And that opinion, my friend, is why a lot of people cannot stand NY'ers. NY may be the center of the mob universe, but it ain't got a monopoly.

General attrition and the declining pool of recruits has effected every mob family. Some more so than others, of course. It has led to the extinction of several families altogether. But after New York and the rest of the northeast, Chicago is the next largest center as far as Italians go. The Outfit has been said to have intentionally downsized and streamlined its organization and operations but I don't see why its hard to believe they can't still maintain about 50 made guys. Again, that would make them one of the 4 remaining smaller viable families along with New England, New Jersey, and Philadelphia.

Some recent articles on the modern day Chicago Outfit...

http://www.ipsn.org/characters/new_outfit.htm
http://www.laborers.org/ChicagoMag_Moblite_12_00.htm
http://www.ipsn.org/living_the_high_life.htm



Outfit-related cases over the past decade...


In April 2000, 7 people tied to the Outfit, including Anthony Dote, Carl Dote, and Donald Scalise, and were indicted in Chicago on charges of racketeering and gambling involving a sports betting operation that netted $2 million over 3 years.

In April 2000, 8 people, including former police detective William Handhart, were indicted in Chicago on charges of running a $10 million jewelry theft ring, which had ties to the Outfit, that included 8 separate thefts of jewelry, watches, etc. in Wisconsin , Michigan , Ohio , Minnesota , Texas , Arizona , and California.

In November 2000, an ex-official of LIUNA Local 5, long connected to the Outfit, was indicted in Chicago of embezzling $473,106 in union funds through increased salaries, bonuses, and vacations that benefited him, his wife, and former Secretary-Treasurer James DiForti, an Outfit associate.

In January 2001, 3 Chicago Outfit members, Frank Caruso Jr., Bruno Caruso, and Leo Caruso, all officials of LIUNA Locals 1001, 1006, and the Chicago Laborers District Council were removed from their positions. In May 2004, Local 1001 was put under federal trusteeship due to ongoing corruption and Outfit control.

In March 2001, Illinois state regulators denied a license to Emerald Casino Inc. to operate a gambling boat in Rosemont, citing the group's alleged Outfit connections. In July 2001, it was reported that Outfit associates involved with the casino had donated almost $150,000 to local public officials. In December 2002, the Illinois Gaming Board banned D&P Construction, owned by Outfit boss John "No Nose" DiFronzo, from hauling trash from the casino. In 2005, 2007, and 2009, the local media reported on DiFronzo's companies, D&P Construction and JKS Ventures, which had received contracts from local townships.

In June 2001, 10 people, including Outfit members Michael Spano and James Inendino, as well as the mayor of Cicero , were indicted in Chicago on charges of racketeering, bribery, official misconduct, wire fraud, bank fraud, mail fraud, interstate transportation of stolen property, tax evasion conspiracy, and money laundering involving the diversion of over $10 million from Cicero's insurance funds for personal benefit. Inendino would later be investiagated in April 2010 regarding his operations outside a local currency exchange.

In October 2001, the Grand Victoria Casino in Elgin , Illinois was forced to pay a $3 million fine for giving a $300,000 air handling contract to the son of an Outfit figure. In April 2003, the casino was fined $7.2 million for giving out contracts to Outfit-connected companies.

In February 2002, 8 people tied to the Outfit, including William "Billy D" DiDomenico, were indicted in Chicago on charges of running a sports betting operation over a 10 year period.

In March 2002, Richard Caravetta, an official of LIUNA Local 2, resigned due his Outfit ties and various union violations.

In April 2002, 10 Outfit members and associates, including James "Jimmy" Cozzo, were indicted in Chicago for skimming over $3.2 million, allegedly for a casino in Caracao, from illegal bingo games carried out by using veteran's groups as fronts at the Grand Palace bingo hall.

In April 2002, an Outfit associate, Anthony Giannone, pled guilty in Chicago for conspiring to possess and distribute more than 100 kilos of marijuana.

In May 2002, 2 Outfit associates, Nick Boscarino and Ralph Aulenta, were indicted in Chicago on charges of tax fraud, insurance fraud, and money laundering involving the siphoning of over $460,000 from the Village of Rosemont through a mob-owned insurance company.

