it than me now? Dude....

If you mean the conflict in Montreal revolved around the drug trade, I would agree.

I read constantly, and everything, again, you act like you are the only person who knows how to read and interpret facts, and like your data or stats are the only thing that matters, you really kill me. And the funny thing is, you google Dominicans cocaine and NY, I mean, lol you act like this is all speculation or some shit, you don't have to take my word, wtf? And I'm sorry, but I gotta respect the word of a guy who lives In The city and sees what what.

I'm not saying those in a given area don't have something to offer. But their knowledge is going to be on an anecdotal, micro level. In terms of big picture, there are far better sources than some dude on an Internet message board. And, having been on these forums for over 10 years now, I can tell you you'll get a better idea of things by going with official info than some guy's 2 cents.

You crack me up on the geography thing. I don't even think you know it's the Zeta cartel that most indentified with trafficking in NY. And it makes sense, they are based on the Gulf, all the states that border the Gulf are basically the same states at the end of the Caribbean route, Florida, Louisiana. The Gulf has 7 of the ten busiest ports in the US. Lots of camouflage for contraband. Now when you talk of the recent decline, like are you keeping up with Mexico? Lots of reports are that the Zetas are no longer operational. I JUST ASKED SMEARY ABOUT IT IN ONE OF HIS CARTEL THREADS, I DIDNT SEE BOO FROM YOU, NO POST NOTHING. Yet you act like you know now? Come on man..... You do realize I live in Chicago, Sinaloas home base. Where Zambadas son was locked up in the loop? Where the Flores brothers dealt thousands of kilos? You have any idea how many local articles have come out during even the last 10 years? Read a report, you gotta be kidding me....

I'm not sure why you assume if I don't post in a certain thread, I'm not familiar with the topic. I'm become a lot more busy in the last few years and I have to be more selective about posting. Typically the titles of Smeary's threads are enough to make me skip them.

As far as the rest of what you said above, you are all over the place. You living in Chicago is irrelevant to this discussion. And I'm not sure what point you're trying to make about the Zetas in relation to New York and the rest of the Northeast being the last region of the country the Mexicans don't have dominance over.

The Dominicans are to coke on the east coast what Vietnamese gangs are to heroin and high grade weed on the west coast. Do a google, don't take my word for it, RESEARCH....

Again, nobody said the Dominicans aren't very significant on the East Coast drug trade. I simply said you saying "Dominicans=NY" is an oversimplification and them being "dominant" isn't true, at least as far as the definition of that word goes.

And you keep repeating shit I JUST SAID, like what is wrong with you? I just said the Mexicans are constantly encroaching, ON EVERYONES TERRITORY, MAN NOT JUST NY. Europe, Australia, Asia, these people are trying to position themselves all over the world. And here you go with some snarky comment, read the reports of the last 20 years, oh my god, give me a fuckin break. I grew up in an open air drug market, I don't need to consume every piece of literature to have a greater understanding of how this works.

You do need to read to get a more macro, big picture idea of things. Your personal, anecdotal experiences won't give you that.

Your sarcasm, lol "Wait is that why a Ki.." Look, if you understand all that I shouldn't have to explain why the Dominicans have leverage in NY, with the country being a transshipment point. It should be self evident.

But you didn't say Dominicans "have leverage" in New York. You said "Dominicans=NY" and they're "dominant." Not the same thing.

Remember this thread? It's about calculating the mafias total income, right?


Now this guy says 24 bil for drugs, right? You go right along with this, as you can see from your responses right? But look at my last two post, it became clear to me I WAS THE ONLY POSTER WHO ACTUALLY READ THE THING.
Look at what is said on page 13......

Drug markets: estimating financial value
Illicit drug markets are complex systems of production and distribution that generate large sums of money at di erent levels. A conservative estimate values the retail market for illicit drugs in the European Union at EUR 24.3 billion in 2013 (likely range EUR 21 billion to EUR 31 billion). With an estimated retail value of EUR 9.3 billion (likely range EUR 8.412.9 billion), and responsible for about 38 % of the total, cannabis products account for the largest share of the illicit drug market in Europe. is is followed by heroin, estimated at EUR 6.8 billion (EUR 6.07.8 billion) (28 %), and cocaine at EUR 5.7 billion (EUR 4.57.0 billion) (24 %). Amphetamines occupy a smaller market share, estimated at EUR 1.8 billion (EUR 1.22.5 billion) (8 %), ahead of MDMA, at almost EUR 0.7 billion (EUR 0.610.72 billion) (3 %). These estimates are based on very limited data, which has necessitated some broad assumptions, and hence must be viewed as initial minimum estimates that need revision in the future, as the information underpinning them is improved.

So this was basically a bullshit, incomplete report. But I'm SURE you didn't READ the whole thing, just from your responses. You don't know the agenda behind this. The guy could be trying to downplay the official report to make Europe look better, to attract more foreign investment or who the fuck knows what.

I realize the report isnt exhaustive or complete. One thing that stuck out from the start was the lack of estimates of not only other illicit activities but also legitimate businesses. I simply said I found those conservative estimates to be closer to the truth than the more extreme figures we often see published.

I pay attention to EVERYTHING. When I see BlackFam post about an Atlanta hustler with an organization stretching to Boston, supplied by Mexicans, it proposes a question in my head, What Cartel? I see something like that and it makes me question the shit I read earlier about the Zetas being dismantled, see what I mean? When I see the cartel in Costa Rica working with the Calabrians, I wonder, what cartel is that? You can't understand what's happening with the Italians, if you pay no attention to South and Central America. What's happening in South America affects the criminal landscape of NY, Canada and the Entirety of Europe, GLOBALIZATION, it's what I'm talking about. YOU ONLY LOOK AT NY AND THINK YOU GOT THE WHOLE PICTURE, you don't.....

Some of what's going on globally affects things in New York, other things not so much. The drug trade, which you focus on, certainly. This involves people from other countries moving drugs and money across international borders.

But when we're talking about the NY Mafia, which is what I assume you are referring to when you mention New York, drugs are only one factor and not the most important one. Understanding the mob's current position in the drug trade alone, or having a good idea of the drug trade on a global basis alone, isn't going to give you a complete or necessarily accurate idea of the current overall state of the NY mob. Things you seem to overlook or not consider that important or maybe just boring, such as membership, are more crucial.

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