It is pretty amazing that Difronzio and D'Amico are still out. You can hardly compare him to Accardo, but, like Accardo, it looks like he will go down for the count without ever having done real time. D'Amico on the other hand did spend some time in college.

Caridi lives 10 minutes from me. It amazes me how normal his family lives their lives. His wife sells real estate. Kids in school. How does he continue without his kids harassing him? I'd love to know what he's up to.

Where is Caridi?

northport/commack schools

He still involved, long island?

ligambi should definetly be on the list of top 10 u.s.. and if not him atleast mazzone. ligambi stayed in power and out of jail for a pretty long time. and in the 90's mazzone was underboss and made all kinds of things happenand now hes back in the game doing it again but alot quieter. mazzone and merlino were a great team and they are probably still making money together.

i dont know much as far chicago, philly, and ny as far as made guys who has an major impact and still on the streets but i do know though on house arrest peter limone is def top ten mobsters not in jail and i would go as far as anthony spunky spagnola jimmy martorano even vinny ferrara all spunky and jimmy been out for a very long time capo's that are very dangerous and known killers and good earners thats well respected all over and really staying out the radar ...vinny's case he is a smart man(bc graduate ) good earner killer and been very low on radar even making many beleive he is no longer active and in the life and limone did 33 years kept mouth shut was jerry anguilo strong arm in his hey day where you had make bones to get straighten out and since he been out ran the family made some lucrative income on gambling and businees ventures one i know for sure is the garbage industry i know he raking in millions from that alone ...so in my opinion wither one of those guys is def should be on the list not no damn anthony dummy big mouth dinunzio who has no credentials at all to say the least

Dont forget. Joe Defede made like 250k a year as boss. Castellano made 10mil plus. Why? He had his own biz... Meat business and cement companys. Defede had very little business on his own. Plus he lacked the respect needed to run a family. A family like the gambinos and the genovese with 30 different crews, yeah expect millions in tribute a year. Chin left 100m to his family when he died. A smaller family like philly orNE? I wouldnt compare it. Not to mention, outside ny, there is no competition. I wouldnt put anyone outside ny in my list. Not even difronzo. Hes rich, but holds no power over any unions, they lost everything over the years. Plus even in the 80s when they controlled the luina it was still Tony and Chin who told them who to make president.

As far as philly goes, ive heard Uncle Joe was very greedy, not much of a boss. He had no pedigree to be boss, he wanted other guys, real street guys to give up big portions of their businesses to him... A lot of older scarfo guys dont respect him. He was just a bartender who made book when they were out doing work. VERY GREEDY... He had very little in legitimate income. He left nothing for the soldiers. He took over machine routes, he took that guy monacello, bc he was a good earner, put him close, directly under him... His downfall was greed! If i had to guess how much he made, id say 3-400k.


I wouldnt put any guy outside NY on a level with NY guys, except-Maybe, Difronzo... They still have a little union and political pull. That, plus the competition from other familys makes all the diference. There are guys in NY that make millions a year off construction. Thats the difference. Guys no one here have listed on there listed have more political and labor related pull, and more money, than any of the guys outside NY... Jimmy Massera-controls all the NY Mason Tenders. Conrad Ianniello-controls garbage, trucking, busses... Allie Shades-Controls Garbage companies all over NY... The giovincos-control nj garbage... Mario Gigante--controls upstate garbage... Sil Devita-controls several nj laborers locals. Dinapoli...Beech Depiro-controls the entire ILA. What does steve mazzone control? 3 slot machines in the back of a bar in south philly? Fuck bobby manna from prison has more juice than any guy in philly or chicago.

Several of those west side guys probably have more power and pull than bosses of the smaller families. The amount of cash from the businesses they own or influence had to be substantial

the boston/prov guys has alot of union pull runs all of the carpenters union has local 25 at one time like 10 years ago there was a big thing where no movie can be mad without the movie crew using local 25 equipments jimmy has a unions under his belt even runs a union base in las vegas with some gambino guys runs all of the docks here in mass and r.i. defenitely is controlled by guys ...they still control suffolk downs granted they got control of the casinos being made here in mass ....they're cohort sal dimasi turned it towned so his underling deleo can approve it both def is connected difference is one is exposed the other is real behind the scene guy and one is from eastie the other north end both mob breeding/stomping grounds... there is big time political corruption here in this area and might not be as big as ny but def raking if not as much not to far behind and old man ray ran every union that had to do with a vending machine if its a coin machine soda cany toy game whatever he ran it the unions evrything from here to chicago and thats still in boston control so there is a difference not to far from it at all

Who runs the boston/RI ILA locals for that family joe?

