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Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats #539077
04/28/09 03:11 PM
04/28/09 03:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,384
Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou Offline OP
Just Lou  Offline OP

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Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats

(AP)

WASHINGTON — Veteran Republican Sen. Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania abruptly switched parties Tuesday, a move intended to boost his re-election chances that also pushed Democrats within one seat of a 60-vote filibuster-resistant majority.

At a news conference, Specter said his switch to the Democratic Party was a "painful decision," but he found himself increasingly at odds with a Republican Party that has moved to the right.

The Pennsylvania lawmaker said his philosophy was more in line with the Democratic Party. He said in the last few months he surveyed the sentiments of the GOP and found prospects for winning next year's primary looked bleak.

Specter faced a tough challenge from former GOP foe Pat Toomey.

Specter stunned Capitol Hill with word that he would switch parties. At the news conference, he told Democrats that he won't be an automatic 60th vote. He said he will follow his own approach to legislating.

President Barack Obama called Specter almost immediately after he was informed of the switch to say the Democratic Party was "thrilled to have you," according to a White House official.

Spurned Republicans said his defection was motivated by ambition, not principle.

Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele said, "Let's be honest: Senator Specter didn't leave the GOP based on principles of any kind. He left to further his personal political interests because he knew that he was going to lose a Republican primary due to his left-wing voting record. Republicans look forward to beating Senator Specter in 2010, assuming the Democrats don't do it first."

Specter, 79 and in his fifth term, is one of a handful of Republican moderates remaining in Congress in a party now dominated by conservatives. Several officials said secret talks that preceded his decision reached into the White House, involving both Obama and Vice President Joseph Biden, a longtime colleague in the Senate. Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell as well as Democratic leaders in Congress also were involved.

With Specter, Democrats would have 59 Senate seats. Democrat Al Franken is ahead in a marathon recount in Minnesota, and if he ultimately wins his race against Republican Norm Coleman, he would become the party's 60th vote. That is the number needed to overcome a filibuster.

Specter faced an extraordinarily difficult re-election challenge in his home state in 2010, having first to confront a challenge from his right in the Republican primary before pivoting to a general election campaign against a Democrat in a state that has trended increasingly Democratic in recent elections. Former Rep. Pat Toomey, whom Specter defeated in a close primary race in 2004, is expected to run again.

Specter has acknowledged in recent months that in order to win a sixth term, he would need the support of thousands of Pennsylvania Republicans who sided with Obama in last fall's presidential election.

"I am unwilling to have my twenty-nine year Senate record judged by the Pennsylvania Republican primary electorate," he said in the statement.

Asked by a reporter what he had to say to his constituents, Specter replied with a smile, "I don't have to say anything to them. They said it to me."

Specter has long been an independent Republican, and he proved it most recently when he became one of only three members of the GOP in Congress to vote for Obama's economic stimulus legislation. Then, he proved it once more, pivoting not long afterward to say he did not support legislation making it easier to form unions, a bill that is organized labor's top priority in the current Congress.

In Pennsylvania, the chairman of the state Republican Party, Rob Gleason, said that Specter should offer a refund to Republicans who have helped fatten his war chest, which totaled $5.8 million at the end of 2008. "He should give them the option," Gleason said.

Even before Gleason made his comments, Specter announced he would return donations he has received this election cycle "upon request."

Specter has long been one of the most durable politicians of either party in Pennsylvania. In recent years, he has battled Hodgkin's disease, a cancer of the lymphatic system, but maintains a busy schedule that includes daily games of squash.

As one of the most senior Republicans in the Senate, Specter held powerful positions on the Judiciary and Appropriations committees. It was not clear how Democrats would calculate his seniority in assigning committee perches.

As recently as late winter, he was asked by a reporter why he had not taken Democrats up on past offers to switch parties.

"Because I am a Republican," he said at the time.

"I welcome Sen. Specter and his moderate voice to our diverse caucus," Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said in a statement.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Just Lou] #539081
04/28/09 03:36 PM
04/28/09 03:36 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
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Pennsylvania
klydon1 Offline
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Specter would have lost the 2010 primary as a Republican despite having served 5 terms. He will likely win the Democratic primary and will probably run, unopposed.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: klydon1] #539082
04/28/09 04:40 PM
04/28/09 04:40 PM
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OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
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I hope he loses the 2010 election as a Dem. I just wonder what the Whitehouse and the other Dems offered him to switch?

There goes the system of checks and balances.


