Who was better?

Try to back it up with evidence as well

I don't know after all it is baseball?

But I do know who will get into the hall of fame sooner that's Jeter.

Comparable players. Rose was more of a slap hitter. Jeter probably has a little more pop in his bat. Both of them tremendous hustlers who never dogged it, so I can see the comparison.

I agree. Personally I'm picking jeter. Jeter has been called overrated many times before but I think it's pretty evident that pete rose is probably more so than jeter.

The only reason why charlie hustle never got into the hall of fame because he bet on his own team to win.

It not like he bet on them to lose. Some baseball people actually believe their shit don't stink.

He should have been voted in a decade ago or sooner.

I am a big fan of both. Both are clutch players that shine when the spotlight and pressure is on them. Both lead by example and are known for their hustle and instinct. Rose was a more versatile player that played every position except pitcher and catcher. The Reds needed a 3rd baseman to take over when Tony Perez went to first and Rose steps in and the Big Red Machine kept humming along. I think Jeter has played more games at shortstop than anyone in major league history.

I would like to have either one on my all time team.

Derek Jeter hands down……and thats my completely unbiased opinion

PB what's your opinion on the Pete Rose situation?

I personally think they should let him in. Bigger scumbags and thugs than Pete Rose get honored by these organizations all the time.

That being said, he's a cautionary tale. Actions have consequences.

Pizza you never made it to the Harlem reunion right?

Why don't you take your parents to the next Giglio lift.

Giglio Feast August 9 to August 12
www.eastharlemgiglio.org

My Mother's been gone for more than ten years. And I've told you before that my Dad is on the Giglio committee. I've never missed that feast in my life. And that link you provided is for a website a buddy of mine helped design for Father Pete at Mount Carmel. The Church does almost all of the legwork for that society, and they take whatever help they can get. This guy built that website for peanuts.

As far as the reunion, I honestly forgot about it. Maybe we'll see you in August, though .

I don't watch baseball, i am interested in these sports versus (thank god it's not another lucky vs Chin ) matches though, especially if their backed up with reasoning that would help me understand the sport more. Here's the Rose and Jeter stat pages. Can i ask if both are similar enough players to compare, or is this an overall impact thread?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/rosepe01.shtml

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/j/jeterde01.shtml

Pete can say something no other human will be able to say ever again, i was tombstoned by Kane after my human-chicken disguise was rumbled

I actually agree. If you look at the stats it's just so evident. And defensively jeter stuck to a tougher position that rose wouldn't have been able to play.

I would have to go with Jeter simply for the fact it's so hard to find a SS these days that has done what he has done.

As for Pete he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame.

cant wait to tell my kids "i saw jeter play"

As with most comparisons of players from different eras, a purely statistical approach isn't too helpful, but theoretical comparisons are always fun. And sizing up Captain Clutch with Charlie Hustle is a nice study. I've had the pleasure to see both play.

While their careers are only separated by a gap of roughly ten seasons, the eras, in which they played are stark. Rose began the first six or seven years of his career in a golden age of pitching, so dominant that baseball lowered pitching mounds to the present height after 1968 and instituted the DH in the AL in the early 1970s. Conversely, Jeter began his career in the mid-90s when baseball witnessed its most dramatic offensive explosion, especially in power numbers due to cozier parks, a tighter baseball, recent expansion and performance enhancing substances, both legal and illegal.

I've always maintained that Rose was the only player I saw, for whom there is no adequate comparison among his peers or subsequent players (He's probably the closest thing to Ty Cobb the game has seen with respect to his approach). He didn't hit a lot of homers and even for his time his homerun seasons were slightly below average, but he was an extraordinary gap hitter, who'd be among league leaders in doubles, and actually has more than twice the triples of Jeter, who had more foot speed.

As a young Phillie fan, I was always most afraid of facing Pete Rose in that Big Red Machine lineup because he always found a way on base and was usually the starting point of the rally. The Phillies signed Rose and it was clear that he was the reason for getting a championship for the team that without him would win 100 games a season, but lose in the playoffs. Any member of the 1980 Phillies would attest to this and any player of the Big Red Machine, not named Johnny Bench, would enthusiastically credit Rose as the primary factor in the runs and wins they accumulated.

Jeter can lay claim to similar testimony. He had more power than Rose, but Rose was a better hitter, certainly a better lead-off hitter. Now if Jeter played in the 70s he'd likely adjust his approach and have fewer homers while probably having more hits than his present total. Similarly, Pete Rose in the 90s would modify his approach and have seasons of 20+ HRs as the homerun was more attainable and a bigger part of the game. He would also sacrifice some base hits in the process.



Defensively, Jeter played a better shortstop than Rose played third, second and first even though Rose was certainly a good fielder and was more versatile than Jeter. What's often forgotten is that in 8 seasons in the outfield early in his career, Rose won two gold gloves. And that's with NL outfielders, like Brock, Mays, Clemente and others. Jeter also won gold gloves deservedly. While both players are very good defensively, I don't think either can be argued as the best defensive player at his position during his time in the game. Yet both have made many memorable heads-up plays (Jeter tossing out Jeremy Giambi at the plate in the play-offs and Rose snatching the ninth inning foul ball that popped out of Bob Boone's glove).

