Guys, I know a bit about both from various 2nd (possibly 3rd) hand sources, read all the books and the info on here as well. I know they are both basically scumbags, but since their fall out, Alite always seems to have come across a bit more honest about the situation and, in a way, regretful about his past - Gotti seems like he wants to give some ambiguous impression that you don't want to fuck with him still since he's a "mean dude" (not my opinion at all, just my observation).

What's your opinion of them now, based on what theyve both said after it all?

To help, heres a Gotti interview with his lawyer (I wouldnt trust either with even the steam off my piss by the way)

http://youtu.be/MIly1bArKh8

Heres Alite, I know its longer but you dont have to watch it all. Any person without knowledge of the situation would surely think Alite is more truthful?

http://youtu.be/0Gu9tJE4BD4

They're both violent men with drug dealing pasts. They've also both given information to Team America. You can't codemn one and praise the other (usually the Gotti supporters). Not when they're basically the same guy. My two cents.

I see Alite does talks with kids as well, surely he's the better man? You listen to him and it all sound genuine to me. Listen to Gotti and I get a feeling theres a bit more he's not letting on about

I totally understand your point though PB

At what point do we, as a society, offer redemption to a previously violent drug dealing man? In these to cases, if you were on the jury, what would you do?

i dont believe anything alite says but then again junior is a bullshitter

alite is scum and lies alot that i dont like. Junior is scum aswell and lies

this is a pointless because both are lying its impossible to know the truth so many things contradict what they both say

Two, not "to"...spellcheck mofo!

I disagree gangster...Ive listened to a few of his interviews and I think Alite is trying his best now. Im not interested really in what he might be lying about when it comes to previous crimes now, I trust law enforcement to have done that job. All we need to consider is the implications of him being in our society now, to me theres nothing that makes me worried

Gangster, think about it....when was the last time you felt the need and went to a school and try to help kids? Just saying

true he could being doing that for publicity though. I dont know really you cant forget what he did in the past and recently he got in trouble for threatening people over the internet ridiculous stuff i dont understand why he gets involved

same goes for junior though both did some real bad things

are you talking to me

Gangster, No! I think I had spelt "two"wrong but you posted just at the same time

Mofo in a sarcastic way to myself

ok understood

Alite is doing his best? Gotti jr isnt?
Every time Alite is interviewed he somehow has to mention jr gotti. Why ? Move on.
To me Alite was a much bigger rat, he actuallly took the stand amd testified. Gotti gave a proffer but went to trial and didnt cooperate to anywhere near the degree of Alite. In fact, when he didnt sign an agreement, he was sent to solitary and was stuck there a long time. Most men woukd have broke after 5 minutes of that. I really think Jr opted not to cooperate because of his children.
I know some of the guys i like on this board will disagree but i see Alite being much worse and his past crimes being much more sadistic in nature.
Alite also had a bunch of kids while not married and lost contact with, while Gotti jr took care of his kids from jump. I do see Alite now has a relationship, not judging him, just stating.
Alite could be a changed man and i give him credit if he did. That said, i think gotti is the lesser of the 2 evils.

agree

Agree Belmont.

Jnr gave a proffer. But he also rolled the dice facing life four times.

Alite couldn't play ball for Team A fast enough trial one.

I don't know how you can compare the two.
But I've said my piece before.

Hello Sonny..he talked before his first trial before he got bail,,think this.if found guilty..you really think he takes 20 plus after trying to flip. ? never..he would have been on his 20th trial testifying..my opinion..he said if i lose i flip..

A Joey Massino special. Allowing someone to flip after the fact set a terrible precedent. And that's a plausible scenario where Junior is concerned.

What makes it plausible is that Danny Marino and the Corozzos all believed it. And the poor guy just dropped dead, so I'll post it. So did Tony Megale. Plausible enough for them, plausible enough for me.

@bronx.
Maybe. But the guy did 10years and though sat for a proffer, decided to roll the dice four times.

Whether he was planning to flip if convicted who knows.

Same could be said of anybody. That they'll flip if convicted. Who knows.

Still think Alite's twice the scumbag. But that's just me.

PB: couldn't agree more letting fat Joey flip post conviction. Why would anyone do so beforehand now? But The Feds wanted a boss as a trophy. Hope it bites them in the ass.

Alite is no changed man. All that motivational speaker crap is a scam. If he was a changed man he would not be pushing a book full of lies. He contradicts himself in almost every interview.

JG minds his own business and takes care of his family. Alite is an insignificant insect to him.
And he's even said it-- in his book and interviews. The number one reason why he would never flip is his kids. To make his sons change their last names like the son of Mikey Scars?
JG wouldn't do that.

And Alite? Yea, he bitches and complains in every interview and to make himself 'relevant' he trashes the Gotti family.

He even put their name on the cover of his book instead of his own. JG's picture is bigger than his on it.

He got chased in 1991. Was involved only in minor drug dealing and home invasions, low level stuff after. He got sued for child support. He was no big multi-millionaire.

If he was a changed man he would admit in interviews how he testified in two separate trials to beating his wife and smacking around multiple women. The NY tabloids even wrote about it back then.

