I might turn into a windbag, so please forgive me if you hang yourself from the ceiling Airplane style before you get to the end.

I debated whether to post this in the Sports Forum or here, but since the Sports Forum is more about fantasy sports and doesn't really include much actual discussion other than Red Sox and Yankees fans debating about who has the largest penis, I decided to post here to hopefully get a greater response.

With all the talk of steroid use in professional baseball and the increased testing that has finally been implemented as a result, it made me think of a possible trickle-down effect that could pose a very big problem in the future. Now that MLB has joined the other major sports, the NCAA, and their own minor league system in testing for performance enhancing drugs, it is possible that more and more athletes could begin to flirt with PEDs at the high school and even middle school levels in order to bulk up before being subjected to regular drug testing. I'm not naive enough to believe that there haven't been high schoolers already taking steroids, but am also not naive enough to think that the recent media frenzy over steroids won't have an effect either.

The other major sports have previously had strict testing for PEDs before the Canseco-Bonds-Senate Committee circus began, but I think this is one of those situations where any news is good news if you're some jerkoff, Victor Conte wannabe looking to make a buck preying on uninformed or misinformed children. When steroid use became in issue in the NFL, it wasn't truly brought into the national spotlight until Lyle Alzado became the posterchild for NFL steroid use. It was easy for kids of that generation to take one look at Lyle and say, "Jesus Christ, I don't want to end up looking like that guy!" Nowadays, what the young children are seeing now is regular looking, normal guys who only appear to get better as a result of taking steroids. They don't see the possible side effects that steroids do cause, they only see the home run records. Of course, it hasn't been proven that any of this generation's posterchildren (i.e. Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, etc.) have ever taken steroids, but perception is reality. You can debate whether they did all you want and might never get a definitive answer, but I don't think anyone will debate that is you walk up to the average Joe or Josaphine on the street and more often then not, he/she will tell you they believe these players did use steroids.

Young boys and girls sitting at home watching a baseball game are left with the impression that taking steroids will help you be a better player. All we can really do is educate children about the damage steroids does, but will that really help? We've done the same thing with other drugs and look what effect that has had on curbing illegal drug use. :rolleyes: With the constant fixation that the media has had with steroids lately, one has to wonder if it is adding fuel to the fire.

High school is now the only level where regular testing isn't required, so if these youngsters are going to use steroids and get away with it, it stands to reason more and more children will begin experimenting at this age. Plus, drug testing for high schoolers is a tricky proposition, since they are minors and rightfully protected as such. There's a big difference between telling a 22 year old man he has to pee in a cup because he plays baseball and doing the same with a 16 year old kid. As a high school coach, I obviously have a pretty strong interest in what the next 5-10 years will bring in regards to this aspect.

A lot has been made of the Senate's involvement with baseball's steroids testing policy. Maybe I'm giving our government too much credit, but I think that the Senate got so involved in something that on the surface appeared to be very insignificant in regards to the American landscape, but come several years from now could pose not only a major health/social problem in our country, but a political and legal battle as well. One in which the Senate and other branches of government could find themselves smack dab in the middle of.

Now I'm not saying the MLB or any other sport is wrong in implementing this testing. It is absolutely necessary not only for the integrity of each sport, but most importantly for the health of athletes. I just think that an entire aspect, quite possibly the most important aspect, of this whole MLB steroids fiasco is being completely ignored by the media. It's very easy to be reactive, but considerably more difficult to be proactive. It took Jose Canseco writing a book and Mark McGwire and Barry Bonds breaking the home run record for baseball to realize it had a problem. If this does lead to increased use by high schoolers, with several states still using aluminum bats, is it going to take several dead pitchers for the media to turn its attention to the fact that steroid use is wrong not because it taints record books, but because it is a drug that harms people? I know the media has a job to do in covering this huge story with Bonds passing Ruth and potentially closing in on the Hammer. I just wonder if the talking heads realize the message they send every time they come on TV and state Barry Bonds hit 73 home runs because he took performance enhancing drugs.

Just as MLB deserves partial blame for looking the other way when it came to steroids because of the benefit it provided them in '98, if somebody's son is lying dead on the pitchers mound in 2010 because a juiced up 17 year old smacked a line-drive off of the pitcher's head, I think some of the people standing on their soapbox right now will look just as bad as MLB for continuing to ignore the big picture of steroid use simply because going on a witch hunt is benefiting their careers.

