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Looking Ridiculous #746759
11/01/13 03:28 PM
11/01/13 03:28 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466
Stewartstown, PA
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VitoC Offline OP
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VitoC  Offline OP
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When Tom goes to see Woltz in Part I, Woltz tells him that Johnny Fontaine made him look ridiculous, and that "...a man in my position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous!!!"

Excuse me?!?! This is coming from a pedophile!!! To say that a person his age and his position of authority who has sex with girls who almost certainly wouldn't feel like they could say no looks "ridiculous" is the mildest thing that could be said.

Not only that, but as someone once argued (possibly on this forum), doesn't he also look ridiculous by not giving Johnny the part, rather than by giving it to him? He himself says that Johnny is perfect for the role, and he's the director--so giving the role to the person most suited for it would not only show he had good sense in choosing actors, but by enhancing the movie, would make him more money as well.

It would have been interesting to see what Woltz would have said if Tom had made these points to him. Tom could have also said: "A man in Don Corleone's position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous either." For a Mafia boss, looking weak is not just embarrassing--it's dangerous.

Last edited by VitoC; 11/01/13 03:32 PM.

Let me tell ya somethin my kraut mick friend!
Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: VitoC] #746790
11/01/13 07:11 PM
11/01/13 07:11 PM
Joined: Dec 2012
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Woltz was just a sicko who didn't want better looking men around to distract the little girls. He wanted to control Fontaine or make him submit... didn't you guys notice how Fontaine broke down in tears in front of the Godfather? He himself wasn't a killer, he was just an entertainer and Woltz didn't want to have to pay him any money or insurance benefits. We learn later in the novel that he had growth or some type of wart/cyst on his vocal chords and Woltz prob didn't want to have to pay for the diagnosis/surgery/etc.. and yeah Fontaine did make Woltz look ridiculous and I kinda wish they would have cut Woltz's balls off after the film was over...

Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: VitoC] #746803
11/01/13 10:18 PM
11/01/13 10:18 PM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 98
New York, NY
Questadt Offline
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New York, NY
Originally Posted By: VitoC
When Tom goes to see Woltz in Part I, Woltz tells him that Johnny Fontaine made him look ridiculous, and that "...a man in my position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous!!!"

Excuse me?!?! This is coming from a pedophile!!! To say that a person his age and his position of authority who has sex with girls who almost certainly wouldn't feel like they could say no looks "ridiculous" is the mildest thing that could be said.

Not only that, but as someone once argued (possibly on this forum), doesn't he also look ridiculous by not giving Johnny the part, rather than by giving it to him? He himself says that Johnny is perfect for the role, and he's the director--so giving the role to the person most suited for it would not only show he had good sense in choosing actors, but by enhancing the movie, would make him more money as well.


Woltz is in many ways the quintessential "powerful man". He's accustomed to getting whatever he wants, whenever he wants it. And judging by everything he has already, he's been getting his way for a long, long time.

Men like that, who live in an environment of perpetual privilege, tend to develop a number of moral and ethical blind spots. Over time, they eventually lose the ability to distinguish between their own interests, and what's best for all the people and projects that inhabit their world. That's what makes them so insufferable. Like Jack Woltz.

Last edited by Questadt; 11/01/13 11:06 PM.

"A lawyer with his briefcase can steal more than a hundred men with guns."
Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: VitoC] #746826
11/02/13 09:02 AM
11/02/13 09:02 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 385
Tampa, FL
waynethegame Offline
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waynethegame  Offline
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Tampa, FL
Woltz meant that he would look ridiculous to his peers, for allowing this girl that he was taking under his wing and building up to be a star (as well as keeping for his own personal stable, if you catch my drift...) to leave him for Johnny Fontaine. He would be ridiculed by the others because he's a bigshot producer, and the girl chose a good-looking actor/singer over him, and he did nothing to retaliate despite being able to ruin Johnny's career. He's being a petty asshole, because he's entitled and that's what entitled people do.

If he didn't act, he would have been laughed at with comments such as "Hey Woltz, I hear your star girlfriend ditched you for that guinea, and you rewarded him by giving him the lead in your movie!" and the like would make him lose face with the other bigshot producers and movie stars.