In May 2002, an official of IBT Union Local 714, tied to the Outfit, was expelled due to a plot to drive down wages and benefits for IBT Local 631 in Las Vegas . In October 2002, the report "The Teamsters: Perception and Reality" was released, resulting from the RISE investigation into ongoing Outfit influence and corruption in the Teamsters Union, which included investigations into IBT Locals 330, 714, 726, 727, 743, 781, 786, in Chicago.

In February 2003, 17 people involved with the Crazy Horse Too strip club in Nevada , tied to the Outfit, were indicted on charges of racketeering, corruption, extortion, robbery, and tax fraud.

In January 2004, 3 people, including Paul Karoluk, are indicted for running a multimillion dollar burglary ring tied to the Outfit.

In July 2004, after being banned in the 1990's from Laborers Union, Cicero/Melrose Park crew boss, John "Pudgy" Matassa Jr., was reported to be overseeing the Amalgamated Transit Workers Union Local 711.

In November 2004, the "Hired Truck Program" scandal broke, in which at least 28 people and 26 trucking and carting companies, including ones tied to the Outfit, and the city's Streets and Sanitation, Transportation, and Water Departments, were charged in a series of indictments with racketeering conspiracy, bribery, bid-rigging, theft, billing at union (IBT Local 726) wages while using non-union labor, and obstruction of justice in a scheme to obtain $40 million in city contracts.

In February 2005, it was reported that a tribal casino boat off the coast of Cancun Mexico had investors with Outfit ties.

In April 2005, 14 Outfit members and associates, including administration members James "Jimmy the Man" Marcello and Joseph "The Clown" Lombardo, and and South Side/26th Street member Frank "Brankie Breeze" Calabrese, were indicted on charges of racketeering, conspiracy, running sports betting and video poker operations, extorting a "street tax" from restaurant and 2 porn shops, tax evasion, and multiple murder counts. In January 2007, a U.S. Marshal, John Ambrose, was indicted in Chicago with illegally disclosing information about turncoat Nicholas Calabrese to Outfit members.

In February 2006, 9 people tied to the Outfit, including John "Tiger" Frisella, were indicted in Rockford for running a sports betting operation that netted $500,000.

In July 2008, Outfit associate, Anthony Calabrese, was convicted for running a burglary ring.

In March 2009, a civil RICO complaint was filed in Chicago against 7 Outfit members and associates, including boss John "No Nose" DiFronzo and Elmwood Park crew bosses, Peter "Greedy Petey" Fratto and Rudolph "Uncle Rudy" Fratto, that charged them with extortion, intimidation, loansharking, and murder conspiracy involving the ownership in a Melrose Park medical clinic and the shaking down of one of it's patients, Joseph Fosco, the son of a former mob-connected labor union boss.

In May 2009, 8 Outfit members and associates, including Grand Avenue crew street boss, Michael "The Large Guy" Sarno, and a Berwyn police officer, were indicted on charges of racketeering, conspiracy, engaging in nine jewelry robberies worth over $1.8 million, transportation and fencing of stolen cigarettes, arson in the form of employing the Outlaw Motorcycle Gang to detonate a pipe bomb at a rival video poker business, running video poker operations, obstruction of a criminal investigation, wire fraud, and tax evasion.

In September 2009, Elmwood Park crew street boss, Rudolph "Uncle Rudy" Fratto, was indicted on charges of tax evasion. In March 2010, Fratto and an associate were indicted in Chicago on charges of mail fraud in connection with a contract bid-rigging scheme to provide forklift trucks for local trade shows.

In December 2009, approximately 10-12 local bars and taverns in Chicago were raided involving an investigation into Outfit-connected video poker machines.

As for the current remaining viable families....

The Genovese family is #1, as it always has been. The Gambinos are a strong #2, pretty much as it always has been. Those are your two large, powerhouse families, each with about 200 members, and who are the most active, expansive, and diversified.

The gap between the three mid-sized families, the Luccheses, Colombos, and Bonannos, is closer than a lot of people think. They are all relatively the same in size with about 100 members each. If one insisted in putting them in a specific order, the Luccheses would probably be next. An argument can be made either way for whether the Colombos or Boanannos would come last. But there really isn't that much of a difference.

