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Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121165
08/06/05 08:15 PM
08/06/05 08:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
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Double-J Offline OP
Double-J  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
Quote:
Blair out to deport radicals
Policies would target those who `foster hatred'


By Kevin Sullivan and Fred Barbash, The Washington Post. The New York Times contributed to this report
Published August 6, 2005

LONDON -- Prime Minister Tony Blair, responding to last month's deadly bombings in London, outlined a series of unprecedented steps that would allow Britain to deport and exclude foreign nationals who promote or incite extremist violence or are "fostering hatred."

Among those excluded would be non-citizen clerics "not suitable to preach." In addition, Blair said, the government was preparing orders allowing it to shut down places of worship used as centers for "fomenting extremism."

Some of the steps may require legislation or court involvement. Others can be done by government order. Blair acknowledged the potential controversy that could arise from the proposals.

"The rules of the game are changing," Blair said in an 80-minute news conference devoted almost entirely to the issue of terrorism, which has taken on new urgency in Britain since a July 7 bombing that killed four bombers and 52 other people and injured 700 more.

Blair noted that Britain has been generous with asylum seekers and refugees from around the globe but said public opinion is demanding more care in accepting them.

"We're angry about these extremists," he said. "We're angry about them abusing our good nature and our toleration."

Blair announced that two Islamic organizations, Hizb ut-Tahrir and Al-Muhajiroun, would be banned in Britain.

Leaders of Hizb ut-Tahrir, which also has been banned in Germany, have denounced the bombings and asserted that they are non-violent.

Al-Muhajiroun's spiritual leader is Sheik Omar Bakri, a Syrian-born imam who has expressed "understanding" for the bombings because of Blair's policies in Iraq and the Middle East.

The changes Blair announced strike a harsher note in the ongoing debate here about the balance between civil liberties and national security. Blair said he was not trying to undermine religious tolerance or "legitimate political debate" but rather wanted to remove those who are "actively engaged in inciting" people to violence.

He denounced as "appalling rubbish" the opinions of those who support the bombings as legitimate expression of Muslim anger at the policies of Britain and the United States.

Blair said some of the new policies would be implemented immediately while others are under "urgent examination."

Britain's home secretary would be empowered to deport or exclude anyone "fostering hatred, advocating violence to further a person's beliefs or justifying or validating such violence."

Blair said a list will be made of "specific extremist Web sites, bookshops, centers, networks" and organizations and that "active engagement" with any of them would be a "trigger" for possible deportation.

As outlined in a release from the prime minister's office, the government will propose new anti-terrorism legislation that creates an offense of "condoning or glorifying terrorism ... anywhere, not just in the U.K."

"Anyone who has participated in terrorism or has anything to do with it anywhere will automatically be refused," the statement said.

Blair also said the government would:

- Consider stripping citizenship from naturalized Britons "engaged in extremism."

- Establish, within the Muslim community in Britain, a commission to advise on how to better integrate into society "those parts of the community presently inadequately integrated."

- Consider closure of places of worship used as centers "for fomenting extremism" and, in consultation with Muslim leaders, "draw up a list of those not suitable to preach who will be excluded from Britain."

Bakri, who has frequently shrugged off allegations that he preaches extremism, criticized Blair's proposals Friday, particularly suggestions that he could be targeted for remarks made years ago.

"If they believed what I said was illegal, why didn't they arrest me at the time? They know my work well," he told The Associated Press. He said he works to address "the anger and frustration so many youth feel."

He said if asked to go, he would go to Lebanon rather than challenge the decision.

Britain has been criticized for lagging its European neighbors in responding to terrorism. Since last month's attacks, France has expelled two extremist Muslim prayer leaders and plans to ship home eight others. Italian authorities deported eight Palestinian imams.

As a signatory to the European Convention on Human Rights, Britain is not allowed to deport people to a country where they may face torture or death. Blair is hoping to win pledges from countries that deportees would not be subjected to inhumane treatment. An agreement already has been reached with Jordan, and London is talking to Algeria, Tunisia and Egypt.

Also Friday, police charged three men with failing to disclose information about the whereabouts of a suspect in the failed July 21 London bomb attacks, the AP reported. Police did not name the suspect. The wife and sister-in-law of Hamdi Issac, a suspected July 21 attacker, face similar charges, as does another man.

Source: The Chicago Tribune

I have to applaud Prime Minister Blair for taking a stand here, and taking the battle to the terrorists. Keep in mind, they are talking about deporting non-citizens, but I would just as well see those who are citizens that promote, participate, or advocate ills against the state or it's people, have their citizenship revoked and deported (as Blair said, he would consider instituting).

I hope that President Bush will follow suit. I know that most liberals will dismiss this with the "slippery slope" argument, and that the government will then have the right to remove anyone who doesn't approve of the government. However, I have to disagree. Blair has clearly outlined the reasons for deportation, and it's noncitizens, who don't have the same rights as actual citizens.

