Also true on the fruit merchant thing, but it took CApone even fewer years to become what he was sooo....

If the Bonannos had 180 members in 1965 then 150 in the early 80s correspond pretty well, especially because new members were made after 1975. You also have to take it into context; 130 members in New York and 20 in Montreal. That does sound believable does it not?

CabriniGreen, New Orleans crime family is unique as well as the city. If you dig around New Orleans records and residents from the 1904 to 1930 records, you will find many well known members of other crime families had passed through there and one out of eight of them had stayed in the city for a number of years before moving to other cities in the states, and one out of five those were know as Men of Honor while living in the city. New Orleans was a huge port of entry for them, so you will see hundreds of names, especially during the time of Bendito. The west coast had a bunch of people from New Orleans. All five of the New York families had members from New Orleans that were known as Men of Honor while living in New Orleans, Brooklyn and the Bronx had the most concentration of those members, and three New York families that had a lot them were the Bonanno, Mangano, and Profaci families. Gagliano had Silver Dollar nephew in his family. Like I said New Orleans is unique.

i doubt the 5 families are the size as reported

unless they're just making people for the sake of having numbers

the five familys have a massive recruitment pool i can name tons of young guys getting there button not like chicago or detrot were they are struggling for young guys.

guys 30s and 40s running crews not like chicago or detroit


as FBI agent jack falcone said in his book when he went undercover in the gambino family

he is going to know alot more than you about the size of the mob as he was in the mob for 2 years undercover


"for every capo they take down a soldier steps up for every soldier a associate steps up every associate a wannabe steps up"





five familys are doing the best since the 90s

The FBI figures for the families since the 1980s have been very largely accurate and consistent. There's a world of difference between the recruiting pool in NY and those elsewhere.

Once again, GReAt info GIacomo, I think Ivey is pretty much right on this one, also I think the families are in a renaissance period of sorts, this might be the best run they have had since the heyday of the 80s?

The conflicting reports do make it hard to nail down accurate numbers, Sonny the BOnnano numbers do seem accurate, even though they contradict the BOnnano turncoats, I think you are right on the Canadian made men.
Also, I had a thought, the get numbers of guys in the 50s, and esp the 60s it seems, maybe ALL the families were making unauthorized initiations?
And all the guys that weren't vetted were basically shelved?
Pure speculation but a thought...

Pittsburgh's heyday was after 1937 when Frank Amato Sr took over. By 1946, state police and local law enforcement had Pittsburgh between 45-55. Pittsburgh has always operated very similar to a Camorra where they assigned bosses to each area. High ranking associates were held in very high regard and some of them were actually better earners than some made guys. By 1950, Pittsburgh had these guys assigned to their respected territories:

Frank Amato- Braddock, East McKeesport
John LaRocca- Pittsburgh (city limits)
Kelly & Sam Mannarino- New Kensington
Tony Ripepi- Fayette & Washington Counties
Mike Genovese- East Liberty, Bloomfield Ave
Joe Regino- Altoona/Johnstown
Joe Pecora- Penn Hills-then moved to Chester, WV along Rte 30
Charlie Imburgia- Warren, OH (Trumbull County)
Paul Romeo- Youngstown, OH
Vincenzo Tripodi- Steubenville,OH (Cosmo Quattrone was his #2)
Jack DeSarro- East Liverpool, OH
Louis Volpe- Turtle Creek
Salvatore Marino- Sharon, Hermitage & Farrell, Pennsylvania
John Scardina- Lawrence County, PA

Each one of these guys had their own crews of made members and the members had about 10 associates each. Each one of these guys made sole decisions in their territory without the brass sticking their beaks in.

The real powerhouses in the LaRocca Family were certainly Kelly Mannarino and his brother Sam but most people overlook Joe Pecora, often referred to by friends as Jo Jo. Nobody made a move along Rte 30 withour Joe knowing about it. People could talk about No Legs Hankish all they want but Paul couldn't take a shit without letting Jo Jo know about it. Our local guy, Jimmy Tripodi, ruled with an iron fist. His # 2 man was Cosmo Quattrone, owner of Rex Cigar store and the casino inside. Dean Martin got his start dealing black jack at Rex Cigar. Tripodi & Quattrone were Calabrese and were tied in with the Youngstown Calabrians as well as tied to Tony Milano (Calabrian) in Cleveland and Antonio Ripepi (Calabrian) in Pittsburgh.

What made you change where you listed for Joe Pecora moving to Wheeling?

After I signed on, I saw that I typed Wheeling because the LaRocca's controlled Wheeling but forgot Joe was in Chester down the road.

Sciacca has to be wrong about the size of his own family, because D'Arco said the maximum size for the Bonannos was 125-140. It's common knowledge that the Bonnano cap was that size. Maybe the common knowledge wasn't known by the Bonanno boss.

Absolutely. D'Arco's word is final. As boss of bosses from the early 1900s up until he turned rat, he was in the thick of everything. He knows more about your grandmother than you do. He probably has a picture of D'Aquila and Maranzano having luch together, and he knows where Hoffa's body can be found.

