Was watching Larry Mazza interview and he said he was in prison when the news came out that Scarpa was a rat.

Allie boy Persico was also in there and he told Mazza that he and his father ( Carmine the boss) had known for the last 20 years that Scarpa was a rat.

Mazza doesn't come across as a bs merchant but I find it hard to believe. Why would Persico not have Scarpa killed, if he knew?

Anyone think it likely that the boss knew?

In the neighborhood back then "ALOT" of people suspected he was "NO GOOD" however, at the same time were really confused because a "RAT" was "NOT" allowed to "KILL" and Scarpa was killing on regular.

So there was confusion.

On top of being Very Scared to blurt that out in fear of Scarpa finding out and killing you.

Lastly he had a "HUGE" crew on 13th ave, that brought in cash for the family.

I do not think anyone knew for sure
I believe they more so suspected it.

He was too strong, too feared to act with out proof.
His crew would have gone to war.

I think the Persico's knew to the extent of Massino knowing Brasco was a FBI agent,

Massino suspected it however, had no proof, so he kept his distance from Brasco and did not get in bed with him.

So I remember being young at the time and the older guys while trying to make a point to me, asking me and saying, dont you think it strange that, He has never gone to jail look at everyone else that is on the street and as exposed as much as he is, they all either went to jail (For a LONG TIME), or are home from jail, or have recently been arrested, Not Scarpa.

Occam's Razor dictated back then that we was a R.A.T.

Agreed … he kept killing and it kept the wolves from him … i dont think many had it like Scarpa … his handlers thought they were playing army .

I'm not convinced they knew, I suspect he told mazza that to save face and act like he and his father knew. No way he doesn't get whacked on Carmines orders if her knew it. NO WAY

There were suspicions, Persico and others did not believe the FBI would let Scarpa kill people and commit all the crimes he was into, like high end burglaries, while ratting.

This seems like a logical and likely explanation.

Maybe it’s a situation where you would have to be around it to understand it.

Nobody knew for sure.

Whenever there was someone in the street that put in ALOT OF WORK, for a long time and they never did a serious BID, after a while the rumor mill starts chirping.

Hey “THE GRIM REAPER” has atleast 10 bodies, his crew is huge they are running around beating people down, selling drugs out in the open, shaking down bookmakers etc…. All these other Captains are under indictment, in jail, facing 100 years. Scarpa NOTHING, he got pinched and was out in a year.

The streets start talking….

Then you find out he just whacked someone else and the whole neighborhood knows it was Scarpa or his crew that he is responsible, This is where you become conflicted and it’s like no way Scarpa is a RAT, he just whacked, so and so….. NO WAY the feds are giving him a s deal, they cannot.

Then it gets around that Greg found out someone was calling him a rat and that he invited that individual to his club and killed him on the spot.

He again can’t be a RAT, just too much violence and/or the cases he is making will not stick.

Couple years go by more indictments and Scarpa is still as free as a bird.

Now some through all that remain convinced that he was a RAT.
Some through all of that remain convinced that he was NOT a RAT.

Nobody was sure, as per the rules of the street especially back then if you don’t have paperwork showing proof that the person is in fact a RAT, the person that is being accused could win at a sit down and possibly get permission to kill you.

Or in Scarpa’s case just KILL YOU…
As he did before.

With all that being said there were plenty of people coming out saying “I KNEW IT” the whole time, I knew he was a RAT… (Hindsight is always 20/20) Or (Monday Morning Quaterback).

What that meant for most was that they felt that something was not right, and now they have validation, so the I knew its, we’re more so from that perspective, than in the literal sense.

It wasn’t that he knew it 100% and decided to look the other way.

He like most felt something was off however, no paperwork so no proof, the envelopes keep coming, and he keeps killing people, and the people that he is killing are my enemies.

Larry Mazza, that was his excuse for flipping supposedly that once Persico had that conversation with him he was so upset that he decided flip.

That’s a big CROCK OF SHIT…

It was the other way around Scarpa used the FBI. Scarpa provided DeVecchio with cash, jewelry and other gifts along with information of questionable value on the Colombos. In return, DeVecchio allegedly protected Scarpa from arrest and provided him with information about his rivals.

I never read any books on Scarpa, I definitely will one day.

My guess is he would have had to provide some value to the FBI and Delvecchio to be able to get as much as he did out of them, he worked with them for 30+ years I believe, it had to be a two-way street.

I am not doubting what you posted I am sure you did your research before you posted.

I am just trying to fill in some bits and pieces from living in the same neighborhood as he also, we would hear the neighborhood politics from the older guys that were looking out for us and teaching us right from wrong.