There are clearly breeding grounds for this pro-terrorist, radical muslim behavior throughout America. I believe in the 9/11 commission report I read about a cleric in a Chicago mosque who was funneling money to Al Qaeda and Bin Laden. These people live under the protections of our laws and systems, but want to take it down, preferably with violence, and by any means necessary.

Thoughts?



Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121166
08/06/05 08:26 PM
08/06/05 08:26 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 22
Boston, Massachusetts
MafiaHitman13 Offline
Wiseguy
MafiaHitman13  Offline
Wiseguy
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 22
Boston, Massachusetts
I agree with Blair to deport radicals who are not citizens. Here, the liberals in Massachusetts are letting the state pay for the college of non citizens! So it should happen here sooner or later.


"I know it was you, Fredo. You broke my heart. You broke my heart."
Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121167
08/06/05 08:36 PM
08/06/05 08:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
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Double-J Offline OP
Double-J  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
It's the same thing here. Even with my scholarship, I still have to fork over $1000's a year to go to the State University of New York at Buffalo. Thank God for my academic scholarship. And that doesn't count books and whatnot.

NY State residents, heck, US citizens, are a minority at my school, outnumbered 2 to 1 by out of state residents, and 3 to one by Chinese or Indian/Pakistani nationals.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't foster education, but it is ridiculous that we are paying for someone from China to come over here and get a degree, only to go back to China and promote their economy. Meanwhile, taxpayers, and their children, who pay for the University, are not always able to come up with the money.

Anyways, sorry for going offtopic, it's a sensitive subject for me.



Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121168
08/06/05 11:10 PM
08/06/05 11:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,150
MI6
Krlea Offline
Underboss
Krlea  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,150
MI6
DJ and Mafia Hitman~ Can you explain the college aid thing a bit more. I've never heard of that and am really interested. Do all schools pay for foreign students? I figured they paid full tuition.

Sorry to threadjack!

Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121169
08/06/05 11:45 PM
08/06/05 11:45 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
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Double-J Offline OP
Double-J  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
Well, let's take my friend from Nigeria from example. I talked to him about this once too, because I didn't really understand it either. He gets all of his tuition paid, and his residence as well, in some kind of foreign student program. So essentially, the SUNY system, and the taxpayers of New York, are paying for him (and thousands like him) to take all of his classes. Meanwhile, US citizens, and citizens of NY state, like myself, are lucky to get a scholarship (Academic or athletic) that defrays some of the cost, still bringing it to be thousands each year.

Another friend of mine is from Red Hook in NY, and is dirt poor. He also gets his full tuition paid, but ours was the only school willing to do so.

There are a plethora of Asian students here in my school, who study here, and then return to China once they receive their degree. If their situation is anything like the one aforementioned about my Nigerian friend, than it is likely the State is paying for them to attend.

Again, I don't know about the case for all foreign students, but those who I have talked to pay little if any towards their educational costs. Keep in mind, like I said, the US citizen is outnumbered 3-1 by non-citizens at my school, so if you can imagine, that's quite a bit of money. And tuition increases every year.

I can't imagine why. :rolleyes:



Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121170
08/07/05 12:20 AM
08/07/05 12:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,150
MI6
Krlea Offline
Underboss
Krlea  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,150
MI6
I can understand paying for a few students who otherwise couldent go to a college because they are in a poverty stricken country, but not a legion from China. Sorry if this isint PC but they're Communist, can't they get an education in their own country? Why do we have American kids who can't afford college, yet we are paying for a bunch of Socialists? I really hope this isint true.

Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121171
08/07/05 12:29 AM
08/07/05 12:29 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
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Double-J Offline OP
Double-J  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
Quote:
Originally posted by Krlea:
I really hope this isint true.
lol, do you think I'd lie about this? I'm the one shelling out the cash. :p



Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121172
08/07/05 06:28 AM
08/07/05 06:28 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,952
It's fun to stay in the YMCA
Turi Giuliano Offline
Turi Giuliano  Offline

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,952
It's fun to stay in the YMCA
I liked Blairs plan when I first heard it but there's too many problems with it. We have a policy of not deporting people to their home country if that country has capital and corporal punishment systems instilled. So instead what can you do? Lock them up because we don't like what they say? What, if like the 7/21 bombers, they were British born?

I actually don't think Blair's plan possible. The European Court of Human Rights overrides any ruling made in the UK and we have to abide by that. Blair wants to amend our Human Rights Act but as long as we are part of Europe it wont make any difference. Surely he should have a word with his the missus about it who defends human rights.


So die all who betray Giuliano
Re: Blair Says Britain Will Deport Radicals #121173
08/07/05 09:09 AM
08/07/05 09:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
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Double-J Offline OP
Double-J  Offline OP
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,724
Quote:
What, if like the 7/21 bombers, they were British born?
In the article, Blair is also quoted as suggesting:

Consider stripping citizenship from naturalized Britons "engaged in extremism."




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