Originally Posted By: TonyG


No offense taken Ivy. I agree with you, it is inflated. I do know that St. Louis did not make guys until they were older, usually in their 50's. My uncle's name is on that list and he was never made.

At its peak, St. Louis was composed of 3 gangs, the LCN, the East Side Gang (controlled by Chicago and generally non Italian) and the Syrians (led at one time by Jimmy Michaels). They worked together in an uneasy coalition that disintegrated in fights over union control in the late 70's and early 80's.

I think a key point is the FBI numbers do not consider the non-Italian head counts associated with the other gangs (East Side & Syrians) and those under the protection of the LCN, such as my uncle. My uncle was not Italian, but I assure you, he was involved in criminal activity, mostly gambling and book making, his entire adult life.

I believe that LCN in St Louis is dead and dying. There are some guys still there, but I don't believe they do much, if anything, anymore.


Except where indicated, salviardi's chart seems to suggest those guys are made members. Which is obviously what I'm referring to. Associates is entirely different. When it comes to members, a guy is made or he isn't. So it's much easier to get a fairly accurate estimate on total made guys. But the definition of an associate can vary widely depending on who's doing the defining. Usually, it's up to the local FBI SAC. I really don't pay much attention to associate estimates because they're all over the place.

All that said, it doesn't take much to see that St. Louis - as a formally structured, viable family - is dead. They were under 10 total members over 20 years ago and the most knowledgeable poster on these boards (that I'm aware of) could only name 4 or 5 remaining guys a few years ago. And there hasn't been mob cases of note there since the early 1990's when Trupiano was busted for running a card game on union time.


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