Really, North Korea and Iran will test the U.S. government's resolve and willingness.

Let's hope that good fortunes will come out of this storyline.

I'm sure many of them would agree. I would be so furious with this administration if I heared a close friend/relative died and the way we took care of it was by going to a different country when you are fully aware, Afghanistan is the main target.

When he said, "the president should do whatever he and congress thinks is necessary". That's what he (our president) is currently doing, infringing on the Bill of Rights one amendment at a time. We're still on number one, which is our Fourth Amendment. If Americans say it's okay with this one, what will stop him from moving on to other parts of the constitution? Hey! As long as we can keep our guns, right?

I'm into gun rights as much as the next guy, but wouldn't that be a more reasonable amendment to disregard? The 2nd?

I'm only making a point, I'm not "anti-gun".

:) It's kind of funny, it seems as if it's hard to discuss this topic without contradicting ourselves (or at least.. myself). When it comes to how we follow the constitution: the president says he's defending the constitution (which is possible, though it doesn't seem like it). But the way he's going about it, is unconstitutional. He's defending the rules by not playing by the rules. The main problem, is the people are supposed to be keeping him in check (that's you, congress), are not doing their job by defending what's left of the constitution.

It comes to this matter, as it comes down to many political matters, in opinion. If you believe he's sincerely trying to get the country back on track, you believe he should take these extra precautions. If you're a skeptic of the folks in Washington (like myself), you believe this administration has its own best interests at heart instead of keeping the country in check. Many times, people such as myself get accused of following "conspiracy theories". If you're too far the other way, then you're naive (Kay). I'm just trying to stay some place between the two.


Focus our attention on North Korea. Pull out of Iraq, they can handle it on their own. Hopefully use a diplomatic approach and gain enough support from other countries, because lord knows we'll need it. Don't try anything bold, because we'll get attacked if we try some of this cowboy shit I've read about in the past.

I really can't come up with a Grade A approach at nuclear-powered North Korea. I may seem like the right guy for the job (ha..ha... riiiiight!) but it's decisions like that which prevent me from entering the political field (plus I'm too focused on making everyone happy, like George Castanza). If I come up with an idea, I'll let ya know, DC but don't hold your breath, it takes a while to get this mind to work.

Here's as far as I've gotten:

-Fire Rumsfeld

===================

Anyway, thanks for the chat, but I'm out.

That IS why we elected him. I beleive in diplomacy and it should be employed here and now unlike a little military quagmire which will remain nameless*cough*. That aside, here is a situation in that we are being tested on the world stage and must not back down either. [/b][/quote]I agree, we must not back down, and we also must not jump the gun. Diplomacy is what might be needed.

Why?

Though we may have some idea, no one (maybe the CIA has, but I doubt it with all of the human intelligence cuts) has the exact blueprints or specifications for Kim Jung Il's fortress. So you'd be sending in a SEAL team without any sort of map or idea where he is.

Can you say international hostage situation? Seriously. Storming the gates, at least at this point, is not an option.

Now, infiltrating his guards and having him whacked...ah, the good old days of the CIA. It brings me back.

I don't know, of course, but I've never heard the slightest suggestion or hint that they do.[/b][/quote]

Does that include blatant disregard for the U.S. constitution and Bill of Rights? Those same rights our ancestors ended their lives to preserve, so we could enjoy, and experience them today. [/b][/quote]Ugh.

When we're all dead, or nuclear zombies (ala Omega Man), is it going to even matter?

Does that include blatant disregard for the U.S. constitution and Bill of Rights? Those same rights our ancestors ended their lives to preserve, so we could enjoy, and experience them today. [/b][/quote]Actuallly I am surprised that DS includes the Congress in presidential decision making since the creep in the White House doesnt seem to pay attention to Congress or the Courts.

But, yes, the wingholes would all abolish the Constitution in a heartbeat. They hate democracy and they want a permnant dictatorship in this phony "War on Terror" [/b][/quote]

The spin is in.

