William Vincent Dwyer (1883–1946), known as "Big Bill" Dwyer, was an early Prohibition gangster and bootlegger in New York during the 1920s. He used his profits to purchase sports properties, including the New York Americans and Pittsburgh Pirates of the National Hockey League (NHL), as well as the Brooklyn Dodgers of the National Football League. He eventually was brought down by the U.S. government through legal actions, leaving Dwyer penniless at the end of his life in 1946.

Also, if you ever read the Westies by TJ English you would know that Mickey Spillane goes down to Florida in the either the late 1960s or early 1970s to try to work out problems with the Genoveses over the Javits. There is no accurate record of when McGrath dies but it's not in 1959.

That's about Eddie McGrath, of course.

OldSmoke, for your information, I already changed the year Dwyer died to 1946. It was a simple mistake, because 1946 was the actual year I had in my writen information.

Also, I have McGrath as passing away in 1963, and that comes straight from the FBI records I have.

Quit Smoking, It's bad for you.

Joy luck the IRISH, lol.

Not trying to start anything but all a mob group is is a gang, we are the ones who talk them up to be more than they really are, which is a gang of criminals. NJ i have asked this question to many different people including Rick Porrello but i have never got a answer that satisfied me, so i hope you can tell me since it is obvious you have done a lot of research for this subject. What or how much of a role did Danny Greene Jr. play in his fathers operations? The only answer i have ever got back was an email from Rick that said "not much, he was very young." But to this i say why is he included in the gang membership lists on the internet? Can you please tell me what role he played and if possible give me a source for this information? Thank you again, i love your chart, you spent a lot of time on it that is very easy to tell.

Figured i would show you what they are saying on realdeal:


Made Guy


Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:31 pm
Posts: 2364

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Very interesting/informative charts. Thanks for posting this.

_________________
Silence is often misinterpreted, but never misquoted.

Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:51 pm

DonnieBlack
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:49 pm
Posts: 873
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Why don't he post them here himself?

_________________
Want. Take. Simple.

Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:56 am

wiseguy
Made Guy


Joined: Wed Sep 13, 2006 7:14 pm
Posts: 14462
Location: Utah

Re: Irish Mob Charts
DonnieBlack wrote:
Why don't he post them here himself?


I don't think he has a membership here and the books are currently closed.

_________________
It's good to be in something from the ground floor. I came too late for that, I know. But lately I'm getting the feeling that I came in at the end. The best is over.

Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:44 am

DonnieBlack
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:49 pm
Posts: 873
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Irish Mob Charts
wiseguy wrote:
DonnieBlack wrote:
Why don't he post them here himself?


I don't think he has a membership here and the books are currently closed.


Oh yes, I forgot about the books being closed.

_________________
Want. Take. Simple.

Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:59 am

JIGGS
Made Guy


Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:55 pm
Posts: 2765

Re: Irish Mob Charts
This would be nice if it were a board game. But the organizational structure is so off on the NY based "groups." Some people just NEED there to be a boss of something with an official lieutenant, soldier, etc.

Tell NJBoy 55 there was no Spillaine Gang. Tom Devaney was not the #2, Eddie Cummiskey was not a lieutenant. Nor was James McManus, who was a local politician, a soldier in the Spillane organization.

Tell him to do research on a guy named Hugh Mulligan. He'll find some of these same people like Billy Beattie and Tommy McElroy running errands for him, along with being gofers for Spillane, Coonan, Richie Ryan, Mickey Featherstone, etc.

He left out some other kids. Dennis Curley, Tommy Moresco, Danny Quinn, Mike D'Amico, Ryan Leavitt, Raymond Steen, etc.

That whole thing about Sean Cummiskey and John Coonan III being the new leader of the Westies is internet mythology.Where are all the indictments on any of these reportedly active "Westies?"...


Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:18 pm

danielperrygin
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:56 pm
Posts: 291

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Awesome charts!

_________________
"I've brought trouble to every man who ever went one the line for me." ....."Good. That's what they get for trying to steal my girl"

Sat Mar 24, 2012 6:09 pm

danielperrygin
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:56 pm
Posts: 291

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Ive always wondered what part Danny Green Jr. played in his dads operations, anybody have any info on that?

_________________
"I've brought trouble to every man who ever went one the line for me." ....."Good. That's what they get for trying to steal my girl"

Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:21 pm

Dan
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 2:52 pm
Posts: 3008

Re: Irish Mob Charts
I agree with Jiggs, but chart is good, nice info on gangsters who were mostly Irish. Part I agree with Jiggs on is the structure, specifically New York list, these guys were mostly loose and on own, and hung together when they felt like it. Some were partners, but they had no structure.

