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Stand your ground law! #709988
04/11/13 03:56 PM
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http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=18932266

Anyone have a feeling how this will play out?

And the judge should give Zimmerman permission to use the gym. He may have a heart attack of stroke before trial!


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Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710017
04/11/13 06:14 PM
04/11/13 06:14 PM
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In exile watching star wars an...
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Zimmerman should walk if we werent such a nation full of apologetic pussys we would never had a trial.

Personally, this is a perfect example why to keep a throw down peice in ur house or car. Some guy is broken in ur house, some guy is on ur property, or going thru ur car, some guy spills a drink on ur girlfriend..... Throw down! Answer for all ur problems!

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: Skinny] #710068
04/11/13 08:04 PM
04/11/13 08:04 PM
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Zimmerman's mother wrote a letter to the public about our "failed justice system" today. Whether you agree with her or not, just don't forget that she's a Mom too. Just like Trayvon's Mom.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/11/george-zimmermans-mother-open-letter_n_3064028.html


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: Skinny] #710127
04/12/13 11:22 AM
04/12/13 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted By: Skinny
Zimmerman should walk if we werent such a nation full of apologetic pussys we would never had a trial.

Personally, this is a perfect example why to keep a throw down peice in ur house or car. Some guy is broken in ur house, some guy is on ur property, or going thru ur car, some guy spills a drink on ur girlfriend..... Throw down! Answer for all ur problems!


Right. After all we all know that anyone wearing a hoodie is automatically guilty of something. Especially if he's walking around BWH (Black With Hoodie).


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710129
04/12/13 11:39 AM
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The hoodie argument? Seriously? Martin was no choir boy!


"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: pizzaboy] #710130
04/12/13 11:43 AM
04/12/13 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
Zimmerman's mother wrote a letter to the public about our "failed justice system" today. Whether you agree with her or not, just don't forget that she's a Mom too. Just like Trayvon's Mom.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/11/george-zimmermans-mother-open-letter_n_3064028.html


Sounds a lot like every other lawyer uses- blames others to get their client off. Let's face it, we all know the media has a lot to do with what the public sees and hears and can twist things in order to make more things their way and increases their news story's..


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CAUTION: This Post has not been approved by Don Cardi.

You really don't expect people to believe your shit do you?

Read: "The Daily Apple"- Telling America and the Gangster BB like it really is!
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: fathersson] #710136
04/12/13 12:04 PM
04/12/13 12:04 PM
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The only person who deserves blame is Zimmmerman.
Reluctantly I agree with FS on one point, namely the role of the media in legal proceedings. What these windbags don't get is what a jury sees and hears in a courtroom is regulated by the Rules of Evidence, and often the discretion of the trial judge who interprets these rules. Juries don't hear all the wild speculation in which the media engages, and accordingly people are apt to judge defendants based on what they see on television rather than what goes on in the courtroom. Having watched a lot of the Casey Anthony trial, I was not as surprised of the verdict as most. Do I think she did it? Sure. Does that opinion anount to a hill of beans? No.

IMHO the prosecution dropped the ball big time in that case, and based on what was presented to the jury, there was plenty of room for "reasonable doubt." LIKE O.J. and others, the media convicted these people and the general population was shocked when the media was wrong.

In this Zimmerman case, I think he is guilty, but again I am not going to be on that jury and I have no idea what will come into evidence.

That said I think the "stand your ground" law is one of the stupidest pieces of legislation ever passed. Of course based on what I am seeing from republican legislatures around the country this year, it will be surpassed by sstupidity sooner than later.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710138
04/12/13 12:16 PM
04/12/13 12:16 PM
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DT, you make the excellent points that our informtion is limited to news accounts and that it is the rules of evidence and judicial rulings that determines a verdict. I would add that one other primary determinant is statutes some of which are quite specific and some are rather vague. Of course, you also allude to the quality of prosecution which varies widely across the nation.


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Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710141
04/12/13 12:31 PM
04/12/13 12:31 PM
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Oli, was that a Don King quote? I believe from his Auto Biography? Only in Texas was the title?


"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710183
04/12/13 04:23 PM
04/12/13 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted By: EastHarlemItal
The hoodie argument? Seriously? Martin was no choir boy!


