Originally Posted By: goombah


That's fair - those losses weren't totally Manning's fault nor were the wins entirely Brady.

That Pittsburgh game though, the stats are misleading. Much of those numbers were padded when the Colts found themselves down 16-0, much of it due to Manning's ineffectiveness. I remember Manning looking uncomfortable and having horrible mechanics for much of that game. Plus his line could not handle the blitz. That game was, IMO, one of their worst losses ever. They had home field throughout the playoffs, were 14-2 in a year when Manning was amazing. Worst of all, that was a home game against a 6th seed. Granted the Steelers got hot at the right point in the season, but they should have been blown out by the Colts in that situation. They would have never even been in position for Vandy's miss had Cowher not made one of the dumbest calls in playoff history - that fumbled Bettis goal-line handoff instead of kneeling down and waiting for the FG attempt to effectively put the game out of reach.

Hey, don't get me wrong. I would take Manning on my team in a heartbeat. He's a first-ballot HOFer. But I don't think there is any argument that Manning has been blessed with far greater skill players throughout his career than just the one season Brady enjoyed in 2007. Manning had Edge & then Addai, along with Harrison & Wayne. Until 2007, Brady never had a stud, All-Pro WR and the best RB he had was Corey Dillon, who was definitely on the downside of his career. I don't think much of Maroney and the rest of his backs from previous Super Bowl seasons were all by committee.



That Pittsburgh game was just horrible all around, I agree. I was pissed about it for a long time.

Personally I am not a big fan of Edge. He just isn't explosive. He will get you 4 yards at a time, which I guess isn't bad, but Addai can get 4 or 40. I am glad the Pats got Maroney and left Addai for us...

Manning has had better wide receivers but you could also argue that he elevates his receivers a little bit. Brandon Stokley, for example. Reggie Wayne is a beast though. He's peaking while Harrison is beginning to decline, so that works out for us.

I'd say most teams are using a running back by committee nowadays, maybe partially due to the success the Pats had with Kevin Faulk and....what's his name. I think that is becoming a fact in the NFL now, you don't need a big name RB to win games, you just need a few people who can get the job done. Dominic Rhodes isn't a great RB, but he can get the job done. I don't even count the year in Oakland because that place is just a black hole right now. It seems like most RB's picked high in the draft have been wasted picks the last few years. I consider Addai an exception, along with Adrian Peterson. Carnell Williams could be one if he doesn't keep getting injured and keeps up his productivity from his previous levels.

Brady has had Deion Branch who was a Super Bowl MVP, but he hasn't done anything since he left the Pats. I'd agree that Brady hasn't had the same kind of talent at WR or RB but his team had a defense, which until about '05 (even more so in '07 when we got rid of Jason David and put in Jackson and Hayden at CB)the Colts didn't which led to Manning having to try to outscore the other team in a shootout. It didn't help that the Pats had his number for a few years either.

There are so many factors it seems like you can debate forever about who is really the best, but that's fun.

I used to agree with the idea of Peyton Manning being a choke artist but now I would say the opposite. I think in previous years he would try to do too much because it was pretty much all on his shoulders as the leader of the offense. Games like the Colts vs Tampa Bay on Monday Night Football when the Colts came back from a big lead in the final minutes helped to change that perception too along with the AFCCG in '06, and etc.

I feel like finally we have a complete team with an excellent offense and an excellent defense. Special teams though.... The Patriots are still right up there too even though their defense is declining. San Diego is a young team with a lot of talent, god what a horrible game...the only positive about that last game was Peyton threw 6INTs, Vinetieri missed a FG (maybe 2?), the team played horribly and we still came close to winning.





Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.