Those New York West side Irish guys from 1970's and 1980's were mostly severe coke heads and alcoholics. Some were very dangerous, really nuts, rest were dangerous only when stoned.


Sun Mar 25, 2012 1:58 am

Ivan
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:51 am
Posts: 1651

Re: Irish Mob Charts
JIGGS wrote:
This would be nice if it were a board game. But the organizational structure is so off on the NY based "groups." Some people just NEED there to be a boss of something with an official lieutenant, soldier, etc.

Tell NJBoy 55 there was no Spillaine Gang. Tom Devaney was not the #2, Eddie Cummiskey was not a lieutenant. Nor was James McManus, who was a local politician, a soldier in the Spillane organization.

Tell him to do research on a guy named Hugh Mulligan. He'll find some of these same people like Billy Beattie and Tommy McElroy running errands for him, along with being gofers for Spillane, Coonan, Richie Ryan, Mickey Featherstone, etc.

He left out some other kids. Dennis Curley, Tommy Moresco, Danny Quinn, Mike D'Amico, Ryan Leavitt, Raymond Steen, etc.

That whole thing about Sean Cummiskey and John Coonan III being the new leader of the Westies is internet mythology.Where are all the indictments on any of these reportedly active "Westies?"...



Careful correcting that NJBoy fella; I have done so very politely and he fucking flipped out on me. It was real obscure shit about Youngstown and the North Side Mob in Chicago that I just happened to know so I figured I'd pass it on. He didn't take it very well for some reason.

Anyway, here are my adjustments for the North Side Mob chart that pissed him off.


Quote:
Some notes about the North Side gang:

Quote:
1. Dean "Dion" O' Banion (1910-1924) First boss, murdered in 1924.


Charles Reiser was the de facto boss of these guys before O'Banion.

Quote:
2. Earl "Hymie" Weiss (1910-1926) A lieutenant, murdered in 1926.


His real name was "Henry Earl Wojciechowski", and he was the boss when killed.

Quote:
4. George "Bugs" Moran (1910-1935) Second boss, became boss after Dion O' Banion was murdered in 1924, moved out of town in 1935.


His real name was Adelard Cunin. Hymie Weiss and Schemer Drucci preceded him as boss. He became boss after Drucci was killed by Detective Healy.

Quote:
5. Samuel "Nails" Morton (1910-1922) A soldier, murdered in 1922.


He was kicked in the head by a horse, not murdered. Then Louis Alterie whacked the horse.

Quote:
9. Frank "Tight Lips" Gusenburg (1914-1929) A tough Jewish soldier, murdered in 1929 at the St. Valentine's Day Massacre.
10. Peter Gusenberg (1914-1929) A tough Jewish soldier, brother of Frank Gusenberg, murdered in 1929 at the St Valentine's Day Massacre.


IIRC, the Gusenbergs were German-American, not Jewish, but don't hold me to that. I think Frank's mob nickname was "Hock", and the media came up with that "Tight Lips" thing after he refused to talk following the St. Valentine's Day massacre, but don't hold me to that, either.

Quote:
13. Ted Newburry (1919-1933) A lieutenant, murdered in 1933.


Newberry also defected to the Outfit.

Quote:
14. Albert "Gorilla Al" Weinshank (1920-1929) A soldier, murdered in 1929 at the St. Valentine's Day Massacre.


His real last name was Weinshenker, FWIW.

Also, only a small fraction of the North Siders were Irish-American. It was a multiethnic mob that has come to be (somewhat incorrectly) identified as an "Irish Mob" due to the prominence of O'Banion and the mistaken belief that Moran was Irish (he was, believe it or not, French). I think Ragen's Colts (under the leadership of Ralph Sheldon) might have been the biggest full-blown "Irish Mob" in Chicago at the time.



Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:40 pm

Pogo the Clown
Made Guy


Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:23 pm
Posts: 15435

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Didn't Newberry succeed Moran as Boss of the gang for a breif period in the early 30s?


Pogo

_________________
It's those big tits.

Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:22 am

Ivan
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:51 am
Posts: 1651

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Pogo the Clown wrote:
Didn't Newberry succeed Moran as Boss of the gang for a breif period in the early 30s?


Yes and no.

He defected to Capone in 1930 around the time of the Lingle fiasco and was appointed head of rackets that were taken away from Moran after the massacre. Also appointed as overseer of these rackets was Gus Winkeler, who is believed to have been the driver for St. Valentine's Day Massacre killers.