Yet, this IS about Sports, no?? :p

I'll move it tomorrow... AFTER you get the "exposure" you're looking for...

I am completely intolerant of drug use in sports. But I wonder if testing in High Schools is going too far. To use Plaw's favourite words the 'slippery slope', where would it end? Wouldn't you have to test for other sports too that may not lead to scholorships or professional contracts? Would it also lead to even lower levels being tested?

On one of your original points, I'm unsure that increased testing in MLB or college would increase kids to use performance enhancing drugs in school. I'd like to think not but maybe to argue that...

If anyone remembers last years NFL draft, Jose Luis Castillo (not the boxer that failed to make the weight this weekend by FIVE pounds ) admitted prior to the draft of steroid use. He then became a first round pick. I personally don't think that's any kind of good example. What does that say to kids? Take drugs to play well but repent and you may make millions in your first professional contract. Hell if you can't do it without the drugs you've still made your money.

Maybe that would filter down to High School. I don't know, it's a tricky situation.

really? Oooh Ooooh! To think I snubbed the Sports Forum all the time.....

ESPN.com is reporting that the Feds have busted D-backs pitcher Jason Grimsley for using illegal human growth hormones. He's threatening to come out with names of other major leaguers who also use HGH. Get ready for another round of drug controversy in MLB. :rolleyes:

As most all of you know, I am very ignorant and/or just not interestested when it comes to sports. This steroid problem, to me anyway, only recently came to light. I watched part of the Conseco (and others) hearing that was on tv, and also know of Gary Bonds use of steroids.

First of all, is this something that has been used for decades, or just in the last few years? Aren't there some kinds of steroids that "are" legal? It seems to me health food stores sell some kind of steroids no?

What I don't get though is, isn't use of them in any sports competition cheating??? When I heard Bonds broke Babe Ruth's record, I thought to myself "yea right." It seems like it's just not fair having that advantage in a competitive sport (I am assuming it's an advantage), and therefore how can any spectators/fans cheer people on who break sports records if steroids do indeed enhance their performance? Or am I missing something here?

TIS

Pfft. I particularly enjoyed how Montel Williams turned the whole issue of steriods into a racial one on his show this past Tuesday with Lou Dobbs, basically saying that its a farce and the only reason it is an issue is because a black man is breaking a white man's "record."

First off, shame on Montel for claiming that Bonds is the only person being accused of taking steroids. Secondly, of course its going to be super-scrutinized by the media (which he is a part of) because he's chasing Babe Ruth, the icon of American sport. In fact, the Home Run record is still, last time I checked, held by a black man named Hank Aaron.

Further, shame on Lou Dobbs, who acted like one of Pavlov's dogs and lapped up all the "poor Barry, white-against-black" crap that came out of Montel's mouth.

Stick with legalizing marijuana, Monty. :rolleyes:

Was that Gary "U.S." Bonds?

No wonder he had such a big hit back in the 60's. He was on steroids!

Don't you know that I danced
(I danced)
'Til a quarter to three....

(j/k with 'ya, TIS :p )

Was that Gary "U.S." Bonds?

No wonder he had such a big hit back in the 60's. He was on steroids!

Don't you know that I danced
(I danced)
'Til a quarter to three....

(j/k with 'ya, TIS :p ) [/b][/quote]Ha ha ha ha! It's "Barry" Bonds isn't it? See what do I know about sports? Can't get the rock trivia out of my head I guess.

But yea, I do remembere "Gary" US Bonds, and of course I know your joking PLaw. You should see me at work when a couple of the ladies talk sports stars, I have the completely wrong sport all the time.

BTW PLaw back on this topic in which I'm so knowledgeable, don't you consider the steriod use cheating??? If not, why? I just want to know the justification of those who think it's fair, from sports fans.

TIS

Jimmy Buffer -- we don't need a Congressional committee or hearing to decide what to do. We already have a process in place for this. Absent a prescription, if you're caught with steroids you should be subject to the same penalties as someone caught possessing or trafficking painkillers or other prescription drugs. Professional athletes are not exempt from this. And I think the bust of Jason Grimsley for accepting a shipment of HGH is the wake-up call for ALL professional athletes. Professional sports and their respective players unions shouldn't be surprised when the feds come knocking on their members doors with search warrants. Nor should they be surprised when someone "names names" as part of an investigation.

