Some of ya’ll read my post about the mafia and cosa nostra. And thanks yall for all youre answers.

But by reading about the history of the mafia, cosa nostra and camorra in the US. I was wondering many things, and I hope ya’ll could explain me some of those things.

So…we know, when the Mafia came to the US, the mafia was strickly an sicilian thing. You had to be sicilian to be a member of the mafia.
There was also the Camorra present in the borough of Brooklyn. And the Mafia and Camorra had a war from 1915 to 1917, which the mafia won.

Then I read more, and saw that Al Capone and Vito Genovese were not Sicilians… Al Capone was born in Brooklyn from parents from Angri, a commune outside of Naples. And Vito Genovese was born in Tufino near Naples. *** Vito Genovese was close with many members of the Camorra of Brooklyn, but I don’t know if he was a member of the Camorra (maybe one of ya’ll got something for this matter)

So, I was wondering, were Al Capone and Vito Genovese were made men of the Mafia ? Or were they only what you would called italian gangsters ?
And when Lucky Luciano won the Castellammarese War, Al Capone and Vito Genovese could become made men of this new organization, the US cosa nostra ?
I guess, Vito Genovese became a made guy, since he was the boss of the Family, and the family got his name. But, was he a made guy before the Castellammarese War? And if no, could he had been made in the mafia? Even if he’s not sicilian ?

I read somehwere that Al Capone didn’t really like the mafia, the sicilians and they way of revenge. Like the sicilian took the revenge thing too seriously, like wanting to kill a guy for revenge, because the guy killed the grandfather of the wife of youre cousin in Sicily….. the words of a sicilian never forget….that shit real lolll.

So…
- al capone and genovese were made guy in the US cosa nostra ?
- could they had been made guys in the mafia before Castellammarese War ?

Also,after the Castellammarese War, the sicilian thing didn’t matter anymore, you had to be italian. Thats one of the reason I think the mafia and cosa nostra is two different organizations, with many thing in common, and with time, the two word merge for the two groups, those in sicily, and those in the US.

I read that made guys from Sicily could become made guy in the US and vice versa. But, this person had to be sicilian ? For exemple, John Gotti, his family came from a place near Naples, so he was not Sicilian, could he had been made in a Mafia family from Sicily also ?

The Chicago "Outfit" under Torrio and Capone was never a Mafia family. There was a "Mafia" of sorts in Chicago--the Unione Siciliana--an influential, mostly political, organization that Capone and other gangsters (like the Sicilian Gennas) tried to dominate. The Unione later changed its name and opened up to non-Sicilians.

The NY Families were inducting non-Sicilians by the late Twenties. If I recall correctly, Valachi , a non-Sicilian, testified that he was made by Bonanno around 1929. Capone was never made. Genovese, Costello and Anastasia all were future Dons of non-Sicilian birth. I don't believe there's any record of them being formally made, although they might have been. Fat Vinny Teresa, former New England mafioso turned rat, in his autobiography said there was no formal "making" ceremony in New England--"they just called you to the Office one day and told you that you were in."

Charlie Luciano invited Capone to be a member of the Commission. Luciano, born in Sicily, was a thoroughly modern American businessman, and he sought help and support all around. Jews--Lansky, Siegel, Dutch Shultz--sat with the Commission at times, although they weren't voting members.

I don't think there was any formal reciprocity between Sicilian and American Mafiosi. Plenty of Canadian and Sicilian Mafiosi were in the Bonanno Family and some served in high places. But as far as I know, they were never formally "made" in the Bonannos--obviously didn't need to be to do their jobs. For that matter, Jimmy Burke, 100% Irish, was the equivalent of a crew chief in the Lucchese Family, and some said that Hugh "Apples" McIntosh. another non-Italian, was nominally Persico's bodyguard but most said he was really Persico's' informal consigliere.

Nice infos,

Thnks for the Unione Siciliana, I will check this out.

For non-sicilians, I guess they became made men, since they were members of cosa nostra in the US. And became bosses.

For the canadians, in montreal, many made guys were made in canadian families (I guess) but were not mades in the bonnannos. Just like philly guys were made in the philly family, but not with the family in NYc.

But, could a non-sicilian who is made in one of the five families of new york, or another family in an american city, could also become a made man in a family in Sicily ?

Also, for Al Capone, if I understand.
He was never made? So he was never in the mafia or cosa nostra ?
He was simply a powerful italian gangster ?