"Love it or leave it,"
Double-J

I see. So now that we know N. Korea has nuclear capabilities now would be a good time to attack them. Gee, I wonder what their first response would be? :rolleyes: I'm guessing it wouldn't be a diplomatic response, which is what the U.S. needs to attempt in response to this. I'm not saying it will be successful, but it's clearly the only avenue at this point.

Well, while that may be true, keep in mind that the nuclear capabilities are still considerably lesser than any of the superpowers. Not that one nuke wouldn't be tragically destructive - but it would amount to bringing a knife to a gunfight.

It will be interesting to see how China reacts to this, and whether they will sit on the little toad that they helped create or they allow him to throw more temper tantrums.

If the UN wont help and do something and North Korea threatins our country then we shouldnt sit back and let them continue to build more missiles and allow them to have the power to attack us. We would have to go around the world and get other nations to support us the same way that they did with Iraq when the UN refused to do anything. It's a scary thing because if the UN fails to take action then we have no choice but to defend ourselves to prevent another possible 9-1-1 from happening again.
If ur family was being threatened with violence by someone and u went to the police again and again and they refused to help u and that someone kept threatining ur family and do things to try and scare them wouldnt u do what u had to do to make sure that no harm came to them no matter what?


ds

China has already said that they will not support any attempt by the UN to impose sanctions against North Korea.

So what does North Korea do? They threaten to launch more missles!


China is fully aware that these threats and actions are affecting the U.S. economy so therefore they will give North Korea and their friends over in Iran just enough of a leash to continue barking at us and allow them to do certain things that will hurt our economy. And as far as Iran goes, well there is nothing more that they would love then for the allied forces to pull out of that country because the minute that the last troop is out of there, you mark my words, Iran will be in there in a flash.


Don Cardi

Yes, I totally concur, China will allow Kim to satisfy his ego but will not permit him to make any serious threats towards the American economy. Otherwise, who else would buy all their wonderful goodies?

That's not to say spoiled little Kim wouldn't have a little show of bravado and disobey China, maybe shoot a little nuke over the Sea of Japan.

This statment was issued by The North Korean Foreign Ministry:


"Our military will continue with missile launch drills in the future as part of efforts to strengthen self-defense deterrent. If anyone intends to dispute or add pressure about this, we will have to take stronger physical actions in other forms."


All I can say right now is that we must exhaust ALL efforts to settle this in a diplomatic way through UN sanctions, economic sanctions and talks. Military action should ALWAYS be used as a last resort and IF it can be avoided, then it should be avoided.

However if after exhausting ALL efforts to resolve this matter peacefully then as a last resort I do not see any choice but to take the proper military actions to defend ourselves against any aggression made by North Korea.


Don Cardi

DC it appears to me that China and Russia are going to do NOTHING to sanction N. Korea (for whatever reasons). We have about 40,000 troops on the Korean border which is not enough to stop the North Korean Army from taking Seoul. Of course if we were not bogged down in that quagmire we would have other forces but that ain't gonna happen without a draft. So the other option nwould be what? Nuke North Korea? The geography makes this dangerous because the fallout could affect S. Korea and Japan, and it might cause N. Korea to use one of their nukes in retaliation.

So whats the plan?

All that you said above is correct DonT, and unfortunatley North Korea and Iran know this too. This is why I believe that they are flexing their muscles, almost daring us to take some kind of action against them. You have to admit though, whether you like him or not, The President was right on when he said that these two countries are part of the axis of evil.

I want you to ponder something here.

Why would North Korea build a missile that just so happens to have the capability to reach a place like Alaska? Why not build one that can reach California or New York or Chicago? Why Alaska? Think about who's involved with North Korea, who just may be quietly behind them and you will begin to realize why they chose to make a missile that can reach Alaska.


Don Cardi

Yes, DS, I would do whatever I thought I had to do.

I'm not sure, though, what exactly that would involve.

It would depend on how seriously I perceived the threat to be, I guess.

But you still haven't told me what you would do in this case.

I guess I'm waiting for you to tell me that you'd invade North Korea, or use some type of pre-emptive nuclear strije against them.

Here's another question I have:

Why does everyone assume that North Korea is stockpiling missles in order to have an offensive capability against us?