All kidding aside, no one besides D'Arco has ever mentioned such a specific number cap for the families. And a family boss always has more knowledge about his own borgata than an outsider.

Fair enough. However I was always under the impression that John LaRocca succeeded Frank Amato Sr. as Boss of the Pittsburgh LCN.
Then Michael Genovese succeeded John. Thus they were more than just territorial Bosses. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Also did Joe Pecora deal directly with Paul Hankish or did he have one of his soldiers deal with Paul? If so: Do you know who that was?

That is correct. The overall boss was Amato, then LaRocca and then Mike G. However, the LaRocca family operated where a Capo was the boss of their own territory. Joe never dealt with anybody personally unless he was to throw you a beating. Zottola was a long time loyalist of Mr. Pecora so I would assume Zottola dealt with No Legs. Speaking of No legs, his son died not long ago, was found dead in his Scott Township, PA home. He was a nice guy but got caught up with Porter and company back in the early 1990's. My friend's dad dated No Legs wife after he died, I think her name was Pat. A real looker in her early 50's, I could only imagine what she looked like years ago. She would walk into the Lightning Rod Club and guys would jerk off in the bathroom. If No Legs only knew, he was a jealous monster with her and would have chopped somebody's head off for even having fantasies about that broad.

It still surprises me that Paul got away for so long with the murder of Melvin Pike, one of the biggest racketeers in all of Western PA for 30 years out of Uniontown. Mannarino and Pecora went belistic when Melvin was killed, especially since it was done in front of his daughter after her gymnastics class back in 1978. His area straddled the WV border and Hankish wanted his gambling empire. Hankish hired Robert "Codfish" Bricker, a notorious hitman for hire. Chucky Porter was sent by Mannarino to find out who and what happened and Porter shot Bricker at point blank range in the face and he didn't die. He got convicted a few years later but it didn't come out until 1990 that Hankish in fact arranged for the Pike murder.

So far - so good ;-)

The first time I met Paul was at his ranch house in Wheeling. Zebo told me not to look at his wife. As soon as she answered the door, I knew why. Then Paul came over on a car mechanics crawler. Believe me, my eyes never looked up the whole time we were there.

BTW: Zebo was Jo Jo's go-between.

Friend of Henry...now I get it. Zottola was a charachter, I remember a green cadillac el dorado he had ( I believe it was dark/polo green) with tan leather interior. He was a guy who could lose his shit at the drop of a hat. He used to stop in at Jackie DeSarro's ITAM club in East Liverpool for pickups back in the early to mid 1990's. I was a regular there (not for the booze, but for the action and the whores:)

If you came from Steubenville, all you had a penchant for was gambling and whores. All kinds of whores, black, white, oriental and my personal favorites, red heads:) And I can assure you that Paul controlled all the whores from Wheeling/Steubenville and parts of Western PA.

Let me ask you, did you know Silvio Pinciaro, longtime East Liverpool bookmaker and very close to Jimmy Tripodi? They called him Birdy and he had aguy named Tree that would drive him. Tree was about 6'8, 325 pounds and was a former Right Tackle for PITT. Anyhow, tree carried a blackjack with him and thoroughly enjoyed using it. Long story short, I had no idea who he was one evening and I was in the phone booth outside and he needed to use the phone. Anyhow, he kept knocking on the booth and I called him a guerilla and told him to take a fucking hike...needless to say, the window of the booth shattered and he cracked me a few times over the head with the black jack. Once Birdy saw it was me, he came flying out and gave Tree a tongue lashing becuase I was Stogie's guy.

I did know one guy from Youngstown, his name was Larry Garono...a real lackey. Once the Strollo guys took over, they were shaking everybody down for a larger percentage of the take. They were very unreasonable with Jackie DeSarro and his Youngstown partner, Cyrak. Prato was always fair with his operators and everybody made money, the new brass were greedy and liars. I remember Zottola stopping by the ITAM one evening and Stogie was complaining about the new brass and Zottola seemed very aware that they had some serious issues in Mahoning County with the new leadership but from my understanding, Zottola's take increased ten fold after Porter got rung up and he became Mike G's guy. At the end of the day, none of them gave a fuck about anything as long as there was a fat envelope with Ben Franklin's in it.

Your description of Larry Garono, Jeep, is spot on. I never held Lenny in high regard. Michael was so concerned after Joey got hit that he assigned Zebo to look after him. No, Lenny didn't order the hit on Joey.

As you may know, Lenny rolled on his lifelong friend, Bernie The Jew, after he paid Bernie to wack Ernie Biondillo.

I knew Jackie, Cyrak and 2 gun Jimmy. Jimmy was an "Old School" Boss and everyone made money. I actually use to play poker with Jimmy. He never saw a card he didn't like ;-)

Is it safe to assume that you recognize my avatar?

