I am reading Five Families (great book) and it conspires during cross examination from Thomas Dewey that Luciano rolled on a drug dealer to evade prison when he was 25.

Surely this makes him a rat? Or does what he did after this event in his life cancel all of that out?

Pretty sure he snitched on some Jewish kids. A rats a rat, doesn't matter if he didn't rat again.

He was a known rat. That whole code of silence omerta bullshit didn't mean anything to him. He only cared about making money and staying in power.

Was he not meeting someone to write a book about his life as well before he died, that to me makes you a rat as well just like Bonanno.

THink it was a movie based on his life.

Your right Muk it was a film, either way just as bad.

I thought he gave up his own stash and said it was someone elses? They mentioned this in the behind the scenes of boardwalk empire.

So they claim he gave up a couple of jews as a kid, he never gave up any of his friends, quite the contrary, he made them all very, very rich and powerful..These guys give info on their rivals all the time

That has nothing to do with it, he was a rat.

Has anyone one seen that movie based on Bonanno's book? I caught the last half of it on satellite a while back.

Dixie I watched it, the film was actually all filmed in Montreal. There were many that shit on the movie but I enjoyed it.

I agree with Tommy. A rat is a rat! Same goes for Michael Franzese!

They're all rats. It just depends on who they ratted to. Some gave info to law enforcement, others gave info to their bosses and capos on fellow soldiers and underlings. A strong boss reigns not only through fear and respect, but also good informants, aka "rats".

And TommyGambino, Lucchese was the biggest informant of them all. He just ratted on mafia to the mafia. The people he ratted on didn't go to jail. They got whacked. So which is worse?

No, don't try and twist it round because you're hero ratted.

I've often had the same thought, I never understood why he got a pass but people reviled Bonnano.
Lanky did the same thing to Waxy Gordon if I'm not mistaken, and Carlo,whom Gotti called a " rat motherfucker, back doors mother fucker" did it to Genovese, Ormento, Gigante, Galante, all kinda heavyweights.
Carlo also rewarded Colombo for ratting out his bosses.
There is even an Al Profit documentary on Frank Matthews, and the guy was convinced Castellano and Gambino sicked the DEA on him cause he moved on Todt Hill.
And Alfa is kinda right... Guys like Genovese killed Mafiosi who "ratted out" other Mafiosi to him.
The thing is, the WORST gangsters win, it's something a lotta people don't get.
Also ive said it before, soldiers know the rules, respect the rules, live and die by the rules.
Bosses understand, THERE ARE NO RULES, it's an illusion created for control...
I love the ending of the novel THE Sicilian, where Vito sells out Turi Guiliano, and Michael is all hurt like " Pop, how could you do it, he's a hero?" And Vito is like, " Yeah, son heroes, that ain't us, we're the BAD GUYS, you better fuckin learn quick if you want to stay alive" lol

I don't know what he did or didn't do but bottom line is if you cooperate with law enforcement in ANY way whatsoever then you are a rat. It don't matter who you are. No exceptiOn to this rule.

Ooh, I forgot one, in the Outfit, the heirs of Capone, they apparently fed Capones info to the IRS to get rid of him, so there is that too lol

Put it this way, a lot of these guys read The Prince right?
“You must recognize that there are two ways of fighting: by means of law, and by means of force. The first belongs properly to man, the second to animals; but since the first is often insufficient, it is necessary to resort to the second. Therefore, a prince must know how to use both what is proper to man and what is proper to beasts”

Excerpt From: Machiavelli, Niccolò. “The Prince.” Bantam Classic, 2012-02-22. iBooks.
This material may be protected by copyright.

Check out this book on the iBooks Store: https://itun.es/us/Zkucz.l

Wolves and Snakes and Lions, oh my lol Ok I'm finished lol

to give you a one word answer: No!

if we let history be the judge,then no Lucky is not a rat and will not be remembered as such.

Rat A' Tat-Tat!

Another spot on analysis Cabrini, bravo!!!

This is stated in Gus Russo's "The Outfit", while there is some suspicion that guys like Humphreys, Giancana, Accardo & Battaglia fed the IRS agents info to get rid of Capone. There isn't much to support the claim. Also, Russo points out that Humphrey's & Guzik actually tried and managed to fix the jury for Capone, and it worked, they got to some of the jurors. Problem was, the judge and prosecutors found this out right before the case began and on a whim, switched juries at the beginning of the trial. Which angered Capone and the rest of the guys, especially Humphrey's, because that wasn't an easy job to get to THOSE jurors, as they were sequestered. And he felt it was all for nothing, his work that is.

Giancana? Was thinking more along the line of the Italian guys, Ricca, Campagna, it makes sense the non-Italian faction would try to help Capone, empowering him empowers themselves..
Then again, would the Fischettis have gone along with that? Probably not....

I think it was possible, same way Al Capone probably set up Torrio...It makes sense to me cause that Luciano - Chicago click seemed to walk the same walk and think the same, they all seem to operate similarly.
I could even see them getting the idea from NewYork after Waxey...

I meant to type Ricca, but ended up thinking of Giancana while also mentioning Accardo. I not too sure Campagna would've been involved in a plot like that, he was supposedly pretty loyal to Capone. And Curly Humphrey's was well on his way up prior to Capone even being indicted. Humphrey's was the working force behind a lot of Capone's business takeovers. I don't think anyone was necessarily trying to get rid of Capone, or that one of his guys were feeding the tax guys info. I'm not sure they ever did. This was covered in "The Outfit" as well. Capone's tax indictment was literally something of happenstance somewhat. A bookmaking and gambling den that he controlled was raided at one point. I forget which law enforcement agency it was, but they basically found a book which had listed Capone's gambling assets, and the money he was making from the alcohol and other things. Nobody initially thought anything of it, and it was kept locked in a file cabinet for some years. While investigating Capone, that book was one of the things that was looked into, and they saw that his earnings for that time period didn't match what he was putting into his taxes. One thing led to another and he was indicted. However, after Capone was put away, guys did little to help him out on an appeal, which supposedly could've been a real option.

This supposed stash that he allegedly gave up, was discovered in a property which was owned by Steve Armone. This is mentioned in the book "The Mob & The City", the author himself had access to documentation which proved this actually did happen, but that documentation which goes into detail, is no longer available. Would Steve Armone not be considered a friend to Luciano?

Whether he was a rat or not he was well respected by the majority of the underworld at the time and was deffered to as such. If he was really considered a rat I don't think many of his peers would have went along with his plans to control the country or tri state.

Reading Five Families and it's amazing how many of the old bosses ratted each other out and snitched on each other to get ahead.

Colombo sold out his own cousin to become boss.

Luciano was a master backstabber.

The Gambino family was founded on treachery.

Dude, that book, out of the many,many of mob books i own is by far, probably 1 of THE best of books ever written on our subjects..Mr. Rabb is untouchable on the subject.Worth every $$!!