Because of the documented long-term side-effects of unbridled steroid use, it's good that their use is regulated and banned as a performance enhancing substance.

Steroid testing in high school? Although I'm not aware of any high schools currently testing for anabolic steroids, it's possible that it is happening. My understanding is that the tests for anabolic steroids are expensive...$500 - $1,000 per person. A lot of school district just aren't in a position to absorb that expense for a testing program. Taken a step further, are they ready to absorb the legal liability of a challenge to their "randomness" if they don't test everybody?

TIS -- to answer your earlier post, there can be legitimate medical uses for anabolic steroids (which is just one of several types of steroids). Specifically (and oversimplified), they convert protein into muscle more efficiently. But the side-effects have often outweighed the medical benefits. I believe one of the earliest uses was to stimulate bone, muscle, and tissue growth in soldiers wounded in battle, with the earliest uses in the 1940's and early 1950's.

It didn't take a genius to figure out that anabolic steroids might have some other value if muscle growth were stimulated by a weightlifting regimen and supplemented by anabolic steroids and a high protein diet. Steroid use/abuse among athletes is DECADES old, dating back to the 1950's and 1960's when the muscle magazines would publish articles about "revolutionary new exercises and workout routines" that would lead to massive increases in muscle size. Guess what? It wasn't just the "revolutionary routines" leading to the massive, nearly inhuman increases. It was anabolic steroids. The body builders and weightlifters were the first to hit the needle (or swallow the pill, or stuff the suppository!) followed closely by the track and field athletes (discus and shot putters), professional wrestling and professional football. Yes, professional football...in the 1960's.

Arnold Schwarzenegger admitted using anabolic steroids (specifically Dianabol) during his run as Mr. Olympia (or Universe...I can never remember which) in the 1970's. At the time, the use of anabolic steroids was LEGAL.

Major league baseball players have been so late to the party on strength training and conditioning it's no wonder it took them to the 1990's to discover steroids.

Name the "seven deadly sins" and Pride (or Vanity) would be right there at the top. It's vanity that motivates the athlete to take steroids to enhance their performance and, as Barry Bonds has demonstrated, grab a share of the limelight for himself. Time and again young athletes have been asked, "If you could take a pill that would guarantee a successful athletic career but had a good chance of causing an early death, would you do it?" Overwhelmingly, they answer, "Yes."

I don't know how to explain that...or maybe I do. We have a desire to excel, we've been pushed to excel and we are willing to sacrifice our own lives to be recognized as great if only for a moment.

tony b.

I'm not saying we do need a congressional hearing, I just mentioned Congress's involvement might have ulterior motives for stepping into the baseball investigation then we are seeing. As far as having a process already in place, we of course do, but is it effective? The process in place is the exact same process in place that is intended to keep youth from using marijuana, meth, alcohol, nicotine, cocaine, etc. and look at how wonderful that process is working. :rolleyes:


This is the whole point behind my initial post. High school sports are now the only level at which athletes are not subjected to regular drug testing. I'm not saying that we should be testing kids under 18 because that opens a gigantic Pandora's Box. I'm just saying that we need to examine an alternative way to prevent young athletes from using steroids because they do admit a willingness to use steroids despite the known side effects, just as you posted. Perhaps making all student athletes take a class that educates them about the dangers or having the coach take them to a steroids clinic or workshop the day before the first practice of the year could be one way. Steroid use at the high school level is probably already becoming a major problem that we won't notice until it is too late, just like in MLB. When asked last night on Baseball Tonight Orel Hersheiser stated that he noticed steroid use becoming a big problem in baseball in the early 90s, a decade before anyone took action against it. Are we going to wait that long to take action when we're talking about children? I just think this aspect of the whole steroids scandal is going totally ignored. We're spending so much time examining the past about who used and who didn't, rather than focusing on ensuring young athletes won't be using them in the future. 10 years from now, when we're having this exact same problem at the high school level, everyone is going to be up in arms and in disbelief at how large a problem PED use in high school has become and we'll go through the whole episode all over again. That's the only thing that concerns me.