Yes, he had that wicked bag of Skittles on him. Deviant.


President Emeritus of the Neal Pulcawer Fan Club
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710189
04/12/13 04:44 PM
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Not talking about what was in his pockets, taking about his past! Save your plight of the poor African American inner city youth speech! Its pure propaganda!


"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710193
04/12/13 04:58 PM
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I'm pretty sure I can write what I think, as long as I obey the rules. I don't have to save anything.

I don't believe in painting any group with a brush. Trayvon Martin was walking from the store to his home with nothing in his pockets but a bag of Skittles and, I believe, a Snapple. He wasn't caught trying to break into someone's home or automobile, he was walking on a public street. He was unarmed.

His past? Was he wearing a sign that talked about his past? How does his past, no matter what it was, have any bearing on that night?? Was Mr. Zimmerman aware of his past? Did Mr. Zimmerman know him? Or did Mr. Zimmerman, a cop-hero-wannabe with a bit of a past of his own, decide to take matters into his own hands???


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Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710195
04/12/13 05:10 PM
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You can write whatever you want of coarse, however you have a habit of chasing my posts and even though you spoke against it correcting my spelling or grammar. Why wouldn't his last matter? What if he's murdered before? What if he was in a choir! It's called charector! And even though your going to say that doesn't play a part in reality I disagree with you. Niether of us were there to say exactly what happened. However what if this kid with a checkered last did attack Zimmerman? Would you still defend Martin?


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Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710198
04/12/13 05:38 PM
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I'm not defending anyone. I just stated the facts. Trayvon Martin was walking home from the store with his very recent purchases. He was not in the midst of committing a crime when he was accosted by Mr. Zimmerman, and he was unarmed. His past? What about Zimmerman's past? Didn't he have an arrest record? And didn't his girlfriend have a restraining order against him? Should his past come under scrutiny as well?

As someone stated above, none of us know all the facts, only what we've been fed by the media. My entire objection to the way this case was handled was that there Mr. Zimmerman had not been arrested until the public outcry forced it. He should have been, and a jury of his peers, after hearing all the facts, should make the determination of his guilt or innocence. Not the cops, not the media and not the public.


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Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710203
04/12/13 05:44 PM
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Everyone's past should be looked at in this case. And to be honest I'm not a gun advocate nor am I against guns. However are you saying Zimmerman randomly attacked Martin? Or as the reconstruction showed Martin was on top on Zimmerman beating him when he shot him? If Zimmerman was killed how would he let a jury decide? There's a flip side to this


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Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710204
04/12/13 05:50 PM
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There are two sides of every coin. Why would Trayvon decide to attack Zimmerman? He was just walking home. However, Zimmerman, who was a zealous neighborhood watch, cop-wannabe had more reason to attack. Not saying he did, not saying he didn't. But saying he was on top of Zimmerman when he was shot doesn't mean he attacked Zimmerman either. He might have been defending himself and got the upper hand. I don't know, nor do any of us. That's for the courts to decide.

And if Trayvon Martin had killed Zimmerman, should he have been arrested? Of course he should have. That's why we have a legal system in this country.


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Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710207
04/12/13 05:52 PM
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Ok the other side of the coin, your not taking into account the past aggressive behavior of Martin! If your going to call Zimmerman a cop wanna be nut job and use his behavior and charector in an argument you need to look into the last behavior of both!


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Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: Sicilian Babe] #710208
04/12/13 05:53 PM
04/12/13 05:53 PM
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olivant Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sicilian Babe

And if Trayvon Martin had killed Zimmerman, should he have been arrested? Of course he should have. That's why we have a legal system in this country.


You're wrong. Constitutional arrest is a function of probable cause only.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710211
04/12/13 05:58 PM
04/12/13 05:58 PM
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He was a rent-a-cop he had no authority to shoot that boy. I don't know all the details of the case but Zimmerman seems like a punk and got scared when the kid told him to fuck-off, then this fucking guy shoots him WTF. As a rent-a-cop he should have called the law and reported it, not confronted him. I bet if it was a really big white guy with tats he would've called the law, I hope they throw the fucking book a this coward and that's just what he is PLAIN AND SIMPLE a COWARD!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sorry for the rant and if I offended anybody.