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Mignon] #539085
04/28/09 05:08 PM
04/28/09 05:08 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,384
Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou Offline OP
Just Lou  Offline OP

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They probably didn't have to offer him anything. As klydon pointed out, his best chance of getting re-elected is as a Dem, and he knows that.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Mignon] #539086
04/28/09 05:10 PM
04/28/09 05:10 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
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New York
Sicilian Babe Offline
Sicilian Babe  Offline

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New York
Originally Posted By: Mignon
There goes the system of checks and balances.


What does this have to do with the system of checks and balances? confused


President Emeritus of the Neal Pulcawer Fan Club
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Mignon] #539090
04/28/09 06:01 PM
04/28/09 06:01 PM
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East Tennessee
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ronnierocketAGO Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mignon
I hope he loses the 2010 election as a Dem. I just wonder what the Whitehouse and the other Dems offered him to switch?


Probably:

*A committee chairmanship or high seniority, if he had been a Dem all this time instead of a GOPer.
*Promised national/state money/support in 2010, and this especially from Rendell, VP Biden, the President, etc.
*A chance to electorally seek to keep his seat, and a good shot of winning against a super conservative like Toomey.

Originally Posted By: Mignon

There goes the system of checks and balances.


Remember when the GOP had total control of Congress 2003-2007?

Don't be so doomsday on us. Besides, the national Democratic Party has the country's political centre ("Blue Dogs") and again, Specter sees the handwriting on the wall.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: ronnierocketAGO] #539092
04/28/09 06:08 PM
04/28/09 06:08 PM
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BAM_233 Offline
Underboss
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is he the guy who rubbed the undercover offercer foot in the stalls?

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: ronnierocketAGO] #539094
04/28/09 06:10 PM
04/28/09 06:10 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
Mama Mig

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Yes I see it as doom. I don't feel either party should have total control.


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Mignon] #539095
04/28/09 06:16 PM
04/28/09 06:16 PM
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Texas
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olivant Offline
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I'm not sure what you mean by total control. Total control of what? Congressional committees have almost an equal number of Democrats and Republicans populating them. Passage of bills in either chamber still requires a majority vote.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: olivant] #539097
04/28/09 06:24 PM
04/28/09 06:24 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
Mama Mig

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I must be confused. Don't the Dems have the majority of votes?


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Just Lou] #539099
04/28/09 06:31 PM
04/28/09 06:31 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 22,902
New York
SC Offline
Consigliere
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Fucking politicians have the same allegiance as today's ballplayers. None.

Whatever happened to a lifelong association?

They're all fucking whores.


.
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: SC] #539100
04/28/09 06:32 PM
04/28/09 06:32 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Longneck Offline
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In a van down by the river!
Originally Posted By: SC


They're all fucking whores.


A politician is just like a prostitute. They'll take your money and you'll get screwed.




Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: olivant] #539103
04/28/09 06:43 PM
04/28/09 06:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,384
Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou Offline OP
Just Lou  Offline OP

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Originally Posted By: olivant
I'm not sure what you mean by total control. Total control of what? Congressional committees have almost an equal number of Democrats and Republicans populating them. Passage of bills in either chamber still requires a majority vote.


Cloture - The only procedure by which the Senate can vote to place a time limit on consideration of a bill or other matter, and thereby overcome a filibuster. Under the cloture rule (Rule XXII), the Senate may limit consideration of a pending matter to 30 additional hours, but only by vote of three-fifths of the full Senate, normally 60 votes. Cloture under the Senate rules means that a bill can’t get to the floor unless 60 Senators vote for it.

With 60 votes, the Dems can do as they like without any Republican support.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: SC] #539105
04/28/09 07:02 PM
04/28/09 07:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
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Originally Posted By: SC
Fucking politicians have the same allegiance as today's ballplayers. None.

Whatever happened to a lifelong association?

They're all fucking whores.


clap clap


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Mignon] #539135
04/28/09 09:50 PM
04/28/09 09:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Turnbull Online content
Turnbull  Online Content

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AZ
Specter was the staff director for the Warren Commission. He's probably the only person associated with the Kennedy assassination who's still alive.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Turnbull] #539138
04/28/09 09:55 PM
04/28/09 09:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 3,745
BAM_233 Offline
Underboss
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fucking one bullet theory

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Just Lou] #539142
04/28/09 10:27 PM
04/28/09 10:27 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,020
Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
O

Joined: Feb 2003
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Originally Posted By: Just Lou
Originally Posted By: olivant
I'm not sure what you mean by total control. Total control of what? Congressional committees have almost an equal number of Democrats and Republicans populating them. Passage of bills in either chamber still requires a majority vote.