So he took over North Side rackets from Moran and was his "successor" in that respect, but as a part of the Outfit under Capone and then under Nitti until he was murdered in 1933. Winkeler was killed later that same year. I think they were replaced by whoever the first Italian North Side Outfit capo was (Ross Prio? not sure...). Moran remained the official and last boss of the North Side Mob until it sort faded away in the mid-1930s.


Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:46 am

Pogo the Clown
Made Guy


Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:23 pm
Posts: 15435

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Thanks for the info. Do you know how many members the North Siders had at their peak?


Pogo

_________________
It's those big tits.

Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:51 am

Ivan
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 1:51 am
Posts: 1651

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Pogo the Clown wrote:
Do you know how many members the North Siders had at their peak?


No idea. I've never seen a total membership figure cited. I know of about 25-30 specific individuals who were IDed as members, but other than those guys I don't know about any other members.

BTW, do you know who the first Italian North Side boss was? The one who I think took over the area under Nitti.


Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:59 am

Pogo the Clown
Made Guy


Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 10:23 pm
Posts: 15435

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Ivan wrote:
BTW, do you know who the first Italian North Side boss was? The one who I think took over the area under Nitti.



The earliest one that I know about is Lawrence "Dago" Mangano. Thanks for the info on the North Siders.


Pogo

_________________
It's those big tits.

Tue Apr 03, 2012 8:18 am

ChefB12
Made Guy

Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 7:07 pm
Posts: 237
Location: Brooklyn

Re: Irish Mob Charts
32. Michael "White Mike" McArdle (2002-Pr) A soldier, living in Quincy, reported to be still active


He is a fictional character from the The Wire season 2.


Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:41 am

danielperrygin
Made Guy


Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:56 pm
Posts: 291

Re: Irish Mob Charts
Danny Greene Jr.? Anybody?

_________________

haha This should be very interesting. Getting my popcorn ready.

Love your charts! I like to see charts and other info on the Irish Mob. You don't see too much out there.

Actually, his charts on New York are spot on. I grew up in HK. Danny Green Jr. was indeed a member of the Celtic Club, but was not a heavy guy of course, he wasn't that old.

Found an insert from Rick's book. It says he stayed close to his dad while he was conducting business around town and watched the car.

Daniel, thanks for your nice comments regarding my charts. I also thank you for letting me know about Ivan talking trash about me in another forum. Especially a forum that's private that people who aren't members can't see. I thought me and him let it go and things were cool. About the dude from RD who said Michael McArdle's on the wire and a fictional charecter, that's true, but there's also the Winter Hill guy with the same name. He should have did a google search with his name and the town of Quincy next to his name, and he'd notice there is quite a few things on line about the man, and that he has a brother named James. I'm sure he got his nickname as a joke. About Sean Cummisky (son of Eddie), I don't have the guy on my NY charts.

Also, they did start calling it the Spillane Gang after the death of McGrath. Thanks to all the people that gave me props, it shows you have respect. Ciao!!!

NJBoy55,

A few comments and corrections with regards to Celtic Club members and Danny Greene, Jr.

1) Brian O'Donnell is alive and well and living out in California.

2) Keith Ritson, not just a Golden Gloves boxer but Champ, not murdered in 1982 but on 11/16/78 (date of disappearance). Body recovered in 1982 when Zagaria turned informant, who is in the Cleveland area and has been.

3) Danny Greene, Jr. living a quite, obscure life in Cleveland area who does not support book, movie or notoriety. Also, there are five children (2 boys, three girls) not just one son.

4) Ronnie Carrabia deceased.

2) Keith Ritson, not just a Golden Gloves boxer but Champ, not murdered in 1982 but on 11/16/78 (date of disappearance). Body recovered in 1982 when Zagaria turned informant, who is in the Cleveland area and has been.

3) Danny Greene, Jr. living a quite, obscure life in Cleveland area who does not support book, movie or notoriety. Also, there are five children (2 boys, three girls) not just one son.

4) Ronnie Carrabia deceased.





If I wanted to flood my page about the life stories of these guys I would have did it. I just added a little bit of info about them. What's your point? Also, you're wrong about the year Ritson died. However, he was shot and wounded on the date you have. I didn't post all of Danny Greene's kids because they were not members of his gang.

NJBoy55,

So, so wrong about year. I don't know where you get your facts at but it was 1978 not 1982. You seem to take issue when people try to inform and/or correct you with the true and accurate information. Do your homework. My point, don't be ubersensitive if someone questions your knowledge of something, especially if they know for a fact it is not true.

He is still alive. Lives next door to his son in Sarasota, IIRC. Orland is still alive as well.

Charlie the Crab is dead, however.

Ivan,

My bad, confused him with Ferrito. Apology extended.