And then... GA ignored it for his book... and even wrote that Alite was there to comfort and defend a woman when she was abused... and presented him as "a good-bad-guy"...

Which was a lie.

Alite is no changed man. He's a super-rat.
A low level nobody who lied through his teeth and in desperation to convict JG rogue agents put him on the witness stand as 'the star witness' -- at the expense of the taxpayers -- where he lied through his teeth... and the jurors even said on television after that he had zero credibility.

Videos of it are on YouTube.

Yet GA propped him up in his book full of lies.
Alite is no changed man. Just a guy always complaining about the Gottis.

JG moved on a long time ago.

Alite should have too.

Alite got chased in 1991?

Then you better ask Junior why Alite was around Zef to help straighten things out whenever there was a problem with the Albanians in the Bronx. Especially after that kid got killed on Arthur Avenue. He was at Cafe Dion on Morris Park and Bronxdale with Zef all the time. That place is long gone now. But it was an Albanian place that played Italian music and catered to a mostly Italian crowd back then. Wahoo had a place just up the block. And prior to Scores, Alite was hanging out at Craig and Willie's strip joint on Boston and Conner whenever he was in the Bronx. Those were both post 1991, by the way. Maybe he and Junior fell out by then. But Alite was still running errands for at least SOME of the Gambinos post 1991. Fact.

I have no beef with you, buddy. I understand your position. And I wouldn't piss on John Alite to put out a fire. He's the scum of the earth, and when he was active he was a fucking nobody. His claim about being sent to retire Old Man Joe in Astoria was so ridiculous that it was worth the price of the book just for the comedy. I'm just saying, I can see that you're an educated white collar friend of the Gottis. And that's fine. But there are clearly things that you don't know. And that stuff may sell to people who've never laid eyes on a wiseguy in their lives. But not to people who grew up in that environment and knew some of the guys from that era. I'm older than both Junior and Alite by a few years. And I'm not even a Queens guy. I'm a Bronx guy with East Harlem roots, so I don't have a dog in this fight. I just try to keep things objective.

All that said, I wish Junior luck. I agree with Belmont that he's the lesser of two evils. I hope he sticks to his original plan and heads to Ocala. New York isn't the same anymore. He's in his fifties now. He should take his money and go live the quiet life. It's hard to believe. But he's now older than his father was when they pulled him out of the Ravenite for the last time. He should bear that in mind, count his blessings, and go enjoy the years that his father lost out on.

I'm going to ask JG about this. Interesting stuff, thanks for posting it.

From what I understand though, having spoken to people who knew Alite, and actually grew up with him-- about all that Albanian stuff-- back in the 80s he used to actually tell people that he was part-Italian, on his mother's side, to fit in. But, this long-running lie was exposed by Joe O'Kane in 1991, just before Alite was chased by JG.

Can you provide a time period on Alite's misadventures in The Bronx? Narrow down the date at all?

JG (and others) have told me that in 2003 just before Alite went "on the run" he showed up on property owned by JG where a tire shop was housed, looking for Johnny Ruggiero. Apparently Alite heard that the Gambinos were having problems with the Albanians in The Bronx, the Rudaj people, and Alite was trying to set a meeting with Ruggiero to discuss it.

NOTE-- this is the time period that Alite claims the Gottis/Gambinos wanted to kill him, part of the reason he says he went "on the run".

So, apparently, Alite showed up at this tire shop-- and again, this is backed by multiple parties, not just JG, who was in prison at the time-- looking to meet with Ruggiero. Who was not there, so, Alite passed a message to him through a third party who was that Alite could be of assistance with the Albanian "problem" and for Ruggiero to tell the alleged acting boss who Ruggiero was friends with, Arnold Squitieri, that Alite's cousin knew the Rudaj people and Alite was offering to find information on them, like, where they hung out, who their girlfriends were, etc, so, the Gambinos could kill them. Alite was trying to get back in their good graces, willing to be their spy.
Basically an informant against his beloved Albanians who he claims he is so loyal to.

But, his offer was quickly rebuffed by Ruggiero who did not trust him as by that point the Gambinos believed Alite was a longtime informant and wanted nothing to do with him.

This is also backed up by prison tapes made at Ray Brook in 2003 where JG is told that Alite was on his property and JG says he hasn't seen this Alite since 1991 and says not to let Alite anywhere near his property. Excerpts from this conversation, transcribed by the FBI are in JG's book.

From what I am told when Ruggiero rebuffed him, Alite then tried to approach Richard Gotti with the same offer but he didn't want anything to do with Alite either.

Again, this is Alite appearing at a tire shop where he believed friends of JG hung out, which, he most likely would not have done if he really believed they wanted to kill him. He would not have been trying to set meetings with them.

But again can you provide a time period when Alite was allegedly at these places? I would like to look into it. Also Alite was in prison between 96-99, during which the Scores indictment took place, so, what time period do you mean by "prior to Scores"?

If you can tell me where your info comes from (court documents, first hand, etc) I would like to know, even if in private message or email. Not trying to be aggressive or belligerent, just curious.

