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Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: alicecooper] #1064413
07/20/23 06:20 AM
07/20/23 06:20 AM
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Originally Posted by alicecooper
Since Casino is the subject, the guy in the grocery store always batching about keeping records of his expenses cracks me up every time.

I'll hit da two of em in da backada head wid a fuckin shovel. Ma! I'm sorry


Same thoughts here, the scene is hilarious lol lol


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: Toodoped] #1064423
07/20/23 12:13 PM
07/20/23 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Toodoped
Originally Posted by Big_Tuna93
Murray Humphries is absolutely fascinating. I never really gave him his credit as he wasnt italian, so i always doubted his stature in the organization. As I've spent more time on this forum, I must say Sam Giancana is so intriguing. That guys life was something else.


If it wasnt for Humphreys, there wasnt going to be any Bruno Roti Sr or Frank Ferraro or Gus Alex. We have info regarding Humphreys "bashing" some high level CN members like Cerone or Skids Caruso. He was their main "teacher". The Outfits non-Italian crew was something else, and they had a official seat on Chicago's round table with their own vote, even regarding on who was going to be the new CN Chi boss.

As for Giancana...he was more Americanized than Capone and didnt care much about the Italian stuff. Or as Angelo Bruno once said that Giancana worked with everyone and also made money for everyone. And again as a reminder, Giancana didnt understand Italian and was making faces during commission meetings. Again, Giancana is the main example of a completely Americanized Italian mobster and thats why he and his predecessors never had a problem with the non-Italians having a seat on their own "commission".


Jack Guzik seemed to be very important inthe founding of the non-Italian crew.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: Hollander] #1064472
07/21/23 02:31 AM
07/21/23 02:31 AM
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At the time Capone came to Chicago (ca. 1919) Guzik was Torrio's right hand man and chief political fixer. Torrio put Capone under him and the two became inseperable. The only man Capone killed with his own hand in Chcago was Joe Howard, who had slapped Guzik around. Guzik and Ricca ran the Outfit after Capone went to prison, and he and Accardo were joined at the hip later.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: Turnbull] #1064474
07/21/23 02:59 AM
07/21/23 02:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Hollander


Jack Guzik seemed to be very important inthe founding of the non-Italian crew.

]


Thats right @H. As you already said, when Capone became the new representative for the Chicago Mafia, he obviously gave Guzik and the non-Italian group their on seat on the Outfit's board of directors. Which means we can consider Guzik as the "founder" of that same seat or official position which was followed by a line of succession, with Guzik as the first rep

Btw, also thanks for the pics.


Originally Posted by Turnbull
At the time Capone came to Chicago (ca. 1919) Guzik was Torrio's right hand man and chief political fixer. Torrio put Capone under him and the two became inseperable. The only man Capone killed with his own hand in Chcago was Joe Howard, who had slapped Guzik around. Guzik and Ricca ran the Outfit after Capone went to prison, and he and Accardo were joined at the hip later.


I agree @TB regarding Guzik and his brothers being around since the Torrio days, obviously because his father Max Guzik was around way before them and was involved with Colosimo in the prostitution racket and also worked as precinct captain for old time Chicago's political crime bosses Coughlin and Kenna, who in turn belonged to the first and original Irish mob that completely ruled Chicago during those days. Max Guzik was Jewish immigrant born in 1855 in Poland and arrived in Chicago’s Lawndale area sometime around the early 1890’s or to be exact in 1892. So it is possible that it was for Max Guzik who brought his three sons into the "Life". Max also had a fourth son who I believe was the oldest and went by the name of Charles Guzik.

Besides his three sons Harry, Sam and Jake, other of Max Guzik's close associates and crew members were Charlie and Julius Maibaum, Leo Bernstein, Jack Colvin, Al Harris, Frank Lewis and Isadore Levine who I think was related to one of Jake Guzik's future top lieutenants Hymie Levine. Their main areas of operations at the time were located around Ogden Av, Lawndale, the Levee and around the South Side, obviously with the backing of aldermen Kenna and Coughlin.

The situation was the same with the Greek Alex family, meaning it was for their father who brought his three sons into the rackets. One of the three sons Gus Alex belonged to the non-Italian line of succession, meaning he became the new boss in 1965 when he succeeded the late Humphreys who in turn previously succeeded Guzik back in 1955/56.



He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: blacksheep] #1064477
07/21/23 05:28 AM
07/21/23 05:28 AM
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Thanks Toodoped, at his funeral the people of the Jewish Cemetery had never seen so many Italians in attendance.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: blacksheep] #1064627
07/22/23 01:26 AM
07/22/23 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Hollander
Thanks Toodoped, at his funeral the people of the Jewish Cemetery had never seen so many Italians in attendance.


Thats right. Back in the old days the top Italian leadership often paid their last respects when some of non-Italian bosses died. Besides Guzik's funeral, Claude Maddox's funeral was also visited by members of the top Italian leadership. Even when Alex's dad passed away (Nick Alex), again some high level members of the Italian faction were also present.

For example, besides all the publicity which they received at the time and also the alleged "rule" not to show up very often on gangster funerals, still out of respect Maddox's funeral was visited by many high profile figures including Paul Ricca, Tony Accardo, Sam Giancana, Joey Aiuppa, Robert Ansani, Frank Ferraro, Gus Alex and Fifke Corngold, among many others. These guys were obliged to show respect and so they respected the gangster code, obviously because the late Maddox used to be one of the originals.


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: blacksheep] #1064662
07/22/23 11:39 AM
07/22/23 11:39 AM
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Jake Guzik lived a long life for that time period (70 years old at his death) especially considered he was in the middle of things at a very dangerous time, the 1920's.

Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: jace] #1064690
07/22/23 05:05 PM
07/22/23 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jace
Jake Guzik lived a long life for that time period (70 years old at his death) especially considered he was in the middle of things at a very dangerous time, the 1920's.


Thats right and I agree 100%.

In fact, Guzik went through two quite dangerous conflicts. One being during the days of Prohibition, and the second conflict during the 1940s, which was again against the North Side mob and also again, Guzik was still at the top together with the Fischettis and Accardo, since the previous top leadership was in jail at the time (Ricca, Campagna, D'Andrea etc.). Guzik was again part of the group which managed to defend the throne from the old "Northsiders" for the second time. Although I think that during the early 1940s he was once allegedly kidnapped by someone. Some sources say that it was the rising younger generation, while I personally suspect that it was the rival North Side crew. Legend goes that Guzik allegedly paid off his kidnappers.


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: blacksheep] #1064714
07/23/23 03:30 AM
07/23/23 03:30 AM
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... in addition, the Guzik family was very rich and according to one informant, after Guzik's death, his protege Gus Alex allegedly extorted Guzik's family members, mainly because Alex was allegedly stronger than Guzik while the old man was still alive. I personally DO NOT believe in the story, mainly because we have info that Guzik was quite respected and acted as Alex mentor for many years, and so I dont think that Alex was able to do something like that. I think if Alex ever tried something like that, he was probably going to get whacked on either Ricca's, Accardo's or Humphreys' orders. Anyways its up to you guys to decide on whats true and whats not in this particular story and so heres the file...

[Linked Image]



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Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: Toodoped] #1064730
07/23/23 11:49 AM
07/23/23 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Toodoped
Originally Posted by jace
Jake Guzik lived a long life for that time period (70 years old at his death) especially considered he was in the middle of things at a very dangerous time, the 1920's.


Thats right and I agree 100%.

In fact, Guzik went through two quite dangerous conflicts. One being during the days of Prohibition, and the second conflict during the 1940s, which was again against the North Side mob and also again, Guzik was still at the top together with the Fischettis and Accardo, since the previous top leadership was in jail at the time (Ricca, Campagna, D'Andrea etc.). Guzik was again part of the group which managed to defend the throne from the old "Northsiders" for the second time. Although I think that during the early 1940s he was once allegedly kidnapped by someone. Some sources say that it was the rising younger generation, while I personally suspect that it was the rival North Side crew. Legend goes that Guzik allegedly paid off his kidnappers.



Thank you Toodoped. I knew that the made it though the roaring 20's and all those era's wars, but I had never heard of the 1940's conflicts or his kidnapping.

Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: jace] #1064733
07/23/23 03:21 PM
07/23/23 03:21 PM
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Guzik's brother, Harry, was famous (infamous actually) in his own right:
A young girl, who became known as "The Damsel in Distress," threw a note from a window in one of Harry's brothels, claiming she was being held against her will. This led to passage of the Mann Act, which made it a federal crime to transport underage girls across state lines for "immoral purposes." Probably the most famous man convicted under the Mann Act was Chuck Berry, who served almost two years in prison on that rap.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Question about the Casino movie [Re: Turnbull] #1064740
07/23/23 05:19 PM
07/23/23 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jace

Thank you Toodoped. I knew that the made it though the roaring 20's and all those era's wars, but I had never heard of the 1940's conflicts or his kidnapping.


No problem @Jace. Yup, Guzik played a major role during the 1940's when the Outfit's leadership was most vulnerable, by having many of his Jewish and non-Italian underlings being involved in the second conflict as killers, and also as corruptors regarding the early releases of the bosses. In fact, Guzik was also the prime player in taking over the race wires during that same period. Btw, here's one of Guzik's statements from that same era which I always find it funny, although it was very true....you see, in 1946 Guzik was arrested and taken for questioning and the cops wanted for Guzik to take a lie detector, and so the old gangster replied:

Captain, what’s the use of kidding ourselves?! If I took a lie test, 30 of the biggest men in Chicago would be diving out of high story windows and I’d have to hit myself in the head


Originally Posted by Turnbull
Guzik's brother, Harry, was famous (infamous actually) in his own right:
A young girl, who became known as "The Damsel in Distress," threw a note from a window in one of Harry's brothels, claiming she was being held against her will. This led to passage of the Mann Act, which made it a federal crime to transport underage girls across state lines for "immoral purposes." Probably the most famous man convicted under the Mann Act was Chuck Berry, who served almost two years in prison on that rap.


That's right @TB. It was assistant state attorney Clifford Roe who investigated Harry Guzik and his brothels, and he also asked for help from Washington D.C. so he can make a move on the vice trade, and he did it. Years later Harry Guzik also had a cancer which was removed from his throat and he used some type of small microphone which he used for talking. One of Harry's most famous brothels from the old days was named “The Blue Goose” at 119th and Paulina Street, and Harry allegedly managed the joint together with his wife Alma. It is interesting to note that some of these guys who were all connected, such as the Colosimos, the Guziks etc. had their wives also involved in the rackets. Colosimos wife, Victoria Moresco, was also involved in the prostitution racket together with her two brothers. Back in the days, from that same era, I also found one female with last name "Torrio" who was also involved in the rackets but I wasnt able to connect her to John Torrio.

In addition, in 1909 Harry’s younger brother Jake Guzik was arrested for the vanishing of an underage girl who he previously married her back in 1908. Guzik was mistakenly labeled as “John” in the newspapers at the time but besides that, he was later released on all charges. Story goes that Guzik “enslaved” underage girls for business but also for his own personal purposes. Besides receiving one suspicious telegram, the girl’s family never saw their daughter or sister ever again.

The Guzik brothers were obviously quite nasty.


He who can never endure the bad will never see the good
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