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After the massacre of all the heads.. #650237
06/06/12 01:56 PM
06/06/12 01:56 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 95
T
Trilogy Offline OP
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Trilogy  Offline OP
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If you were Michael and settled all the hits; right after would you try to abandon that lifestyle and start over? or continue down that path and lived the way he did.

Personaly that would be pretty difficult to leave. He is still responsible for his mother and sister plus all the nieces and nephews. Fredo would be more then glad to become boss and end up destroying the family with all his stupid decisions. I guess it was impossible for Michael to walk away and become legitimate.

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650241
06/06/12 02:29 PM
06/06/12 02:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
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olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
By that time, Michael was committed to that way of life.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650280
06/06/12 06:41 PM
06/06/12 06:41 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 599
Toronto, Ontario
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dontommasino Offline
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dontommasino  Offline
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 599
Toronto, Ontario
I don't view it as plausible that a man, even with the connections that the Corleones were portrayed as having, can order the death of at least seven people (Cuneo, Stracci, Tattaglia, Barzini, Moe, Carlo and Tessio) and just throw it all away!

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650292
06/06/12 08:24 PM
06/06/12 08:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 578
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danielperrygin Offline
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danielperrygin  Offline
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Posts: 578
If Michael's desire to go legit was true, than this point in his life would be a better time than ever. But now that i think about things come to mind that would delay going legit. Like you said he has a big family to care for and the legit business world is frankly something Michael had never been a part of, so he would have to atleast go after one big svore to have enough money until he found a legit money source. Everyone knows though that one score leads to another and another. Most might think that Vages was a legit money source but unless you had muscle to back your business up than you would be pushed out of town quickly. I beliee that by this point though Michael had decided this was his destiny, because if he wanted to leave the life at this point who would stop him??????

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: danielperrygin] #650295
06/06/12 09:09 PM
06/06/12 09:09 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,512
AZ
Turnbull Offline
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,512
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Michael pretty much cast his fate in concrete when he agreed to take over the reins from Vito. Now the other Dons saw him as foe, not just a one-time defender of his old man. He put himself in the kill-or-be-killed position with the other Dons by becoming a Don.

He couldn't simply have walked away from everything when he moved to Nevada. First, he'd made a lot of enemies as a result of the massacre, and they'd come for vengeance unless he had muscle (Clemenza and later Frankie) to protect him. He also needed that muscle to protect hiom as he built and expanded his legal gaming empire--without it, as you say, real gangsters would otherwise take what was his.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650306
06/07/12 12:27 AM
06/07/12 12:27 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
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olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
Once Michael crossed his Rubicon, that was it. As TB points out, he couldn't simply walk away. It was in his blood to dominate the underworld. He liked the power and the manipulation. it was intoxicating. Power usually is. Michael managed it better than many did. I've never bought into the Michael wanted to be legitimate story line. He wanted the appearance of legitimacy so that he could continue his nefarious ways.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650326
06/07/12 10:09 AM
06/07/12 10:09 AM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
Sonny_Black Offline
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Sonny_Black  Offline
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
After the massacre Michael was up his neck in the mob and there was no turning back. If I would have massacred all the rival dons I would probably be power tripping just as anybody else.


"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: olivant] #650452
06/08/12 08:43 AM
06/08/12 08:43 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 599
Toronto, Ontario
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dontommasino Offline
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dontommasino  Offline
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 599
Toronto, Ontario
Originally Posted By: olivant
Once Michael crossed his Rubicon, that was it. As TB points out, he couldn't simply walk away. It was in his blood to dominate the underworld. He liked the power and the manipulation. it was intoxicating. Power usually is. Michael managed it better than many did. I've never bought into the Michael wanted to be legitimate story line. He wanted the appearance of legitimacy so that he could continue his nefarious ways.


Yep, he also used others as scapegoats when there was a "barrier" to him going legit.