BensonHURST- was a great place to live for so many different reasons however, if you did not know the rules or knew the rules but decided not to follow them you very easily could find yourself in the back of a trunk with two behind your ears.

Good posts BH (& others).

Mazza used that conversation as his reason to flip? That is weak, real weak.

I thought both Scarpa books were good. Mafia son has lots of (real) family input.
Deal with the devil is really detailed. Tells a lot about how Scarpa kept getting away with things. Bent fbi agents etc. Find it on you tube, I'm sure.

Rat he may have been, but one thing I know for sure is that Scarpa was truly terrifying. Like already stated in this thread, nobody dared to talk about him openly because there's always the fear of waking up the boogeyman. The guy was a truly monstrous individual who had the go ahead on both sides of the law. You just don't poke people like that with a stick unless you have a death wish.

. Agreed he was truly feared by just about everyone . I guess that’s why he got away with it until pretty much the end. I remember Mazda telling the shirt about an associate named Donnie who had supposedly accused Greg on being a rat. When Greg brought up the accusation to Donnie he turned white as a sheet and he obviously knew he was not leaving that club alive. Ironically Donnie was right about Greg. Another thing is the whole Mary Bari killing which Greg was apart of. Truly sickening and shows how brutal that life can be

I don't believe anything Mazza says...He might as well just say that he left the life and didn't cooperate...Ten of thousands believe that con when Franzese says it...

The biggest lie was that he said was that Greg confronted him and told him I know you're doing Linda, and Mazza claims he said, you'd have to be an idiot not to see that...I mean, come on...A guy who looks like a hair dresser is gonna talk like that to the toughest guy in Bensonhurst ?? I don't think so

. I’m sure there are definitely fabrications of his stories but he was close with Greg

Poor Mazza would have been a fireman if not for Greg !!!

I posted this before
When I was a teenager
And worked at a deli in the neighborhood

Greg used to come in for his cigarettes and coffee daily.
I had no idea who he was at the time, I was just a dumb kid.

I actually charged him for what he bought and he looked at me, with a look like he was shell shocked.
I was just doing my job, it was my first week working the counter.j

I forget how the owner found out it so long ago

It was like what I did…
The owner pulled me aside and told me what I did
He apologized many times for me “NOT KNOWING BETTER”
I had to apologize to him.

It was the talk of the deli afterwards other worksers came in and were laughing about it.
I heard you charged GREG SCARPA

I never forget how terrified the owner was when talking to him
Greg didn’t really say two words

After that and until I stopped working there
I would drop everyone else I was helping
Run over to him, he would tell me what he wanted,
I would give it to him, he never said two words to me.

It’s comical that Messy Marvin stood up to him and shot his eye out.
Historically you would never mention DeRosa, Messy and Scarpa in the same sentence.

Because Messy Marvin was a SLOB, I am almost positive that he was on the spectrum, back then we didn’t know what the spectrum was, just to give you an idea of the caliber of Messy.

They only had the balls to do that because at that time Scarpa was outed and it was open season on him.
Marvin and DeRosa hooked up with shooters from the
Luke’s.

Just looked up Messy Marvin and saw this comment;

" Must have been quite the blow to the mighty Greg Scarpa's ego. He was a Mafia soldier for forty plus years, tortured a KKK supporter while working as a government informant in a pivotal moment in American history, survived three mob wars, and was nicknamed The Grim Reaper for killing around a hundred guys. All this and he gets his eye shot out by some Irish fat fuck with the lame nickname 'Messy.' "

LMAO

I’m not convinced, again if they knew they would’ve killed him or you’d have to say the whole perisco reputation as a dangerous no BS gangster is a fraud. Which I for one believe he was which is why I think the claim they knew is a face saving position.

On a side note I’ve said it before I’m not getting into what I know or don’t know, where I’m from, how I know this or that etc. Those of you who feel you have to question another’s opinion with by assuming that person doesn’t have the history you “claim” to have I find curious since I can be anyone I want and you wouldn’t be able to prove or disprove it. So if you disagree with me or anyone else fine. I really couldn’t care less but don’t question their experiences. Seems counterproductive to the conversation. Challenge there opinion. All in all I read a lot of comments from those “in the neighborhood” that just don’t make sense.

So one last point, they feared scarpa so much no one dared talk about him and allowed him to be a rat? But that fear disappeared during the war and they tried killing him and his crew? Hmmm so rat on the family we fear you continue ratting and do your thing. But we no longer fear you since you broke from our faction now and we will now kill you? Sorry doesn’t add up to me. They never knew it. They would’ve killed him or tried

I think there is a picture of him floating around on the internet somewhere.
If there was ever a nickname that fit, it is his.

Serp...

What do you think of this weeks G.L. article?
Looks like they still have a firm grip on the family
?

Ur thoughts