LOL! Well maybe a few more then 3 machines but i get your point and your right. The South Philly mob really has no juice outside of south philly and maybe parts of South Jersey in sections where alot of people from philly have moved. But they have no real pull outside of south philly. No unions etc like Scarfo and Bruno had.

I can't think of a really big earner in the family and i wouldn't be surprised if the fattest envelope Ligambi got was from Licata and the North Jersey crew. They killed their last huge earner and that was Long John when he was on the street. Say what you want about Martorano but he made money in his sleep. Nobody like that around these days as far as i know.

I'm not getting into this Chicago-Ny debate going on but i find it hard to believe Chicago doesn't dwarf philly in earnings and overall clout. I've seen people say chicago, NE and Philly are in the same boat but i think chicago has more going for it then both of those other families. Just my opinion.

Chicago doesn't have as much union pull as they used to of course but they still have some.

it was matty guetlemti i know his last name is spelled wrong but it def was matty .... i know jimmy martorano has his hands in it a bunch of em but i really think it's one of the providence guys the irish runs em in boston who they kickin it up to is the question and based off my knowledge its got to be jimmy martorano and vincent capone i think his name a soldier from the malden/revere with great union ties and achille in providence taking over what pretty had until he comes home ....my personal question is who runs local 25 from behind the scene is the man he's the man that got a great deal of convicts and known bank robbers and gangsters in the union so its who got control of this union got control of all the other unions in my opinion

Yes but your also forgetting some guys are bigtime drug kingpins like matty maddona.This guy was supplying the council who inturn was supplying everysingle black neighbouhood in NY.A guy like this makes more money than any union guy.I dont think this guy was getting his H from zips because guys who he was in buisness with got busted in thailand so MM was buying straight from the source which means a fuckload more money

The top 5 guys on that list are going to be whoever is head of the 5 NY crime families at any given time. Individually, they may not be as wealthy or have the clout compared to another mafioso. But as boss or acting boss, their power extends to the entire family. So, by virtue of that, that will put them at positions #1-5.

See, here you go again.

I would agree with that to an extent. But the bonanno family doesn't have a boss at the moment. And what about a genovese capo who earns more money than the boss of a smaller family? Sure he's the boss, but isn't it possible that a capo from a larger family could hold more weight?

As far as the northeast goes, what Ivy says is 100% correct, in theory. Dems be da rules. But in practice? Meh, who knows?

Best example I can give is here in the Bronx, early 2000's. Vinny had just become official boss of the Bonannos, but Prisco had just gotten out of Jersey State prison on a bullshit technicality (thanks to Governor McGreevey, a gay guy, Ivy ). Anyway, they were both quite active in the East Bronx at that time. Now Vinny as boss of the Bonannos technically outranked Angelo, a skipper with the Westside. But if you polled a hundred street guys, I guarantee you 90 of them would have told you that Angelo was the heavier guy.

But that example is moot anyway. Because I know for a fact that Angelo likes Vinny a great deal. I'll bet if Vinny had it to do all over again, he'd have gone in with Prisco back in the '80s instead of with Patty D and the Bonannos. He and Patty ended up hating each other like poison, and look at the end result for both of them. But again, that may be a poor example. Because Prisco's dying in jail, too.

Moral of the story: Mob guys die in jail. A lot .

PB there are still a lot of heavy guys here in Chicago who have yet to do serious time. None of the Caruso brothers have served any time. A lot of the main guys in the Elmwood Park Crew like Gary Gags have not done serious time. Albie Vena has been on the street forever so has Sammy Cards. Before he got sick, Joey Andriacchi ran things for 20 plus years after he was out of prison.

Since 9/11 the feds have largely concentrated their resources on terrorism. Factor in every other problem they have (drug trafficking etc.) and I doubt there is anywhere near the resources being directed toward the mob as there used to be.

Particularly in a place like Chicago where by all visible evidence the crime is nonviolent and basically amounts to a fairly small scale network of illegal gambling.