I'm sorry Friend of Henry, I am not online during the weekends, the old lady told me I couldn't demoralize her if I was online Saturdays and Sundays, so I chose to close up shop during my weekends

Sure, I recognize your avatar. I used to see Henry every Thursday (well most of them anyways) in the late 1980's into the early 1990's when he would stop by a longtime Steubenville restaurant called Capri Sausage and Meatball, referred to as Capri's. It's been a staple in Steubenville for well over 35 years and the tavern was always known to have action. One of Jack DeSarro's guys ran the joint, longtime bookmaker and numbers operator. Other than Jack, he had the largest book in the area. I'd rather not mention his name because I know his son has been on these sites before.

I remember the trial in Youngstown, DeSarro was indicted back in the 1990's as well with Cyrak for promoting illegal gambling and operating an illegal numbers lottery. I never met Mr. Lenine Strollo but I did know his brother Danny from Campbell, my niece is married to the gentleman who lives next door to Danny. Danny was always the gentleman, I couldn't say a bad word about the guy. Plus, my niece's husband works alot of nights out at GM so having Danny next door certainly makes my niece feel safe, even if he is around 85/86.

Prato I remember very well, my wife and I used to eat at the Calla Mar a few times a month in the mid 1980's and have been to many weddings there. He had an uncle or a cousin that was said to be "the man" in Youngstown for many years. I believe his name was Dom or Don. He was tight with our two local guys, Jimmy Tripodi and Cosmo Quattrone. All the Calabrians stuck together in those days. I remeber very well when Tripodi was 87 years old and his wife had died and he took his .38 and put a bullet in his mouth either around Christmas day or just before Christmas day out in his garage in 1987. I lived 5 houses down from the Tripodi's. He was close with Tony Pep from Pittsburgh and to the Milano's in Cleveland.

I did not know Bernie but I knew Ernie, everybody knew Ernie. He was an affable guy but always went overboard with the booze. I knew his daughter back in the early 1990's very well, I met her up in Youngstown at a campus bar called Pal Joey's. She was a hot ticket back in those days but I haven't seen her in probably 20 years at least. Very classy as well if my memory serves me correct, she certainly knew how to refuse any advances.

Speaking of Garono, I know a guy that is referred to as Big Gary, he had a beef with Garono back in the mid 1990's and we were shooting dice at the Greek Coffee House in Youngstown, Big Gary worked there from time to time. Garono came in that night to collect the halfway take and an argument ensued behind closed doors...needless to say, when Garono came walking out, he was white as a ghost. One of the guys told Garono that if he wasn't Mr. Strollo's sidekick, Big Gary would have torn you part limb for limb. Garono had an answer for everything.

Out of curiosity, do you know anybody in Niles? Malvasi ring a bell? I miss the old man, he was a class act. My wife is from Niles, so I've listened to the stories my father in law would tell me about Niles, big gambling town I'm told. The only reason I knew Malvasi was because of the restaurant. My father in law used to play cards and eat great food in the back room with Malvasi and a few others. I remember they had very good hot peppers in oil and excellent Veal Scallopini.

It is interesting that Jack Falcone, FBI agent, blasts the accuracy of FBI charts in his book. Ivye, what are your thoughts on that?

Hopefully you're not asking my opinion. I only know/speak from my own experiences. I'm not a researcher.

Same here. For the most part, I only post what I personally believe to be true. That's why you'll rarely see me post outside of my comfort zone of New York, mainly in threads related to the Bronx and East Harlem.

I would agrea with whoever posted they make guys probaly for numbers. They kinda did that for awhile. Strength n numbers. Al d'arco the perfect example 33 yrs ago he didn't make his bones wasn't a earner but did as he was told and was related to another made guy. The feds can't what the mob guys anymore. There not killing like all the dirt bags home grown terrorist. They need to watch for the next fucking Sandy hook that's sick. If the want to induct 5 10 guys into a family every year in NYC or even the lil families outside whose gonna no.

I think if we're talking about the heyday for most of the Families it's going to be right at the end of Prohibition. The New York Families did a lot of recruiting for the Castellammarese War and during the period when selling alcohol was illegal and they were making money like it was water. The numbers would have been at their highest then, shrinking due to attrition.

Chicago had higher numbers back then not only for those reasons, but because the Outfit absorbed several other Families. The Outfit absorbed the Chicago Mafia, Chicago Heights and Gary, Indiana. Rockford and Milwaukee also absorbed a lot of Chicago Mafia guys who didn't want to work under Capone. Again though, the membership roster shrunk as members died and weren't replaced, and many of them weren't active so were members in name only. So it's possible that up to the 1950s Chicago had around 300 members. For the Gambinos and Genoveses during the period following Prohibition I've seen numbers as high as 700 or so. I'm not vouching for the accuracy of those numbers, only that the numbers peaked during that period.

If they just made guys for the numbers they'd be making them left and right in NY with no cap. But they do have a cap and can only make guys to replace those who have died, plus two more at Christmas time.

And the feds seem to be able to keep tabs rather well. I imagine the same sources who give them info on the current leadership of a family also tell them when someone has been recently made. Heck, even Internet mob watchers like us have fairly extensive lists of recent ceremonies.

I don't think they know about every single member but I doubt more than 10% of a family at most is flying under the radar.

What was the max number of made men allowed for Buffalo?