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Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: dontomasso] #721028
06/18/13 05:38 PM
06/18/13 05:38 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,718
Berlin, Germany
Danito Offline
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Danito  Offline
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Berlin, Germany
The problem is that the Taliban are a terribly large group. It's de facto an army, not just a small group of crazy terrorists (even though those crazy minds are a part of it). These men somehow must be included in a future democratic society.
They know that they can't win a war in Afghanistan. They don't view the negotiations just as a win, because they don't really have an alternative.
When you want to have a peace in Afghanistan, what else can you do? Among the Taliban there are men who haven't known anything but war in the last 34 years...

Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: dontomasso] #721041
06/18/13 07:15 PM
06/18/13 07:15 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,893
The 5th circle of hell
Don Smitty Offline
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Don Smitty  Offline
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The 5th circle of hell
WoW! I never would have thought that the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA would sit down and talk with Terrorists! This is an outrage. President Obama should be impeached! The man only cares about his legacy. He wants to say that the war on terror ended on his watch. He doesn't care about all the brave men and women of the US MILITARY who died at the hands of the Taliban. This President and his Media lap dogs are a disgrace to this great country.


I woke up this morning with nothing to do and went to bed with only half of it done.


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Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: dontomasso] #721475
06/20/13 09:02 PM
06/20/13 09:02 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,089
Brooklyn, New York
Dapper_Don Offline
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Dapper_Don  Offline
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We have negotiated with terrorists before - whether through "back channels" or out in the public, but its been done. Back in 2007 we negotiated with Sunni insurgent leaders in Iraq to get them to stop bombing US troops and join the fight against al-Qaeda in Iraq. We bribed them. We paid them off. And if you Google the statements of various US officials back in 2005-2006, they were insulted when the US media referred to the Sunnis as insurgents. No, those officials insisted, they’re terrorists!

We also have negotiated in the past with the Taliban in Afghanistan as well. Cutting peace deals with different leaders of various provinces in exchange for money/protection, etc. Ronald Reagan's talks with Iran aimed at winning the release of U.S. hostages held in Lebanon - is also another example.

I dont condone negotiating with terrorists, but sometimes opportunities are presented that should be discussed in a negotiation. Prisoner exchanges, etc. Israel has done it with Hamas, British with the IRA, Spain with the Basque. The Taliban apparently has had one of our troops as a hostage for a few years, I think we owe it to his family to see if their is something constructive we can do to get him back alive.

Despite grand declarations, in practice, most democratic governments—even the U.S. and Israel, both known for their uncompromising stance on the matter—negotiate with terrorists. An argument could be made for Israel, a country which has perhaps more experience than any other with terrorism, negotiating with Hamas. Sometimes a government might make a judgment call that the benefits of negotiating with terrorists surpass the costs. Each case is different.

Just my two cents.

Last edited by Dapper_Don; 06/20/13 09:07 PM.

Tommy Shots: They want me running the family, don't they know I have a young wife?
Sal Vitale: (laughs) Tommy, jump in, the water's fine.


Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: Dapper_Don] #721476
06/20/13 09:12 PM
06/20/13 09:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809
Scotland
Camarel Offline
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Camarel  Offline
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Posts: 2,809
Scotland
Originally Posted By: Dapper_Don
We have negotiated with terrorists before - whether through "back channels" or out in the public, but its been done. Back in 2007 we negotiated with Sunni insurgent leaders in Iraq to get them to stop bombing US troops and join the fight against al-Qaeda in Iraq. We bribed them. We paid them off. And if you Google the statements of various US officials back in 2005-2006, they were insulted when the US media referred to the Sunnis as insurgents. No, those officials insisted, they’re terrorists!

We also have negotiated in the past with the Taliban in Afghanistan as well. Cutting peace deals with different leaders of various provinces in exchange for money/protection, etc. Ronald Reagan's talks with Iran aimed at winning the release of U.S. hostages held in Lebanon - is also another example.

I dont condone negotiating with terrorists, but sometimes opportunities are presented that should be discussed in a negotiation. Prisoner exchanges, etc. Israel has done it with Hamas, British with the IRA, Spain with the Basque. The Taliban apparently has had one of our troops as a hostage for a few years, I think we owe it to his family to see if their is something constructive we can do to get him back alive.

Despite grand declarations, in practice, most democratic governments—even the U.S. and Israel, both known for their uncompromising stance on the matter—negotiate with terrorists. An argument could be made for Israel, a country which has perhaps more experience than any other with terrorism, negotiating with Hamas. Sometimes a government might make a judgment call that the benefits of negotiating with terrorists surpass the costs. Each case is different.

Just my two cents.


+1. I honestly think this is the best sort of response to the issue, you're not being overly liberal or conservative on the question but you're also not being so Centrist to avoid it entirely.

Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: dontomasso] #721477
06/20/13 09:17 PM
06/20/13 09:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,089
Brooklyn, New York
Dapper_Don Offline
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Dapper_Don  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,089
Brooklyn, New York
^^Thank you Camarel.


Tommy Shots: They want me running the family, don't they know I have a young wife?
Sal Vitale: (laughs) Tommy, jump in, the water's fine.


Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: Dapper_Don] #721484
06/20/13 09:25 PM
06/20/13 09:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,449
New Jersey
Five_Felonies Offline
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Five_Felonies  Offline
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Posts: 1,449
New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Dapper_Don
We also have negotiated in the past with the Taliban in Afghanistan as well.

the majority of that whole conflict has been negotiations, be it local deals with "village elders", aka the taliban. everything from weapons/money in exchange for info to looking the other way with regards to opium production for similar reasons has been done on a massive scale!

Originally Posted By: Dapper_Don
The Taliban apparently has had one of our troops as a hostage for a few years, I think we owe it to his family to see if their is something constructive we can do to get him back alive.

according to recent reports, U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl has been held captive since some time in 2009. get this guy home for christs sake. send those nutters the 5 guys they want, and get a soldier who joined up with the right intentions the freedom that he deserves!


It's either blue cheese with wings or go fuck yer mudda!
Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: Five_Felonies] #721493
06/20/13 09:32 PM
06/20/13 09:32 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,089
Brooklyn, New York
Dapper_Don Offline
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Dapper_Don  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 4,089
Brooklyn, New York
Originally Posted By: Five_Felonies

the majority of that whole conflict has been negotiations, be it local deals with "village elders", aka the taliban. everything from weapons/money in exchange for info to looking the other way with regards to opium production for similar reasons has been done on a massive scale!


No doubt about it. There were tons of examples of this in George Tenet's memoir a few years back. Great read.

Originally Posted By: Five_Felonies
according to recent reports, U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl has been held captive since some time in 2009. get this guy home for christs sake. send those nutters the 5 guys they want, and get a soldier who joined up with the right intentions the freedom that he deserves!


Amen.


Tommy Shots: They want me running the family, don't they know I have a young wife?
Sal Vitale: (laughs) Tommy, jump in, the water's fine.


Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: DickNose_Moltasanti] #744561
10/15/13 03:51 PM
10/15/13 03:51 PM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2
S
sheridan Offline
Associate
sheridan  Offline
S
Associate
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 2
whats your name you said i went to school with you

Re: TIME FOR OBAMA TO BE TRUMAN [Re: dontomasso] #746828
11/02/13 09:18 AM
11/02/13 09:18 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,282
B
bigboy Offline
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bigboy  Offline
B
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Posts: 1,282
OK here it is 11-2-13 and I look back at earlier posts about how wonderful obomacare is going to be. We now know that the first da only 6 people signed up and over half the population is pissed off at the king

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