Also, yes he does look stupid by not giving Johnny the part even though he knows he's perfect for it. BUT in that world, he would rather lose revenue from an amazing movie to satisfy personal ego clashes and vendettas. So him NOT giving Johnny the part is seen as a better choice than looking like you can walk all over him without retaliation.

"Hey Woltz, why didn't you have Johnny Fontaine star in that war picture you released? The dames would have ate it up." and Woltz's reply would have been something like "That smooth-talking guinea insulted me. You remember that fine piece of ass I acquired? The one I was makin' into a big star? That sonofabitch Fontaine stole her right out from under my nose like it was nothin'. I couldn't give him the part after that. I hate that sonofabitch, even if it would have gotten more money for the picture, people need to know they can't walk over Jack Woltz."

Last edited by waynethegame; 11/02/13 09:07 AM.

Wayne

"Finance is a gun. Politics is knowing when to pull the trigger."
Don Lucchesi
Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: waynethegame] #746842
11/02/13 10:57 AM
11/02/13 10:57 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Good points all around and I wont repeat them here. I would add that I thought FFC was having a little fun with the Woltz-Tom scenes.

Woltz was surrounded by yes men, and in those days he probably owned Johnny Fontaine's studio contract.
Everything about him would be in Tom's eyes (and Vito's), ridiculous. Showing off his wealth, saying what he paid for the horse, and what he planned to do with him, bragging about how he used marble that decorated the palace of a king for his ostentatious house, doing the fancy dinner with him at one end of the table and Tom at the other, talking business in front of servants, hiding the little girl upstairs, and most especialy wearing that stupid "My Cousin Vinnie" suit with piping combined to make him look ridiculous. Johnny did not have to make him look ridiculous, he already did, and to top it off, not only did he refuse the favor, he told Tom he was "no band leader."


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: waynethegame] #746847
11/02/13 11:15 AM
11/02/13 11:15 AM
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 98
New York, NY
Questadt Offline
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Questadt  Offline
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Originally Posted By: waynethegame
Woltz meant that he would look ridiculous to his peers, for allowing this girl that he was taking under his wing and building up to be a star (as well as keeping for his own personal stable, if you catch my drift...) to leave him for Johnny Fontaine. He would be ridiculed by the others because he's a bigshot producer, and the girl chose a good-looking actor/singer over him, and he did nothing to retaliate despite being able to ruin Johnny's career. He's being a petty asshole, because he's entitled and that's what entitled people do.

If he didn't act, he would have been laughed at with comments such as "Hey Woltz, I hear your star girlfriend ditched you for that guinea, and you rewarded him by giving him the lead in your movie!" and the like would make him lose face with the other bigshot producers and movie stars.

Also, yes he does look stupid by not giving Johnny the part even though he knows he's perfect for it. BUT in that world, he would rather lose revenue from an amazing movie to satisfy personal ego clashes and vendettas. So him NOT giving Johnny the part is seen as a better choice than looking like you can walk all over him without retaliation.

"Hey Woltz, why didn't you have Johnny Fontaine star in that war picture you released? The dames would have ate it up." and Woltz's reply would have been something like "That smooth-talking guinea insulted me. You remember that fine piece of ass I acquired? The one I was makin' into a big star? That sonofabitch Fontaine stole her right out from under my nose like it was nothin'. I couldn't give him the part after that. I hate that sonofabitch, even if it would have gotten more money for the picture, people need to know they can't walk over Jack Woltz."


I think you nailed it!


"A lawyer with his briefcase can steal more than a hundred men with guns."
Re: Looking Ridiculous [Re: paprincess] #746884
11/02/13 03:24 PM
11/02/13 03:24 PM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466
Stewartstown, PA
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VitoC Offline OP
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VitoC  Offline OP
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Posts: 466
Stewartstown, PA
Originally Posted By: paprincess
I kinda wish they would have cut Woltz's balls off after the film was over...


Maybe as an alternative to killing the horse, they could have had Luca Brasi strip Woltz down and hold a knife to his penis. I doubt Woltz would have thought losing that was worth denying Johnny the part.


Let me tell ya somethin my kraut mick friend!

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