Cloture - The only procedure by which the Senate can vote to place a time limit on consideration of a bill or other matter, and thereby overcome a filibuster. Under the cloture rule (Rule XXII), the Senate may limit consideration of a pending matter to 30 additional hours, but only by vote of three-fifths of the full Senate, normally 60 votes. Cloture under the Senate rules means that a bill can’t get to the floor unless 60 Senators vote for it.

With 60 votes, the Dems can do as they like without any Republican support.


Not true Lou. You should read all of the Congress' rules, especially those of the Senate. What you cited was Cloture to close off a Filibuster. Nothing else. There are Unaninmous Consent Agreements and Holds for example in the Senate which an objection by one Senator can stop in its tracks.

Mig's statement was about total control of the Congress. That betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of the compromise that is necessary in the Congress. It's a vast oversimplification to state otherwise.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Just Lou] #539143
04/28/09 10:51 PM
04/28/09 10:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145
East Tennessee
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ronnierocketAGO Offline
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Originally Posted By: Just Lou
Originally Posted By: olivant
I'm not sure what you mean by total control. Total control of what? Congressional committees have almost an equal number of Democrats and Republicans populating them. Passage of bills in either chamber still requires a majority vote.


Cloture - The only procedure by which the Senate can vote to place a time limit on consideration of a bill or other matter, and thereby overcome a filibuster. Under the cloture rule (Rule XXII), the Senate may limit consideration of a pending matter to 30 additional hours, but only by vote of three-fifths of the full Senate, normally 60 votes. Cloture under the Senate rules means that a bill can’t get to the floor unless 60 Senators vote for it.

With 60 votes, the Dems can do as they like without any Republican support.


Yup, as soon as the Minnesota shit is cleared up and Franken gets seated.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: ronnierocketAGO] #539144
04/28/09 10:52 PM
04/28/09 10:52 PM
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East Tennessee
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ronnierocketAGO Offline
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BTW, what irony...Mr. Specter back in 2001 proposed a (never-enacted) rule to limit party-switching.

grin

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: olivant] #539145
04/28/09 11:22 PM
04/28/09 11:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,384
Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou Offline OP
Just Lou  Offline OP

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Originally Posted By: olivant


Not true Lou. You should read all of the Congress' rules, especially those of the Senate. What you cited was Cloture to close off a Filibuster. Nothing else. There are Unaninmous Consent Agreements and Holds for example in the Senate which an objection by one Senator can stop in its tracks.


So you believe that a Democratic Supermajority Senate, unfettered by filibusters, can be stopped by the objection of 1 Republican Senator?

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democr [Re: Just Lou] #539146
04/28/09 11:55 PM
04/28/09 11:55 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
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Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
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Texas
Lou, you paraphrased one Senate rule among a plethora of them. Read some more of them and you will understand the compromise that is necessary to pass legislation and resolutions as I referred to in my previous post.

I'm not sure what you mean by "a Democratic Supermajority Senate, unfettered by filibusters, can be stopped." A supermajority doing what? Congressional activity does not consist only of voting. For example, study the Congressional committee system. Nothing happens to legislation unless it first receives a favorable report by the committee to which it is assigned. Such a favorable report is almost always a function of a compromise among the committee's members. Doing so will alert you to the complexity that characterizes Congressional politics.

To answer your question, yes I do. That's why there are a legion of rules in the Congress. Otherwise, Congressional action would primarily consist of a vote. Why do you think that legislation typically takes so long to weave its way through the Congress? The Senate Cloture rule (and it is just a rule subject to change) is dependent on 2 Independent Senators supporting a Democratic Cloture vote (by the way, Franken has not yet been admitted to the Senate). It also depends on all Democratic Senators voting with their Party colleagues. Democratic Senator Bayh, for one, may not since he's already shown his independence by breaking Party ranks over the President's budget.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Just Lou] #539150
04/29/09 07:50 AM
04/29/09 07:50 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,716
Graveyard
The Iceman Offline
Official BB Hitman
The Iceman  Offline
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Underboss
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Graveyard
That turncoat the last thing this country needs is a filibuster proof senate. Especially with the democrats in charge. sick

The article didn't mention it but this isn't the first time that the Benedict Arnold has switched parties. He did so back in 1967.