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650959
06/11/12 01:13 PM
06/11/12 01:13 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 66
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DonJon Offline
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DonJon  Offline
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I think Michael crossed the point of no return when he pulled the trigger on Solozzo and McCluskey.

Last edited by DonJon; 06/11/12 01:15 PM.
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: DonJon] #650965
06/11/12 01:32 PM
06/11/12 01:32 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,512
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,512
AZ
In some ways, yes. Many of us here believe it came even earlier: when, in the hospital, he said, "I'm with you now, Pop," he could have meant that he was, finally, with the family, not just at his father's side.

But I believe that he could have chosen to go his own way after Sicily. He could have said to Vito: "Pop, I was wrong to hold you and the family at arms-length, but I made up for it. I killed the two guys who were conspiring to kill you, and saved your life. I paid a heavy price: I had to ditch my beloved Kay and hide in Sicily. I lost my beloved Apollonia to a bomb intended for me because I'm your son. We're quits. Sonny dead? I grieve as do you. Fredo not up to the Donship? Sorry, Pop, but that's not my problem. Besides, you always said you wanted me to be 'Senator Corleone, Governor Corleone.' Well, Pop, I can't get there if I'm 'Don Corleone.'"


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #650973
06/11/12 01:52 PM
06/11/12 01:52 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
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olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
I concur TB. However, I definitely think that his "I'm with you now, Pop," was just father to son. It was Micahel's way of letting his father know that his years of estrangment from him was over. I don't think he was throwing in his lot with Vito's crime family.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: olivant] #650979
06/11/12 02:06 PM
06/11/12 02:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
I always thought the "I'm with you now pop" meant he was going to go into the family business. Face it. Michael looked around and saw tht if he didn't get into this whole theing the Corleones would lose the war.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: dontomasso] #650981
06/11/12 02:22 PM
06/11/12 02:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 95
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Trilogy Offline OP
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Trilogy  Offline OP
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I don't think at that exact moment he decided to go into the family business, I think he said "i'm with you pop" because no one else was there and he wanted to assure Vito that Michael is here for him as a son.

Then although he temporarily protected his father at the hospital, it would never be over until those 2 men are dead. If you want a good job done, then you have to do it yourself wink

Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Turnbull] #650993
06/11/12 03:10 PM
06/11/12 03:10 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 773
Pittsburgh, PA
The Last Woltz Offline
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The Last Woltz  Offline
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 773
Pittsburgh, PA
Originally Posted By: Turnbull
In some ways, yes. Many of us here believe it came even earlier: when, in the hospital, he said, "I'm with you now, Pop," he could have meant that he was, finally, with the family, not just at his father's side.

But I believe that he could have chosen to go his own way after Sicily. He could have said to Vito: "Pop, I was wrong to hold you and the family at arms-length, but I made up for it. I killed the two guys who were conspiring to kill you, and saved your life. I paid a heavy price: I had to ditch my beloved Kay and hide in Sicily. I lost my beloved Apollonia to a bomb intended for me because I'm your son. We're quits. Sonny dead? I grieve as do you. Fredo not up to the Donship? Sorry, Pop, but that's not my problem. Besides, you always said you wanted me to be 'Senator Corleone, Governor Corleone.' Well, Pop, I can't get there if I'm 'Don Corleone.'"


He may have been able to leave the Family after Siciliy, but where would he go?

Aspirations of holding higher office were basically killed along with Sol and Mac. And the other Families would never view him as a civilian again.

The closing of legitimate avenues to Michael was made quite clear by Vito's reaction when he's told that Michael killed Sollozzo and McCluskey.


"A man in my position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous!"
Re: After the massacre of all the heads.. [Re: Trilogy] #651092
06/12/12 08:26 AM
06/12/12 08:26 AM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,718
Berlin, Germany
Danito Offline
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Danito  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,718
Berlin, Germany
"I'm with you pop" opens door to the confusion of family and "family".


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