Heheh, no need to apologize, it's easy to get this stuff mixed up.

I tried to correct this clown earlier in this topic about danny's son, and how involved he was. I knew danny personally, as well as his son. His son, for the 100th time, wasn't involved to the extent of having ANY major pull in danny's group. It;s more a case of guilty by association. NJBOY says he has "sources" that confirm this, nevermind the fact that he stole this directly from rick's book. I know rick as well, as he knows pretty much everyone left in the Cleveland area, I know his family, and I'm am such a fossil that as a young boy i remember his great uncle Joe, his other 4 great uncles, and his grandfather ray. So I'm a little confused on who NJBOY knows in the cleveland area, outside of what i know.

You are right Ivan. I will agree with you on that. Cleveland, take a hike. Let's not use name calling. If you don't like my info, that's your problem.

I dont like your "info" because it's inaccurate. You created these charts as if you had done business with these guys in the past and used your "sources" to do your due diligence. The main problem i have is that you took information from a guy that did his due diligence, you tried to use it as your own, and then rely on it as fact when, in fact, the original source (rick p) never had danny's son as an "official crew member". That's the problem i have. Especially when the kid is a good kid, and has to live his life extremely under the radar because of people like you think he was involved to an extent of which he wasn't.

Rick did add Greene Jr. was a member of his father's crew in his book and I posted that info earlier. This ain't the Real Deal, they don't go for name calling here. Have some respect. You can disagree with me if you want. That's your right, but to call me names and disrespect me is another issue.

in Rick's book is says he was a driver and occastionally ran errands. I use facts, you use opinion and misinformation. For that reason, i have called you a clown. How old are you, 15? you can't take the fact that you have used opinion and misinformation, and then you cry that i called you a clown? I wouldn't call that "name calling" and it certainly doesn't have a negative connotation as opposed to other words that can be used.
Disrespect you? You mean disrespect in the sense that you have spewed false information about a good kid, and then you cry about me disrespecting your opinion? Get a life.

You and your friend Carmela could kick rocks. Stay far away from my posts. FYI, I'm not this person you think I am named MobFan or Kenji. You and her have too much time on your hands trying to investigate people like you do. Please don't lie, you have to be connected to Carmela.

what are we all doing here? we are investigating and furthering our knowledge on a particular lifestyle. That is the reason this board and website exsists. So when someone like you puts up information that is innacurate and based on nothing, and the other half of your information was stolen from a legit source and twisted so that you could make a "list" i feel it's not only my right, but others' right, to correct it so that everyone can have an accurate portrayal of what the real information is. It happens in almost every single topic on this board.

So now you say "i have too much time on my hands, Im in my upper 80's and retired so yes. You say I'm trying to investigate "people", like you. Well, yes, I'm trying to educate poeple on the action and situation in cleveland, past and present. So that when "people", like you, who have innacurate information, come on here and try to spew lies, the other "people" on this board who want accurate information can see whats's really going on.

If you're on here saying these things about good people, I can only imagine what's going on over at Real Deal. Maybe I should be on Real Deal as well to seperate fact from fiction.

Cut it out, Boy. Leave the poison in the one thread you started about fellow members with whom you don't already get along. DO NOT cross-pollinate these threads with your bullshit.

I personally don't care with whom you don't get along (and that list seems to be getting longer) but you're not going to ruin the integrity of these forums with your accusations.

Get it??

SC,

I have the utmost respect for you, Turnball and the other operators of this forum that I love very much. So help me God, I'm not starting a confrontation or being rude with anybody here. As far as this computer toughguy, he came on here attacking me and accusing me of being a liar, and called me a "clown," which is technically against the rules of this wonderful forum that I've enjoyed for a long time now. This individual was being completely irrational. He also won't reason with me. I am going to let this whole issue between him, Carmela and me go, and if I receive anymore disrespectful posts from these two, I will not say anything back because It's not worth my time. I have contributed a lot to this forum and don't want anything to deter me from using it. I'm very sorry if I made you upset, but know that I am not starting the trouble. Have a great night. Grazie en mi dispiace. (NJBoy)

Cut the crap, NJBoy. You're far from innocent here. You yell about wanting respect but don't show any to others. Stop this nonsense... just stop it!!

I've been a follower of Gangster BB for awhile but never commented. After reading some of the comments questioning NJBoy55 I decided I need to leave a comment, so here it it is:

I have to say after reviewing some of NJBoy55's charts and other posts he seems very accurate. Not one to pull $hit out of his you know what. Does his homework.

Is he as argumentative in real life as he is here on the boards?

S.C. "Knock..Knock..."