how are assassins like Roco chosen? for instance, when he is ordered to kill Roth, he knows, everyone knows he's either gonna go to jail forever for it, or be killed while doing it. why would Roco take such a job?

would the reward to his family be the only reason he would do it?

or did him and Neri draw straws ?

seriously, why would Roco do it knowing his life would be over?

Was it a chance for self redemption for him possibly being the one who may have set up Michael and then killed the Tahoe assasains when the hit on Mike failed?????

See Turnbull and Plawrence's posts over in the Rocco Lampone topic : http://www.gangsterbb.net/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005863#000000

Both of these gentlemen privide some interesting insight and ideas as to why Rocco would carry out, what is basically a suicide mission, for The Corleones.


Don Cardi

thanks!

interesting stuff.

And thank you, DC, for posting that link. It saved me from another cut-and-paste job that would only have served to further aggrevate plaw.

We don't want to aggrevate Crabby, do we?


Don Cardi

You talkin' to me?

What makes you say that?


Don Cardi

You know what I think?

A subtheme in GFII is how Neri attempts to push Hagen and Rocco aside to become #2 to Michael.

Sorry guys, I don't see your point about Rocco trying to make up for things that went wrong valid. Rocco had been given a high position in the family and Michael never would have kept him around if he thought he was a weak link. He learned that when his father was shot. Weak links could not be trusted or allowed. Rocco would not have been around at the time of the Roth shooting if Michael thought negative about him.

Then the stuff about Rocco trying to get up to or over Neri is always short of the mark. Neri is a league away from Rocco thoughout the story.

If you read the novel, which I know everyone has. It becomes very clear in a number of spots that Neri is Michael's golden boy.

Michael himself worked to get Neri into the family. He was put into Clemenza regime and tested carefully. He worked hard and proved to all that he was the new Luca Brasi.
Yes, Michael's Luca Brasi. His loyalty clear to all, and to all that he was Michael's.

Rocco on the other hand came up thru the ranks, making his first move by killing Paullie. Rocco Lampone's power rise may be seen by many being at the point of the planning of the killings after Don Vito death. Yes, every one hears Hagen talk about the "secret regime" of Rocco Lampone. So he must be more powerful then Neri, him having his own regime and all. But what most people miss in that part is this.
That Michael is dealing directly with Nerri now, rather than through Hagen or a Caporegime as a buffer. That my friends make him a lot closer to Michael then Rocco and almost as close as Hagen is. As Hagen has been kept out by Michael during this time.


Later Hagen asks Michael "how do you think they'll come at you?
Michael- "Through someone close, supposedly, somebody I wouldn't suspect."
Hagen - "Someone like me."
Michael- "You're Irish, they won't trust you."
"They won't go to you and they won't go to Neri. Both of you are too close to me".

"Roco Lampone isn't close enough . No, it will be Clemenza, Tessio or Carlo Rizz

Now near the end of the novel, Chapter 32, Now the Corlene Family was unchangeable, and Clemenza had his own family. Rocco Lampone was the Corlene Caporegime. In Nevada, Albert Neri was head of all security for the family-controlled hotels. Hagen too, was part of Michael's Western Family.

So as you can tell Hagen and Neri, the closer of the men are working in the legit world while Rocco is still on the dark side with the muscle. To Michael, Roth was a very important part of the puzzle. And Rooco was the head of the muscle side of the old world. This is why Rocco went.

Rocco could never have passed over Neri, he could only hope to keep his position by doing the hit.. That is the way I see it anyway.
Karl

Karl, excellent post. That was a good explanation of why Rocco was the obvious choice.

WOW GOOD JOB KARL

I have always wondered why Rocco did such a blatant hit on Roth? It really was a suicide mission. I realize that he didn't have much time to do it, since Roth was going immediately into federal custody, but couldn't he have given himself a little more room for escape?

Just to add something about the Rocco shooting. I haven't watched the scene in a while but I believe he was shot in the back. For a shot in the back to kill him that would mean he wasn't wearing a bullet proof vest, that could be another point for him not expecting to return.

Karl, much have what you posted is very valid. You've made some really excellent points. However there is one that I must respectfully disagree with you on.

While this is true, at the same time you are using quotes from the novel. A novel that was written without a plot for a Godfather II movie in mind. And a Godfather 2 movie that was BASED on pieces from the novel. Yes there are many parts of the novel that back up certain sub-plots of the movie, but there are also many inconsistancies between the novel and the movies. According to the novel Santino is a teenager and sees Vito kill Fanucci. But in the movie Santino is just a baby. My point here being that it is not always valid to use something from the novel to substantiate an issue in the movie.

Yes Neri was Michael's right hand man. Yes Neri was the closest one to Michael. But let's not forget that in the GFII movie, we see both Neri and Rocco in on many of the meetings and the planning that takes place.

"I trust these men with my life Senator...." THESE men, meaning Rocco and Neri. Rocco was on the inside, maybe not right next to Michael, but just a notch under Neri. And therefore I also think that there became this competition thing on Rocco's part, with Neri. Rocco wanted to be trusted by Michael in the same way that Michael trusted Neri. Rocco wanted Michael to look at him as his Luca Brasi also.

Yes, I agree that in Michael's eyes, Rocco could never have passed over Neri or even be an equal to Neri. But I do believe that in Rocco's mind he thought that by taking on the mission of taking Roth out himself, there would be a chance that Michael would then look at Rocco as being as valuable to him as Neri was. He took a chance that he may just get out of there alive and then having the possibility of being held in a much higher esteem, like Neri was, by Michael.


Don Cardi

i think Rocco was actually shot in the the stomach. he was running, and then as shots rang out, he turned around to try and shoot back and then got shot. right? *i think*.

Could be I honestly don't remember. DC or TB? But either way he wasn't wearing a bullet proof vest.