Then you have the four smaller families, each with about 50 members or so. Chicago would still be next in line but it's much more comparable to other families in that same category in size and activity than many think who are still stuck back in the 1950's. After the Outfit, I'd probably say New England would come next. And an argument could be made whether New Jersey or Philadelphia would come after. To me, it's like splitting hairs.

Those are the 9 families still considered viable by the feds. Yes, it can be said there is more of what is left of the mob in Detroit and Buffalo than Pittsburgh or St. Louis but it none of them are much of a factor at this point.

Haha...throwing in Fosco's civil RICO complaint, eh?

I'm sure that would delight him!

Yes of course there are a few mob-related busts a year. I was a the Sarno trial actually. These were not members of a sleek new streamlined criminal organization readily adapting to the 21st century.

They were old white trash breaking into fifth-rate jewelry stores in dingy neighborhoods near the airport and pawning the jewelry at 15 percent of retail.

I could be wrong but wasn't the Hired Truck program mostly smoke? Like out of the 110 contracts awarded, one went to a firm owned by a reputed mobster or ex mobster. Then the papers wrote MOB in 75 point font.

What I just said has NOTHING to do with NY. I'm not even from NY. Frankly, I'm more attracted to Miami and Vegas...and the pornstars in San Fernando Valley.

As for back in the day.....


The Chicago Outfit was one of 7 families that were on the original Commission established in 1931, along with the five New York families and Buffalo. The Genovese family represented most of the eastern families on the Commission. The Outfit represented most of the western families. By the 1960's, the ties between the families across the nation had started to become weaker and the Outfit missed more and more Commission meetings. This eventually resulted in a sort of "two headed" Commission with the New York and other eastern families in one and the Outfit resolving issues regarding western families in the other. The only remaining common interests were open areas like Florida, Nevada, and California, and the national unions like the Teamsters, Laborers, and Hotel Employees Union.

There is really no argument that the northeast was always a more important Mafia base than the midwest. With New York itself being ground zero for all things Mafia. The Genovese were not only the most powerful family in New York. The families they represented in the east were larger and more important than the ones the Outfit represented in the west.

At its peak the Outfit was well known for its strong political clout. If any family could rival this during the same time frame in the 1950's and 1960's, it was the Genovese family in New York and New Jersey. Frank Costello had as much political influence as guys like Guzik, Humphries, or Alex ever had.

Besides controlling several Teamsters and Laborers Union Locals, as well as a few Hotel Employees Union locals, the Outfit had considerable clout over those unions on a national scale and their pension funds. The difference is, the Genovese family controlled even more Teamster and Laborers locals, and about the same number of Hotel Employees Union locals. And they had comparative influence on a national level. Through their extensive involvement in these unions that was seen nowhere else outside of New York, the Genovese were able to control (along with the other New York families) the construction industry, trucking industry, garbage industry, the garment center, the trade show industry at the Javits Center, the waterfront, the Fulton Fish market, etc. Plus, the Genovese shared controlled of the 4th major labor union, the ILA, with the Gambinos, and had sway on the docks in Manhattan, New Jersey, and Miami.

At their peak, both families operated in several locations. In the 1950's and 1960's, after the Outfit, the Genovese family had the most interest in Las Vegas hotels. The Genovese family had extensive interests in the entertainment industry. And the Genovese have always been said to have the largest mob gambling operations in the country. And, at their peak, the Genovese had over 400 members. The Outfit maybe had half of that at its peak.

I'm starting to realize that it's a lost cause with you. You have your preconceived notion - based on basically nothing besides assumptions and you thinking you have a first hand knowledge because you talk to people in bars and were at the Sarno trial - and there is no amount of information or evidence that can be put in front of you that will change your mind.

Once again, I could totally see your point if I was like many others who have outdated ideas about the Outfit. Like those who claim it still runs Chicago with an iron fist. I've gotten into many debates with what I call Chicago Outfit fan boys. But I'm not saying that at all. In fact, I'm saying that the Outfit is now one of a few smaller families left after the New York families. But they are not dead, or nearly so, like you claim.