Last edited by SgWaue86; 04/12/13 05:59 PM.
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710213
04/12/13 06:01 PM
04/12/13 06:01 PM
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Stand your ground!

Respect! Especially the guy with the gun who's scared


"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710214
04/12/13 06:03 PM
04/12/13 06:03 PM
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I don't understand, your riding with Zimmerman? Makes no difference to me just wondering.

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: SgWaue86] #710216
04/12/13 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted By: SgWaue86
I don't understand, your riding with Zimmerman? Makes no difference to me just wondering.


No! Niether. Like I said I don't own a gun. I'm not against guns either! I'm riding with neither!

I wasn't there so I can't say what really happened! I will say if we think there will be an impartial jury there fooling themselves


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Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710217
04/12/13 06:09 PM
04/12/13 06:09 PM
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olivant Offline
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Mr. Zimmermann was a member of that neighborhood's watch patrol. He did call "the law". The recordings of that contact with law enforcement have been played by media many times and are available on line.

It might be helpful if Board members would access the Florida stand your ground statute (as well as related statutes).


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710218
04/12/13 06:10 PM
04/12/13 06:10 PM
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So if someone has past contact with police or has been charged with assault it means they can be stopped and made to look like a criminal by some fuck in a security uniform who shouldn't be carrying anyways. That's another thing I think concealed weapons should only be for LE. I support gun ownership but not concealed weapons on a civilian.

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: SgWaue86] #710219
04/12/13 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted By: SgWaue86
He was a rent-a-cop he had no authority to shoot that boy. I don't know all the details of the case but Zimmerman seems like a punk and got scared when the kid told him to fuck-off, then this fucking guy shoots him WTF. As a rent-a-cop he should have called the law and reported it, not confronted him. I bet if it was a really big white guy with tats he would've called the law, I hope they throw the fucking book a this coward and that's just what he is PLAIN AND SIMPLE a COWARD!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sorry for the rant and if I offended anybody.



If that's what you want! However if they throw the book at Zimmerman he will walk!


"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710220
04/12/13 06:12 PM
04/12/13 06:12 PM
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I wasn't familiar with the case and don't know enough about it to say who was right or wrong, regardless it's tragic a 17 year old being killed whether in the right or wron so RIP Trayvon Martin.

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710221
04/12/13 06:17 PM
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Zimmerman shouldn't have been carrying plain and simple, but I do feel I should have do more looking into the situation before commenting but from what I,ve seen on bits of TV here and there he handle it wrong. Why didn't he tell him to not move after he pulled, don't say because he couldn't if there were fighting and he was able to access the gun the he had ample room to let the kid see it and back off IF MARTIN DID START IT. He was a kid he would have seen that gun and stopped if he was fighting which Zimmerman could've done it to himself after he shot him.

Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710222
04/12/13 06:23 PM
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It really is sad, they just meet at the wrong time in there lives!

Last edited by EastHarlemItal; 04/12/13 06:41 PM.

"Because I'm the Boss"

Tony Salerno
Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: olivant] #710226
04/12/13 07:16 PM
04/12/13 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted By: olivant
Originally Posted By: Sicilian Babe

And if Trayvon Martin had killed Zimmerman, should he have been arrested? Of course he should have. That's why we have a legal system in this country.


You're wrong. Constitutional arrest is a function of probable cause only.


I was guessing that an armed man who was beaten to death (which is what would have happened if Martin had killed Zimmerman) would be probable cause for an arrest.


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Re: Stand your ground law! [Re: EastHarlemItal] #710327
04/13/13 04:02 PM
04/13/13 04:02 PM
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We discussed the Stand Your Ground laws some time ago, but it bears repeating that the biggest opposition to these laws comes from district attorney associations and police departments as the policy behind these measures results in promoting conflict.

In the upcoming Zimmerman trial an important witness will be the girlfriend of Trayvon Martin, who was on the phone with him shortly before he was killed. She gave a statement to the police sooon after the shooting, independent of any knowledge of later reported facts surrounding the case.

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