Yes, basically a very powerful Italian gangster. He cooperated with Mafia families and Mafiosi when it suited him, in effect like one big businessman doing business with other big businessmen. He also fought Mafiosi, like the Gennas and Frankie Yale (formerly his mentor and ally). During the Castellammarese War he took sides with Joe (the Boss) Masseria, leader of the family that eventually became Genovese. But, His chief rivals in Chicago were the Northsiders, with Irish and Polish leaders.

As a Napolitani he was allied as a kid and young adult with Brooklyn's Camorra (think Frankie Yale, Toddo Del duca, Little Augie Pisano). That's why when he relocated to Chicago he was in the employ of Big Jim Colisimo (another non-Sicilian). But at some point as Turnbull says he allied with Joe (The Boss) Masseria in NYC to help him fight the Aiellos in Chicago, who were Sicilians and allied with Maranzano.

To help in this effort and to better control the Windy City, thats why Masseria DID induct Capone into the ranks of the Mafia, thereafter elevating him to the rank of Caporegime over the City of Chicago. Capone in turn inducted the likes of Tony Accardo and others as soldiers.

Otherwise there would not have been a formal Cosa Nostra structure there, nor wood Chicago (Capone) have been included on The Commission or in its meetings.

There's some evidence to suggest that Capone was a Camorra member before he became part of Cosa Nostra. In 1928, Joe Masseria inducted Capone into his Family and promoted him to Capodecina with the authority to make 10 members in Chicago. So Capone started off as a Camorrista and was then brought into the Masseria Family despite operating in Chicago. After the Castellammarese war when Salvatore Maranzano became Capo Dei Capi, he officially recognised Capone as the Rappresentante of the Chicago Family. Then after Maranzano's murder, Capone was given a founding seat on the Commission.


IIRC there's also some evidence that Genovese was a Camorra member. He was an inducted member of the Masseria Family by the 1920s as well anyway and was promoted to Sottocapo when Luciano took over.

Laurence Bergreen, one of the better Capone biographers, writes that Frankie Yale was Big Jim Colosimo's assassin. He says he did it to expand his reach into Chicago by knocking off old, fat, lovelorn Big Jim, and displace Torrio, a former ally. It backfired: Big Jim's murder cemented Torrio's hold on the organization.
Although Yale was indicted for the murder (charge dismissed when witness "forgotti"), I find this story hard to believe.

The Chicago outfit were just an organized crime and not a mafia family. For what I can find on the net.
They had many italians, that were not sicilians. And also non-italian members.
Look like the outfits became cosa nostra after they became member of the national organized crime found by Luciano.

It would be nice a tv show about the history of the italians organized crime in the US during those days.
Like boardwalk empire, but more focusing on the organizations like the begging with the Black Hand, after the mafia-camorra war, and then the cosa nostra and the commission

Al Capone was associated with the Camorra in New York before leaving to Chicago and was made into the Camorra once in Chicago. He was later made by Masseria around 1928 along with 9 other members of Capone gang, and was given the power to induct other members into the organization. This was after Tony Lombardo was killed, which leads me to believe that the Sicilians were divided as one group went with Joe Aiello and the other group went with Capone hence why Masseria made Al Capone. By 1930, Capone had inducted another 40 to 50 members into his organization, plus another 20 to 30 members joined his organization who were under the control of Ross Prio of the Northside, as well as the Sicilians that followed Lombardo. When Joe Aiello was killed in 1930, those members either fled, some were killed in the following months, while others joined with Al Capone such as James Emery of Chicago Chicago Heights even though Frank LiParota was allied with Capone, Emery controlled CHC, and Frank Caruso of Chinatown who was demoted and was replaced by Ralph Pierce.

Vito Genovese was actually involved in stealing from pushcarts, running errands for the Camorra members. In 1916 he was sentenced to one year in prison for a concealed firearm. After he got out he was made into the Camorra Manhattan faction who was at war with the Morello family. Once the war was over the Camorra was absorbed into the other families, mainly the Genovese and Gambino families took the most. Vito Genovese would also be made by Masseria in either 1926 or 1927.

In short both Capone and Genovese were made into the Camorra before being made officially with the Sicilians.

Vito while in Nola, Italy, became involved in the local Camorra his family was already involved at least one of his nephews was a big shot shot dead early 1980s.