RIP

The Death Penalty blows. State-sponsored murder is still murder

From CourtTV.com

Another especially interesting quote:

Sound like an innocent man to you?

I said that I wasn't defending him.

But you weren't there, nor was I.

Witnesses lie and make mistakes, as do juries.

I'm just asking, if he was innocent, should he have been expected to apologize and show remorse?

That is true. Look at Huricane Carter.


DS

Innocent or not "Tookie's Out Da House"

I don't recall anyone taking up for the lady in Texas a year or so back who was a former drug dealer that killed and became a born-again Christian. If anyone did, I apologize. I DO recall folks talking about how it was all a "put-on" to avoid the needle (which she wasn't afraid of, btw).

At any rate, I didn't shout "foul" for her then, nor will I now for this man. The bottom line is, born again or not, rehabilitated or not, there are consequences for actions. If there aren't, then burn all the laws and wreck all the courtrooms. Whether or not you're for the death penalty, you have to admit it sets a dangerous precedent if we start giving amnesty, cutting time, getting folks away from the needle, etc. for anyone who turns boy/girl scout. Who truly knows what's in someone's heart? You're either gonna put laws on the books and enforce them across the board, or you're not.

Well, at least Jesse Jackson got his usual fee for showing up, I'm sure.

Snake there was a to do about that woman, as there have been about many people who starty finding God, writing childrens books and poetry on Death Row. I am opposed to the death penalty as a matter of principle, however so long as it is on the books, it should be enforced, and what someone does after conviction, sentencing, appeals and a shot at DNA testing should not matter.

As for Jesse Jackson, I doubt anyone is paying him to show up. If anything I would think he would be paying them.

From CourtTV.com

Another especially interesting quote:

Sound like an innocent man to you? [/b][/quote]Yes but that was at his trial back in the 1970s. He could have been "reformed" or "rehibilitated" by then but now we'll never fully know. As Eustachius Brown said "state-sponsored murder is still murder"

QUOTE]Yes but that was at his trial back in the 1970s. He could have been "reformed" or "rehibilitated" by then but now we'll never fully know. As Eustachius Brown said "state-sponsored murder is still murder" [/QB][/QUOTE]

And what's more: it sends a horrible message to the rest of the world and, even worse, to our children. Murder is OK if we (the State) do it.

This is a sad day for anyone involved in the rehabilitation of criminals in America.

As I said in an earlier post, I don't believe that this particular case comes down to being for or against the death penalty. I think that the question here is if you believe that the death penalty should be applied in this particular case. I, personally, feel that there are cases where the death penalty should be a given (Charles Manson comes to mind. I think that Ted Bundy got his just desserts), but I think that this man's life should have been spared.

I think that he created a horrific gang that has wreaked mayhem on good people. I think that he was probably a mean and wicked person. However, I also think that he saw the error of his ways. I think that he did a great deal of good in his last years on this earth, and that he had a great deal more to do.

Should his victims be forgotten? Never. Even if he was not guilty of this particular crime, as founder of the Crips, I'm sure he had gallons of blood on his hands. I think that he should have stayed in prison for life and continued as an inspiration for young people to stay away from that lifestyle.

I agree with you. Except that DNA testing is quite a reliable and valid basis for proving someone innocent.

SV thats what I said... everyone should have the right to dna testing whether it was available at the time of conviction or not.

Exactly. I am for Capitol Punishment, but in this instance I felt he should've been spared.

R.I.P.

Don Andrew and Sicilian Babe: Therein lies exactly what I'm talking about. We either enforce all the laws equally across the board, or chunk the whole system. And, as I mentioned, who knows what's in a man's heart, really? If we give a death row inmate a break from the needle on account of what he's written, preached, or whatever, well, who's to say that he's not just a better actor than some other schmuck that ends up getting the needle? And what exactly is the "time limit" to give a convict to turn boy scout?

Everyone forgets that this con wasn't the victim here. His victims were already 6 feet under. And their poor families still have to go on somehow, still victimized until they pass on by what he did. I don't care how many good deeds he's done since, there aren't enough to compensate for what he did. Why aren't their lives ever taken into consideration? Why is his misery (which was self-made, btw) worse than theirs?

Excellent point Snake! I'm still against the death penalty myself but you bring up a great point!

Which is a major problem with the death penalty.

It is not, IMO, applied equally across the board.

Excellent point Snake! I'm still against the death penalty myself but you bring up a great point! [/b][/quote]That's all I'm sayin', brothers. Thanks.

But Snake, then we're no better than the murderers themselves.

The US lawsystem is no better than a murderer.

Think about that.

But that's where we differ. I don't consider that to be murder. Murder is what people like this guy did; what he got was punishment, or justice, if you will.

Furthermore, I'm amazed that folks take the death penalty issue and say, "Well, I'm against it in principle, but a serial killer who tortures and molests little children before he kills them deserves it." Frankly, I see a contradiction there. Either you're placing "life" above all else and therefore it shouldn't be snuffed out--regardless of whose life it is--or you're not. I see no middle ground or compromises.

Hmm. That's a difficult moral problem you bring up.
When being pro-death penalty, and when not?

I'm consistent: ALWAYS. As I said, as long as it's the law, it should be enforced equitably.

When the crips were formed back in the late 60's early 70's they were a peaceful movement. They basically protested against police violence and the discrimination they had in LA. Then a couple of em started fueding with each other and a part of the gang split, they calld themselves the mob Pyrus, the present day bloods. And from then on it's just been gang banging and drug slanging. If anyone of us were born in those areas we would all be in gangs too. Beleive me I know its horrible, uncivilized and their a buncha criminals, but you just need to walk in peoples shoes who live in the ghetto to understand that how they live (life of crime) seems just as normal to them as to how we live and go about our lives. The police corruption in LA is staggering, people get pulled over because they are black, and they can throw anyone in jail for any particular made up reason they want. I wouldn't doubt for a second that the cops couldve framed tookie. Just look at the killing of B.I.G. He was killed by cops, hired by Suge knight and his Blood gang affiliates, the reason why none of this got to court is because half of the LA county police are on the payroll, the other half are just crooked and the most racist people Ive ever heard of.

You make it sound like gang banging is still a big thing in South Central. It simply isn't. And I agree, Suge Knight is a piece of shit. He had Tupac killed, IMO, too. Good day sir.

What?? SCLA has, is, and will be Gang banging for a long while. It's just so common place that no one bothers to report it on the news anymore. Beleive me there are shootings on a daily basis there.

What?? SCLA has, is, and will be Gang banging for a long while. It's just so common place that no one bothers to report it on the news anymore. Beleive me there are shootings on a daily basis there. [/b][/quote]There may very well be shootings on a daily basis, but if you compare today's homicides and murders in Compton with the homicides and murders from the late 80's and early 90's, it's isn't anything.