The way I see it, they'd be nuts - not to say that they aren't nuts - to attack us first.

Sure, they might inflict some serious damage, but I think that in retaliation we'd pretty much wipe thm off the face of the earth, wouldn't we?

Isn't it possible, if not likely, that North Korea considers us to be a threat to them, and they're increasing their nuclear capabilities as a deterrent against a United States attack (they've seen us attack other countries - Afghanistan and Iraq; - no matter from their POV if we had good reason to or not) and as a purely defensive move?

Plus, if we simply form a coalition and invade North Korea because they now have nuclear capabilities, how does that make us look. Wouldn't it in a way justify the actions of the 9-11 terrorists. After all, we have nuclear weapons too. If we would be justified to attack North Korea because of their nukes, the terrorists would be justifiied in attacking us due to our nukes. I'm not saying I feel that way, but that would be the view of the rest of the world.

This dipshit isn't going to launch a nuke. He's blowing smoke trying to provoke us. The fact remains, we're the only country to ever use a nuclear device. We opened the door, so we shouldn't be surprised when other countries follow us through it. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were under completely different circumstances. We understand that as Americans. We have to look at how the other nations might look at it however. We can't just look at every situation through our red, white, and blue glasses.

So, I just have to ask; what kind of internal damage could this Taepodong have on us?

A Japanese newspaper reported that North Korea targeted waters near Hawaii when it fired that long-range missile.


ds

CUT TO: Inside Air Force One where the President and Condoleeza are sitting in the rear -night


RICE : When I meet with the Kim people, should I insist that all his military leaders have clean records?


BUSH : Mention it -- don't insist. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a terrorist who'll know that without being told.


RICE : You mean Kim...


BUSH : Kim's a pimp -- he never'a could've outfought America. But I didn't know until this day that it was -- Mahmoud Ahmadinejad all along...


Don Cardi

No brainer DC, the oilfields. Of course they cant seem to launch anything that goes more than 40 feet.

I think Bush is right in seeking a diplomatic solution, but N. Korea is not really the kind of place that responds to traditional diplomacy. We may have to wait him out and see who succeeds him.

I cannot believe that N Korea is a place where the people are too happy. They are all starving to death, and from what I read they think they are living better than S Korea and/or China because thats what they are told. Exivdently the few who have escaped cannot believe how backward that country is. Of all the trouble spots in the world I think this is the best place to simply take him out and installl some general who is acceptable to the US, Russia,Japan China and S Korea.

Alberto Gonzalez - Do you know how there going to come after you?

George Bush - They will arrange a meeting. On Putin's turf where I'll be safe, and then I'll be assassinated.

Gonzalez - I always thought it would be Hu.

Bush - No, its the smart move. Putin was always smarter. But I'm gonna wait until after the mid term elections, and then I'll meet with Kim Il Jong and all the rest of the North Korean families.

Not as long as China is in their corner.

Kim Jung Il is a spoiled little bastard in the same mold as his father, and he is doing this to try and make himself feel important in world affairs because people stopped taking him seriously.


---

One has to wonder whether, had MacArthur been allowed to continue North in the Korean War, if this would even be an issue; of course, it probably would have meant fighting China.

A friend of mine who is pretty far to the right says that Kim Il Jung just wants to be seen as a "player" in workd affairs. He suggests that we build a statue of him somewhere in Montana or some desolate spot, and name a fictitious town after him, and make a big deal about it. The thinking is he would then go on forever propogandizing about how we caved to him and the threat would be over.

That's pretty much spot on. As I said before, Il is irrelevant, and this is the only way he can make himself seem important.

Though I have to say, I really doubt that you have any "far to the right" friends. :p

"Turn out the lights,"
Double-J

.

Though I have to say, I really doubt that you have any "far to the right" friends. :p

"Turn out the lights,"
Double-J [/QB][/QUOTE]


Well, none who have swastika avatars.

Ugh.

If you don't understand the avatar, or its relevance, I pity you.

"Moronika for Morons,"
Double-J

I like the dialogues