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: The Iceman] #539153
04/29/09 08:30 AM
04/29/09 08:30 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
Mama Mig

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Like I said before, I hope he loses his seat.


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: The Iceman] #539175
04/29/09 02:22 PM
04/29/09 02:22 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145
East Tennessee
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ronnierocketAGO Offline
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Originally Posted By: The Iceman
That turncoat the last thing this country needs is a filibuster proof senate. Especially with the democrats in charge. sick

The article didn't mention it but this isn't the first time that the Benedict Arnold has switched parties. He did so back in 1967.


Mate, if the GOP national establishment had been supporting Specter publicly and financially within that primary instead of sitting on the fence after the Stimulus package, maybe he would have stayed in the GOP.

and not help provide filibuster-proofing.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: ronnierocketAGO] #539177
04/29/09 02:46 PM
04/29/09 02:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
Mama Mig

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Originally Posted By: ronnierocketAGO

Mate, if the GOP national establishment had been supporting Specter publicly and financially within that primary instead of sitting on the fence after the Stimulus package, maybe he would have stayed in the GOP.

and not help provide filibuster-proofing.


Does anybody have a tissue? Aw the poor guy got his feelings hurt. Let's have a pity party 1-2-3 AWWW


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: Mignon] #539206
04/29/09 09:37 PM
04/29/09 09:37 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 25,984
California
The Italian Stallionette Offline
The Italian Stallionette  Offline

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California
I have to admit, I am kind of enjoying all this shock over Specter's decision. Let's see, once Franken is finally in that makes what? 60? lol

Seriously, I don't think Specter is gonna be easily swayed one way or another. What I don't get is, at his age why the hell does he want to keep working? I'd be retired for 20 years by his age.

TIS


"Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind. War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today." JFK

"War is over, if you want it" - John Lennon

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: The Italian Stallionette] #539209
04/29/09 10:14 PM
04/29/09 10:14 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Mignon Offline
Mama Mig
Mignon  Offline
Mama Mig

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 19,066
OH, VA, KY
Originally Posted By: The Italian Stallionette
What I don't get is, at his age why the hell does he want to keep working? I'd be retired for 20 years by his age.TIS


I agree with you TIS. What is he 79? I'd retire and get the hell out of DC.

BTW Why is taking so long to count those votes?


Dylan Matthew Moran born 10/30/12


Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: The Italian Stallionette] #539215
04/29/09 10:52 PM
04/29/09 10:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 11,797
Pennsylvania
klydon1 Offline
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Pennsylvania
Originally Posted By: The Italian Stallionette

Seriously, I don't think Specter is gonna be easily swayed one way or another. What I don't get is, at his age why the hell does he want to keep working? I'd be retired for 20 years by his age.

TIS


That's true. The change in party affiliation will have absolutely no effect on how he would vote. His ideology has been constant throughout his tenure in the Senate. He'll certainly be no rubber stamp for Obama.

In past elections I've voted against him. Assuming he wins the 2010 Dem. primary, I'll have to see who's running against him (possibly Toomey or former US Senator Rick Santorum) before I decide.

Specter is an opportunist, but he has serious health issues as he's battled cancer.

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: klydon1] #539218
04/29/09 11:34 PM
04/29/09 11:34 PM
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Posts: 25,984
California
The Italian Stallionette Offline
The Italian Stallionette  Offline

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California
Wasn't it pretty close (poll-wise) between Specter and Toomey? I don't really know Toomey but I thought some predicted that Toomey stood a good chance of winning. confused

Yea, Specter has had and beaten cancer twice (I think). Man, hat's something isn't it?



TIS


"Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind. War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today." JFK

"War is over, if you want it" - John Lennon

Re: Specter says he's switching from GOP to Democrats [Re: The Italian Stallionette] #539223
04/30/09 12:53 AM
04/30/09 12:53 AM
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East Tennessee
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ronnierocketAGO Offline
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Originally Posted By: The Italian Stallionette
Wasn't it pretty close (poll-wise) between Specter and Toomey? I don't really know Toomey but I thought some predicted that Toomey stood a good chance of winning. confused

Yea, Specter has had and beaten cancer twice (I think). Man, hat's something isn't it?



TIS


Specter's problem was that in 2004, he barely beat Toomey by slim. But all those moderate GOPers who felt Toomey was an electoral loser, they all left to join the Democratic Party within the state, so Specter was screwed.

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