Hypothetically speaking, if Al Capone had never gotten syphilis, he serves his entire 11-year sentence and returns to the Chicago Outfit. What do you guys think?

Probably not.

Capone had no way to give orders, or even keep in touch, from Alcatraz, which was a hypermax. The warden had to approve visitors, and no Outfit guys were on that list. Only his wife, son and mother were permitted to visit him; they were permitted one visit per month, and the warden had to approve each visit, even for them. Alcatraz was hard to get to, visits were limited to 20 minutes. no touching, and "conversations" had to be shouted through 3"x9" peepholes covered with inch-thick glass.

Capone started his tax evasion sentence in '33, just as Prohibition was repealed, and was sent to The Rock in '34. The Outfit needed to find other sources of income, and they weren't going to wait until Capone was free. Nitti, Ricca, Guzik and Accardo had to get on with business without him. He'd never have been able to claw his way back to the top, even if his mind wasn't turned to mush by syphilis.

I thought he was sentenced in 1931. An 11-year sentence was really nothing for his age, if only he didn't have syphilis. He was released in 1939, early because of his disease. If he was sentenced in 1931, he would've been released in 1942, if he served his complete sentence, while still pretty young. I don't see him simply walking away from the Outfit, especially considering that they became officially LCN in 1931, with the start of the Commission.

If he was sentenced in 1933, he would've been released in 1944. Capone was only 48 when he died. It was definitely syphilis that killed him.

My error: he was sentenced in 11 /31, started serving his sentence in the Atlantta pen in 5/32, and was sent to Alcatraz in 8/34. From that time on, he was incommunicato with the Outfit, which was moving way past where it had been before his conviction. His time had passed even if he hadn't had syphilis.

Capone would return in the Outfit as simple soldier for sure his brother would help him to find some rackets but the Prohibition was over so way he turn to be boss,his time had passed.

There are two stories regarding the situation when Capone was sent to prison. The first one is that while being in Atlanta prison, Capone was allegedly often visited by Guzik whose job was to deliver messages (since Capone was still right in his mind at the time) and also to influence certain individuals regarding his early release. The second story is that some of Capones successors and also some of his cohorts in New York were allegedly happy to see Capone in jail, mainly because of the national attention which he brought upon himself and also over the whole organization. The problem is they never thought that Capone will start losing his mind, something which was quite dangerous for the syndicate because they feared if he started talking regarding situations from the past. So they werent able to keep an eye on him when he was already transferred to Alcatraz and thats why they sent Outfit associate and lawyer Abe Teitlebaum to get Capone out of jail, which he really did (1939 i think) and so he was instantly sent to Miami, and from that point on he was constantly visited/watched by his old peers.

If Capone never had syphillis and never lost his mind, he was going to do his time and was either going to receive a position as semi-retired advisor, or he was going to be sent to another state (like Ralph who went to Wisconsin) obviously because the media in Chicago was going to be all over him. I personally will go with the second statement. Who knows, maybe they were going to kill him?! We will never know.

Why kill him? For sure he was rich enought to retire or maybe send to expand Outfit rackets maybe in Miami or maybe in Las Vegas.

I don't think Ricca would order his murder that would bring huge media attention to the organization, something Paul always avoided.

I don't think he would've been killed unless he made a power play. He really doesn't strike me as someone who would, though. He didn't seem like the power hungry type and only killed those who were after him. My guess is that he would be wise enough to realize that times had changed. He most certainly would still be a member, unless they decided to shelve him.

I believe he would have been appointed to South Florida (Miami), Vegas or Pittsburgh. Chicago has a strong history with Pittsburgh.

I agree with all of your opinions since we are talking about hypothetical situation here.

Before I give my next opinion, lets look at Ralph Capone's (Al's brother) situation during the 30s and 40s. Ralph went to prison on tax evasion charges and was released when his brother was already sent to prison. Ralph was the capo or leader of the old Cicero/South Side crew with the Fischettis being his prime lieutenants, but if you check out the Chicago Tribune archives you'll notice that the media was all over Ralph from the mid 1930s until 1950, meaning he wasnt able to lift a finger without the Chi media knowing about it. Thats why by the mid 40s Ralph probably relinquished his position and gave to his successor Charlie Fish, who in turn by 1945/46 was the acting boss of the Outfit. By the late 40s or early 50s Ralph went to Wisconsin where he operated the coin machine racket, and got away from the spotlight.

It seems Ralph didnt much respected his brother out of obvious reasons, because after Al's death he didnt care much about Al's family or in plane words, by the late 1950s he wasnt spendind a dime on them. That job fell on Ricca, Guzik and Humphreys but thats another story.

My point is that both Ralph and Albert Capone were having a lot of problems because of their last name and in fact, Albert changed his last name because of that. So I strongly believe that if he was sane, Al Capone was probably going to be sent to either Wisconsin or some other state in which the Outfit had some "not so important" influece or income. Vegas and Miami were too important for the Chi family and I dont think that Capone was going to be able to run things, again because of the previous reasons.

Capone was released shortly before the second conflict with the Northsiders and again who knows, maybe they were going to retaliate....just saying, since we are talking here regarding "what if?". The Northsiders at the time knew that Ricca was Capones real successor and when Ricca went to jail, thats when they began their powerplay.