Look at the drug/streetgang problem here in Chicago. Hundreds of people are killed every single year in their turf battles. How much time can they devote to the mob, that hasn't killed a single person in years?

The danger of the mob of course is its capacity for corruption.

I'm sure law enforcement still have a fair amount of agents dedicated to the Outfit, but I doubt its that high on their priority list these days.

Illegal gambling isn't really where the Feds need to focus when it comes to the Outfit...its more bid rigging and their ability to use their legit companies to get their claws into civic projects like McCormick Place expansion and Des Plaines casino.

Also consider their dominance of video poker in Illinois (and pull with pols who legalized it).

True but I don't think that stuff is really happening on a very wide scale. Look at Fratto's ham-fisted attempt to nudge in on McCormick. If you read the wire he comes off as someone who is mentally impaired.

It's a far, far, far cry from the Humpreys days.

Well, I can only speak to what goes on in New York. But I'll take your word for it. If you've learned anything about me it's that I tend to stay in the areas that I think I know something about.

It's not that Chicago is completely foreign to me. I've read plenty about the glory days, and I've always been interested in Accardo. But that's mostly "book knowledge." What I post about New York isn't (not always, anyway).

Wait, let me clarify that Chicago "book knowledge" statement that I just made. I actually DO know a few things about Milwaukee Phil that I didn't read in books (I'll pm you sometime). I'll just say that he was originally from Yonkers (a Bronx suburb), and was very tight with the Bronx-Westchester faction of the Genovese family right up until the day he died in prison.

As far as the terrorism thing goes in New York, it's been both good and bad for the wiseguys. Less agents = good. Being convicted under the terrorism statutes = bad. And I have a feeling we're going to see more and more of that. Look at Basciano. Don't get me wrong, he killed people so he belongs in jail. But he doesn't belong in the terrorist wing with Ali Baba and the 40 hijackers. There's something seriously wrong with that sentence.

Well how many wiseguys are actually "terrorizing" new York? Don't get me wrong what they do is all fucked up, but it's like no nose said the FBI has to worry more about the corruption the mob can bring rather than them killing people. The terrorism statue sounds like utter bullshit

The state of Illinois and the city of Chicago and the suburbs in Chicagoland are all corrupt. They are disgustingly corrupt. Looks at Gov. Ryan and Blago.

Now this is a ridiculously blanket statement, not all cities are corrupt, but corruption anywhere in IL and Chicago doesn't surprise. To me, it seems like its more the norm than the exception.

True, but that wasn't always the case (even though that's how it's largely been during your short lifetime). And it's not that they're kinder and gentler today. It's just that they're more pragmatic. If they could still get away with killing each other, bodies would still be dropping like flies.


And yet I GUARANTEE you're going to eventually see more of it. Soon as some guy gets pinched in an overseas heroin deal that's even marginally tied to a Middle Eastern terror cell, bam, that's gonna be it. They're going to indict Italian American mob guys under the terror statutes. They're already sentencing guys as such (case in point, Basciano).

I do agree with the sentiment that the five bosses of in NY are on the list. Probably 2-3 capo's from NY, maybe a guy from Philly and a guy or two from Chicago.

You also could make the argument that all ten should be from NY. The five bosses, 3 capo's from Genovese and 2 from Gambino.

I don't think it's anywhere near as bad as it used to be.

Rahm wants to be president, and he is independently worth $14 million, at least, from his ibanking days. He wouldn't touch any of that shit with a 100 foot pole.

The Outfit may still have a little influence with a few of the ancient alderman, but by and large the days of Sal the Knee Breaker delivering brown bags full of cash are over.

In some of the suburbs, though, there is a lot more ancillary evidence that would suggest continuing corruption.

It is DEFINITELY a far cry from the Humphries Days or even Pat Marcy days.

As for McCormick however, using Fratto's indictment to represent what the Outfit has going there isn't really representative however...Rudy was shelved by the Outfit already when he was pinched there. You neglect the real powers at McCormick that run large companies like Bill Daddono and the Salamone brothers. I would go as far as to say they are getting cuts of almost everything happening at McCormick. It's still a major cashcow...a larger version of the Stephens Convention Center that the Daddono family has run for decades.

PB--I agree and that's why I respect you buddy. You don't see me talking about the Bronx!