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El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa #946230
07/09/18 05:56 PM
07/09/18 05:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 305
Stubbs Offline OP
Capo
Stubbs  Offline OP
Capo
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 305
Below is evidence coming out during the El Chapo trial in Brooklyn. Emphasis is the original author's and not mine.

Quote

Redacted material revealed, a peek at governments evidence that El Chapo was never Sinaloa Cartel leader


Borderland Beat followers:

Some of you are upset I removed a document from my post titled The document, which is a letter of reply, includes redacted material, essentially naming 9 pieces of evidence from 41 in the hands of the government. The government disclosed as having this evidence, without producing additional context with respect to the potentially exculpatory evidence, indicating El Chapo was not the top leader of the Sinaloa Cartel, and never had been. This is one of the charges against him. Only now, two months before trial, that the defense was made aware that such evidence existed.

There appears to have been a malfunction with the government website, possibly in the process of uploading the document on to the website, whereas the redacted information could be compromised.

This was revealed to me, by a BB follower, who determined how to expose the reacted material, that is under the text, and blackened out in a court filing. Although it is not the entire list of material the government has, it gives a glimpse into what is claimed.

When the error was discovered, the document was then prohibited in accessing by the public. I decided at that time to remove the document from my BB post and my Scribd page, along with the revealed information the BB follower had posted on comments.

However, after thinking about it for a day, I have proceeded with this post I had in draft and share it with readers, revealing the 9 points of evidence disclosed.

It begins from 1999, which at the time the government determined there was no premier leader governing but rather leaderless allied groups. From 2002 that perception changes. On the following page.....


First count in the indictment. Count 1 charges that from 1989 to 2014, Mr. Guzmán engaged in a continuing criminal enterprise and that he “occupied supervisory and management positions,” and was “one of several principal administrators, organizers and leaders of the continuing criminal enterprise.” Doc. No. 14 at 5; see also 21 U.S.C. § 848(b).


That the government can claim with a straight face that those specific items are not favorable or exculpatory strains credulity. For example:

Item 4 states
That the “government has information from 1999, that there was no particular leader of the alliance among the defendant, Arturo Beltran Leyva, Guero Palma and el Azul.

Item 5 states
That the “government has information from 2002 that the defendant was a lieutenant of Mayo’s

Item 9 states
that the “government has information from 2007 that Mayo was the ‘king’ of trafficking in Mexico, and was stronger than the defendant

Item 10 states
that the “government has information from 2007 that the defendant was an “enforcer” for the Sinaloa Cartel, El Azul was the “brains,” and Mayo was the leader of the Sinaloa Cartel

Item 11 states
that the “government has information from 2007 that the defendant and Alfredo Beltran Leyva (“Mochomo”) worked under Mayo

Item 12 states
That the “government has information from 2008 that the defendant did not take any action without the approval of El Azul and Mayo

Item 19 states

That the “government has information from 2009 that one or more individuals believed ‘Mayo’ was the leader of ‘all of the mafia in Mexico,’ and not the defendant as most people believed

Item 21 states that

The “government has information from 2010 that Mayo was the head of the Sinaloa Cartel and conflicting information that the defendant had ascended to the head of the Cartel.”

Item 23 states

That the “government has information from 2011 that Mayo was higher ranking than the defendant, that Mayo told the defendant what to do and that Mayo was satisfied the public perception is that the defendant is the head of the Sinaloa Cartel, because it allowed Mayo to keep a lower profile because law enforcement’s focus was on the defendant.”



Link to original article


"It wasn't very good parsley to begin with, and then the cat went and peed on it." -Sicilian proverb
Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #946238
07/09/18 08:05 PM
07/09/18 08:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 298
D
doggystyle Offline
Capo
doggystyle  Offline
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Capo
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 298
I remember Freeway Rick Ross said in a interview that he wouldnt be suprised if El Chapo wasnt that rich as they say and if he wasnt the boss.. He said he had read many times about big shots that was reffered as the "biggest" in the game of a certain place but then he knew there was someone who was bigger than him but people didnt know about him..

Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #946247
07/09/18 08:37 PM
07/09/18 08:37 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
TonyG Offline
Capo
TonyG  Offline
Capo
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
It has been well known that Ismael Zambada García, aka "El Mayo" has been in charge of Sinaloa. El Chapo was an operational chief and enforcer. He spilled alot of blood and gets headlines for that reason. El Mayo stays below the radar. No different than LCN leadership structure.


Best way to catch the smart ones? Get an idiot working for them.
Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #946261
07/10/18 12:32 AM
07/10/18 12:32 AM
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 865
M
MightyDR Offline
Underboss
MightyDR  Offline
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 865
Interesting stuff. Thanks Stubbs.

Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #946269
07/10/18 07:59 AM
07/10/18 07:59 AM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 7,236
naples,italy
furio_from_naples Offline
furio_from_naples  Offline

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 7,236
naples,italy
The Sinaloa cartel is divided in factions,now the el chapo faction is led by his son el chapito and the zampata faction is the leader.

Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #947660
07/21/18 11:13 PM
07/21/18 11:13 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,590
J
jace Offline
Suspended
jace  Offline
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Underboss
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Posts: 3,590
I believe it, there can't be one person running everything in such a massive amount of drug operations.

Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #947705
07/22/18 09:56 AM
07/22/18 09:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 889
North Jersey
ItalianIrishMix Offline
Underboss
ItalianIrishMix  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 889
North Jersey
Sounds like his ONLY defense to curtail the time in prison.....The old, I HAD to do what I was told from my boss or else he would kill me, defense.

I am not buying it.

The Genovese used this method due to constant surveillance but in Mexico, I SERIOUSLY doubt that such a move is necessary.

Last edited by ItalianIrishMix; 07/22/18 09:57 AM.
Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: jace] #947844
07/23/18 01:30 AM
07/23/18 01:30 AM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 23,884
H
Hollander Offline
Hollander  Offline
H

Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 23,884
Originally Posted by jace
I believe it, there can't be one person running everything in such a massive amount of drug operations.


And not without the support of Mexico's governing elite, including politicians, military and police.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: ItalianIrishMix] #947845
07/23/18 01:46 AM
07/23/18 01:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,590
J
jace Offline
Suspended
jace  Offline
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J
Underboss
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,590
Originally Posted by ItalianIrishMix
Sounds like his ONLY defense to curtail the time in prison.....The old, I HAD to do what I was told from my boss or else he would kill me, defense.

I am not buying it.

The Genovese used this method due to constant surveillance but in Mexico, I SERIOUSLY doubt that such a move is necessary.


They are giving him life, I think that was decided long ago.

Re: El Chapo may not have been the top boss of Sinaloa [Re: Stubbs] #981260
11/20/19 08:13 AM
11/20/19 08:13 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,166
GangstersInc Offline
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GangstersInc  Offline
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Posts: 1,166


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