Regarding Ricca...i know that he respected Capone and took care of both of his "families", but I also think that none of them was above the organization, meaning lets imagine that Capone was going to be stubborn and ask for one of the top or leading spots and with all the heat which came with him....what do you think that Ricca, Fischetti or Accardo were going to do about it? Click, click...BANG!!! (especially the younger generation under Giancana and Battaglia). But as @Liggio already said, it seems Capone wasnt that power hungry ONLY within the ranks of his own organization, but lets not forget that even though the Northsiders belonged to his crime family, still I dont think he trusted them 100%,including the old Sicilian remnants from around the Chi Heights area.

During the 40s and early 50s the government still didnt know much about the Outfit and in fact, they still labelled them as the Capone Mob, and so if they killed Capone (if sane and alive), do you think that the media and government were going to think that the organization was headless, something which obviously was going to be "good" for the syndicate? Again, who knows?! Lol

Some great points. What amazed me is how strong ricca and accardo felt for Capone. For them to be paying for his family up to the 60s long after capones death shows the respect the organisation had for him. In that treacherous life that is unheard of. But yes I agree with points above - sane or not there was no place for him taking an active role in the outfit - rackets had changed and his high celebrity profile would’ve made it impossible. He is literally the most famous gangster ever internationally and it was the same then. He would’ve collected his pension and cashed in tons of investments/stashes that he would’ve remembered with his mind intact.

I completely agree. The old guard under Ricca really took care of their own people and as you already said, even years after his death they still took care of his family and it wasnt just Capone and his family, but also the families of Nitto, Capezio and even some non-Ital leaders. It seems that with Riccas and Accardos approval, the main guys who were in charge for the "job" were Guzik and later Humphreys. But we must not forget that they supported only the families which really needed help, meaning there were situations (like in Nittos or Campagnas case, dont remember) when the families werent able to find the hidden cash of their deceased ones and so they needed help from the Outfit.

And when the younger generation under Giancana came on the scene, they stopped supporting Capones and other families of deceased members and associates, although some more influential members continued to send support on their own. When one of Alexs close associates died and left his family in poverty, at the funeral Alex passed his hat and collected a good amount of cash for them, or when Battaglia became boss he allegedly financially supported the wife of the late Capezio. And I also want to say that even though he was only 2 years older then Giancana, still it seems that Accardo was way more "old school" and followed the rules.

I also agree regarding your statement about Capone, meaning his time was over and there wasnt much space in the Outfit for him anymore and was probably going to end up semi-retired boss either in Wisconsin together with his brother Ralph, or in Miami.

Interesting to note is that the old guard under Capone went through so much stress and paranoia during the 1920s and 30s, and thats why most of them died of natural causes by the 1950s (Fischetti, D'Andrea, Heeney, Maddox, Hunt, Ammiratto, Campagna, Guzik, Roti Sr etc.) and rarely reached the 7th decade of their lives, except for "few" guys like Ricca, LaPorte, Prio or Ralph Capone who all died during the early 1970s. My point is that maybe Capone was going to die the same way as his old cohorts during the 50s...just saying.

Capone was great during his time but in my opinion has become way too overrated. I cant stand it when someone with no knowledge of Organized crime thinks Al Capone is who people should identify with when it comes to the mob. Always some old c@nt who couldnt tell you who Anthony Casso was or even Roy Demeo.

Al Capone is an icon, don't hate, congratulate.

"Oh you are from Chicago, do you know where Al Capone's house is?"

Me : " Capone is ok, but I can tell you where Angelo the Hook used to live. He was a bad ass fucking gangster."

Really interesting stuff TD. Accardo only 2 years older than Momo - never would’ve thought that. Always look at them as a generation apart which they were in everything but age. Shows how ahead accardo was - he was trying to step back at the same time momo wanted top spot.

Interesting point about the guys who came up in the 20/30s. Street life takes it toll! Unreal to think that Capone was no 1 in his mid 20s and passed in his late 40s.

Thats right although I believe that Accardo allegedly relinquishing his position as boss on his own is somehow a myth. I say this because there was a conflict between Ricca and Accardo at the time allegedly because Accardo screw up some rackets and also kept money from Ricca and the Westsiders in some conspiracy, and didnt want to step down as boss, and so Giancana taking the spot and Accardo being elevated next to Ricca was some sort of peace agreement. Stay tuned because one very good article is coming quite soon regarding that same situation.

Interesting. Look forward to seeing this article, will keep a lookout for it

In addition, heres the info regarding Capones family situation after his death...

That's good stuff right there TD. They really did take care of their own. That part about the widows and all the overhead. I hope that article you're talking about dealing with Ricca and Accardo is one of those ones you write. Reminiscent of your past work.

If Capone never contracted syphilis and only maybe chlamydia then I can definitely see him running Chicago for 40 or 50 years

Thanks and you're always welcome bud. Another interesting statement made by Humphreys is regarding they having one big family, meaning high level non-itals were considered part of the family, Same as when he and Ferraro also said in another convo that "this is all one clique". Regarding the Ricca and Accardo article is completely written in my own style and it might be also posted as a short youtube documentary. We shall see..

Btw, here's the convo between Ferraro and Humphreys regarding the Outfit being "all one clique" since the days of "Al" Capone, something which corresponds with the previous convo regarding they all being one big family...