Also-- during the 2009 Gotti trial Alite testified under direct that he discussed the Albanian problem with Richard Gotti Sr., when Alite was trying to get transferred to the Lucchese group. He said he was trying to switch families but the Gottis wouldn't let him, part of the reason being that they had an Albanian problem and they thought Alite could be helpful with it. Alite said all this happened between 2000-2001, however, that Gotti had a sit down with Joe Defede over him during this time. That Defede, the former acting Lucchese boss wanted Alite to switch over to his people.

But this lie was exposed (the next day, I think) under cross by Charles Carnesi when he pointed out that Defede was in prison between 98-02 so the meeting could not have happened, especially since Defede went into Witness Protection in 02 before he was released.
Defede I think then actually testified against Richard Gotti in early 2003. Something Alite would have known if he really was the big shot he claims he was. But, not only was this meeting not possible, when Carnesi asked Alite if he even knew that Defede was in prison he said no, he thought he was in "the hospital".

I have read the transcripts and can provide the exact pages on this part of his testimony. His lies are so crazy.
Anastasia, surprisingly though, who claims to have read the same transcripts and says that they are why he believes John Alite's story is truthful, Anastasia didn't include this Defede nonsense in his book. He washed over it on page 198 with some cover-up, that he wanted to get transferred but the Gottis wouldn't release him so he tried to make the best of a bad situation and started using Ronnie Trucchio and Charles Carneglia as buffers with JG.

I do believe that he had some kind of secret relationship with Trucchio, though. Trucchio actually made Alite godfather to his daughter (which Alite never mentions) and from what I'm told he had a soft spot for Alite and used to talk to him on the sneak when he wasn't supposed to. Would secretly help him with problems if and when he could and Alite was full of them.

Part of the reason Trucchio got caught up in that Tampa indictment, which, from the evidence I've seen, he really had nothing to do with what was going on down there and got screwed over and caught a life sentence just because he would talk to Alite when he wasn't supposed to. The rats down there testified that Alite reported to Trucchio in New York. And Trucchio got life for it. On top of that he's also doing 20 years from a separate case.

Yet Alite has the gall to call Trucchio a rat. To say that Trucchio ratted him out. He's despicable. If either Trucchio or JG ratted Alite out he would have never have been released. He'd be the one doing life instead.

you have it right..he was not chased in 91

When I say 'chased' I mean that he was no longer under the flag of the Gambinos.

He was still a criminal. Still involved in scams and nonsense. Some people still spoke to him but he was no longer a Gambino associate. No longer had the backing and protection. I think Mikey Scars even mentioned in his debriefings that JG had chased some guy named Alite in 91, right after Gravano turned.

In the phone calls from Brazil where Alite spoke to Joseph Corozzo and his private investigator Larry Frost-- in recorded phone calls-- Alite described being scared of coming into Queens.

From what I understand from speaking to people who were around, Alite was a total asshole when he was under JG's flag from 89-91, flaunting it, doing crazy shit and dropping the John Gotti name all over the place, and when he got chased Alite was scared some of the people he pissed off were going to hurt him.

The following is a link to a transcript excerpt from the Brazil phone conversations where Alite describes being scared to come into Queens, during the same conversations that Alite now claims he learned his "bosses" in the Gambino family were ratting him out. During these same conversations Alite actually admits to himself being a longtime informant.

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[url=https://www.facebook...e=3&theater

If anyone here speaks to Alite please tell him he's welcome to comment on these transcripts at any time. He commented on other areas of that Facebook page, random comments, spewing venom, but, didn't go anywhere near these excerpts.

Thank you for explaining what chased means .

If he wasn't chased by the Gambinos post '91, then what was he doing with Zef after Tore had that problem in '93? Do you even know the events I'm talking about? And what was he doing at Pretty Woman after that?

Hi, I'm John Alite. The Gambinos chased me in '91. So, naturally, I started hanging around Tore's best friend. The one Albanian who was universally feared by the rest of them back then, and I became a regular at Greg DePalma's strip joint (which didn't even open until '92). Please.

Now, I know you're trying to write for a living and I respect that. You obviously had a hand in ghostwriting that book. But I can see from your web link pictures that you're still a young guy. So don't turn me into an Alite supporter. The guy's a scumbag and a lowlife. But those Brazil tapes are from years later and he was still doing things with Zef after '91. I went so far as to wish Junior well and I meant it. But he's either lying about, or ignorant to, the time frame.

Now I'm done. Unless you want to continue arguing with me about Morris Park, Arthur Avenue, Louie, Wahoo and Tore (who also stood tall like a man but walked away from the life without any silly publicity). Because if you get into the Bronx stuff with me you'll be completely out of your depth.

Good luck to you, too. I hope you do well with your writing career. And I mean that, too.

I know. But what's the sense?

Why argue with the blind who don't want to see? I'm done.

Didn't Phil Leonetti do the same?

True enough, Beans. I forgot about Leonetti. But you know I don't pay any attention to places outside my comfort zone. I developed a passing interest in Merlino for awhile because when we're in Florida he lives close by. That's about it.