You can accept the available facts or you can just keep pretending like you have it all figured out.

You forgot about Jerry Scalise and Arthur Reichel!

Agree with almost every single word you said here Ivy. I'm not so sure if the Genoveses have always been the most powerful family, but we've had that debate before of course.


You can say that again.

Like many others, I used to think the Gambinos were #1. I had read all the same books on that family, of which there are many, while there isn't much on the Genovese. I've read many of the same claims back in the 70's and 80's about the Gambinos being the top family. And I think during that time frame, they certainly rivaled the Genovese in many ways. But once you start to dig deeper, you get a different picture. You see that Carlo Gambino being the top boss in his time didn't automatically make the Gambinos the strongest family. Just like Massino being the top boss for a time didn't make the Bonannos the strongest family. Likewise, you see that the Genovese were not suffering from a lack of leadership at all like many thought. They just couldn't identify who was leading the family for many years, which of course, was by design.

The Genovese have always had an edge since the beginning. From its early stages in the Morello gang to the Masseria family later on. To Luciano and Costello after that. Then onto guys like Funzi Tieri, Tony Salerno, and the Chin. They've always had the most competent leadership. They've always been said to be the richest family. Even when the Gambinos were slightly larger in size, the Genovese were always considered wealthier and more sophisticated. It's the Genovese that are called the "Ivy League or the Underworld" and "Rolls Royce of Organized Crime." Not the Gambinos. Or the Outfit.

I don't think I have a first hand knowledge of anything. Those were just things I did that were interesting to me and my impressions.

I'm not even arguing anything anymore.

This whole discussion got started because someone wrote that the Outfit had 200 made members which I said was ridiculous.

We obviously have different impressions of where the Outfit is and its near future but I don't pretend to have definitive knowledge on the subject.

But no, I don't think low-end jewelry thieving and video poker are indicative of a real healthy, cutting-edge criminal organization, particularly compared to the very real and frightening political and financial power it wielded until the early 90s.

The RATE of decay is the writing on the wall.

The Philly Mob may not be the biggest, but it is the strongest and best run.Thanks 2 Uncle Joe!

Anyone who thinks the Outfit still has 200 members is clearly uninformed. But so are those who think video poker and low end jewelry heists are all there is left to the Outfit. And nobody is saying they are what they were 20 years ago. No family is. But having declined does not mean dead.

Listen, you may be right and you certainly know your stuff. I truly enjoy reading your comments and even though I don't always agree or view certain things the same way, you're certainly one of the most reliable and most knowledgeable guys in here imho. What bothers me about The Genovese family is how little we truly know about them. That is of course a testament to how competent they are. When you look at their past leaders, I can certainly see why you come to this conclusion. The Bonanno era under Massino has been of great interest to me and they were definitely getting very wealthy at the end. Now they may not have been as wealthy as The Genovese, but they were definitely on a fast roll. Perhaps too fast.

I will say this though, I've always seen The Genovese family as the most powerful family. The Gambinos may have come close, but they just didn't have the same reach and you've given plenty examples of that. Due to his political connections, Costello was quite possibly the most powerful mob boss in history. Then you got Vito, Jerry Catena, Joe Adonis, Benny Squint, Miranda, Fat Tony and of course Jimmy Alo. All of these men had control over hundreds and not just the same guys. They were bosses in their own right.

That's why I go by what law enforcement officials, journalists, and mob figures have said about them.

yeah the genovese are def the most interesting to me too . a lot of the more recent bosses/alledged bosses/admin members kind of have a similar background. grew up in the city or in the BX, were boxers, and are all quiet and low key as they come. i think that's kinda neat. you can kinda tell the genovese's top guys were built for it, where as some of the other families top guys...not so much.

regardless though..as low key as they are none of them have been able to avoid jail or parole

where can i read info on Philip Lombardo? is there anything out there on him (besides wiki)

Sorry Vin and Ivy, but I think the Gambino's eclipsed the Genovese's under Carlo, for a period of time, not the whole time, but certainly for 5 - 10 years before he died. Don't forget he loaned Tommy Eboli $ and had him killed for not repaying, then pushed for Tieri to become boss of the Genovese's.