In the end I cast my biased vote with Rose, but it doesn't matter, does it? There are hundreds of things you can toss back and forth on this, and I don't blame the Jeter fans for picking him. One thing's certain: Jeter will leave a greater legacy due to Pete's indiscretions. I love Pete, and have met him maybe a dozen times at various signings. I relived some distinctly wonderful memories with him, and learned that after winning the 1980 World Series, he spent the night babysitting Aaron and Bret Boone, so their dad could celebrate with the team.

I would love in my heart to see Rose reinstated and admitted to the Hall, but my head tells me that his ban, like Shoeless Joe Jackson's, is justified.

I respect your opinion, but I respectfully disagree. Pete Rose is one of the greatest of all time. Same with jeter. But I don't think pete rose could possess Jeter's power and hit as many home runs as him in his era or jeter's era. I also think that jeter was just in general a better hitter if you look at how many hits he averages per season and his batting average. His OBP is also slightly higher than Rose's. We all have our biases but I'm not biased. I feel that arod was a better SS than jeter and I hate arod. Maybe we should just be thankful that we got to see all these great players play ball.

Oh I agree. You can't put rose in without Jackson. Jackson is one player I would've loved to have seen play. Both deserve to be in the hof, but I agree the ban is justified.

I don't question that Jeter had more power than Rose in either era. I just maintain if they played in the same era, the gap in the homerun totals would be more narrow. Conversely, if they were in the same era, Rose's advantage in extra-base hits would be smaller.

In the comparison of career stats it might be helpful to remove Rose's past 5 seasons as he played until he was 44/45. Still they are statistically similar.

As I said that Rose has no adequate comparison in his own and subsequent generations, I always felt that his approach, stance, style of hitting, aggressiveness and base running (minus the stealing) make him the closest thing to Ty Cobb that the game has seen. It would have been something to see these two play against each other in a World Series.

I agree with you that A-Rod was a better ss than Jeter, which isn't to say of course that Jeter was deficient. A-Rod's range and arm were better. When he came to NY, I thought it was nevertheless wise to move A-Rod to third, not only for chemistry, but that A-Rod was better suited to make the change.

I think n interesting comparison with Jeter is Cal Ripken. Not only did their careers overlap somewhat, but they were both tall shortstops, a rarity until 20-30 years ago.

Yes I agree. Say what you want about arod but in his prime he was a hell of a player. With or without roids he was talented. No question about that. Just can't stand his prima dona ways

These comparison debates are futile. They were both great players in their respective eras. The HOF has become tainted and will continue to be a point of contention. I don't like that most of it revolves around statistical compilation. So you were lucky enough to be healthy and pitch 23 years and compile 300 wins. How about a guy like Don Mattingly who may have had the best 5 year stretch of any player. I was lucky to cheer for the Yankees for many years and see great players; Jeter among the best. Pete Rose? Great player, entertaining, gave the fans a thrill. Both guys did that. No need for comparisons.

True indeed.

I agree. Mattingly should be in the hof imo. And both are great players no doubt. I just think jeter was significantly better. But like I said both are hof material.

After thinking about it again today, I have to say that if you look at pete rose he really wasn't as valuable as jeter. He played 4 more season than jeter too. And jeter's stats are just signifigantly better than Rose's. Better average, averaged more hits per season, higher OBP, more gold gloves, more clutch(postseason hitting), more home runs, and just overall a better defensive player at a higher valued position than rose played. Compare Jeter's best season to Rose's MVP season and Jeter has the better season hands down. No disrespect to Pete Rose, but all of the records that he holds are a result of him playing so long and he actually hurt his team towards the end. I still believe he should be in the hof when deemed eligible because if you have the record for most hits then you should be in. First ballot is debatable but he should be in. If he has the most hits of all time, why is he never really put in the same breath as guys like Ruth, mays, Williams, Musial, Gwynn etc. His numbers do not stack up against any if theirs.

I get defending Pete Rose is like defending John Gotti, however I agree with the bulk of your thoughts. I disagree that you discount how much Jeter has hurt the Yankees the last few years, and I argue that the "only reason Rose has the records is because he played so long" that's kind of a no shit and he had to have been wanted by a club to play all those years. Still the amount of hits, runs, doubles and life chaos he created have a lot of worth. Agree he's not better than Jeter I will say it's not a slam dunk. If Rose played in New York he'd have been a messiah!

Jeter had much more God given talent than Rose and obviously played in a different era.
Rose hangs out almost every day at a memorabilia shop in Vega$ in the corridor between Mandalay Bay and Luxor.
Next time one of us are in Vega$ we should ask him LOL I have a feeling I know what his answer will be! (He's still an egomaniac)
No disrespect to Jeter but I'll take Rose because he was the single fiercest competitor I ever saw play the game. Just a son of a bitch that would do anything to win, just like Ty Cobb. The 1971? All Star game collision at home plate with Ray Fosse pretty much defines what the guy was.

Apples and oranges.

Rose was a fierce competitor. So's Jeter, and I've always liked the way that he carries himself. He's a great Yankee, and a great competitor, and when the Hall comes calling on the first ballot, it will be well deserved.

But when it comes to all-time, all-around shortstops, he's not even in the top five, maybe even top ten.

No argument on any of the above, where you put him on list if too ten Yankees?