IMO, the Genovese's are the strongest today, and throughout modern history, but they did not have a clean run in the top spot.

There is no way to measure the wealth, but we can get a sense of power, and Carlo had it.

"Carlo Gambino was a squirrel of a man" - Joe Bonanno
"I'll make Carlo Gambino shit in the middle of Times Square" - Carmine Galante
"He was a homo" - Vinny Gorgeous

I love Galante's line, but I am a betting man that he never got that pile of mud dropped. Instead, Dellacroce and Whack Whack got picked up on FBI surveillance tapes hugging it out when Carmine tasted his lead.

Vin, let's just agree to disagree.

I'm just busting balls man, I know Carlo was one of the most powerful people in America at one point. I don't think he had more power than Jerry Catena or Benny Squint. Or Alo, who had guys like Lansky with him.

But yeah, let's agree to disagree.

Something tells me that Eboli, even though he was only an acting boss for the Genovese, didn't exactly need money from Gambino for a drug deal. Furthermore, I don't believe Gambino was able to just kill a high level Genovese guy like that by himself. It's likely more complicated than that. Like when the Genovese killed the Gambino family's captain in Connecticut - Frank Piccolo. Castellano had given his OK.

And Gambino wanting Tieri to take over isn't the same as him telling the Genovese, "This is who your new boss is." Which, for instance, is what happened when the Genovese family installed Scarfo as the new boss in Philadelphia or Nicky Bianco up in New England.

At his peak in the 1960's and early 1970's, I think Carlo was the first among equals, so to speak. But this idea that he was the "boss of bosses" who had defacto sway over other families isn't true. There's never been such a thing in the American mob. And once again, being the top boss doesn't automatically make his organization the top family.

I think the Gambinos rivaled the Genovese in many ways for about 25 years from the late 1960's to the early 1990's. You could say they were #1 and #1A. But I don't think they ever supplanted the Genovese over all.

Ivy i never knew the genovese family inserted nicky bianco into the boss in new englland. Would that mean they sided with the renegade faction of the patriarca family that was trying to push out patriarca jr and grasso ???

I would be interested to see any materials suggesting video poker is not the Outfits main racket these days. I've seen video poker cited many times but for arguments sake I'll reference John Binders

i like many other people here have a hard time swallowing that the strongest family outside of new york main raquet is nothing but video poker. we all know that every family some way or another is involved in narcotics. narcotics is prob the biggest money maker out there. if you have all these materials that you've seen sited suggesting this please post links or the hardcore info and who is john binders? sorry but i don't know who he is and did try to google him to do my own research but could find nothing. please don't tell me he's the bartender that feeds you your inside info.

John Binder is widely regarded as the city's greatest, or at least most visible, authority on the Chicago Outfit past and present and is regularly interviewed on local news. For instance he recently demolished an ill-founded, yet popular, book hawking a "new theory" [it actually wasn't new at all] on the St. Valentine's Day Massacre.) He's the author of the 2003 Book "The Chicago Outfit." (Aracdia.)

Know what business Jimmy Marcello, the acting head of the mob, was running, when arrested? A video poker business, M & M Amuesment.

Here's one article, reprinted from the Sun Times, written by Steve Warmiber, one of the city's most well known Outfit reporters: "Video gambling is the mob's lifeblood, pumping millions of dollars every year into the Outfit's coffers."

http://www.ipsn.org/gambling/feds_zero_in_on_video_poker_king.htm

You know what I wanna know. I wanna know which family is the weakest family in the United States. Like 2 guys left, boss and underboss. They control one video poker machine and have to share the profits it with five transsexuals. I just need a good laugh.

im gonna say pittsburgh or Kansas city

Ivy, I did not say or suggest that Carlo was boss of bosses, but I think it fair to say, and it is generally held, that Carlo had greater power than any other boss at that time.

Clearly, the Gambino, Genovese and Lucchese families were tightly aligned. I think Carlo was more of a puppet master - he was a great strategist. Some of it is legend, but some is fact.

After Carlo, the power moved back to the Genovese's because Big Paul was a limp dick pussy. Just ask Gloria (or anyone from the Bergin).