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Vincent #32400
09/06/05 04:00 PM
09/06/05 04:00 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Belfast, Northern Ireland
Don Jimbob Offline OP
Associate
Don Jimbob  Offline OP
Associate
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Belfast, Northern Ireland
How could Michael allow Vincent to take over? I mean, fair enough Andy Garcia did a good job with him, but he was no Don. Surely Michael could have found someone slightly more subtle, even Al Neri would be a better choice I think if he couldn't find a blood replacement. He was exactly like Sonny, couldn't Michael see that he'd destroy the family, he's supposed to be shrewd and intelligent. Maybe he was slipping in his old age?

I mean:
"I say we make em dead! You give the order, I take care of it!"


"It's A Sicilian message. It means Luca Brasi sleeps with the fishes."
Re: Vincent #32401
09/06/05 07:40 PM
09/06/05 07:40 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,019
Buenos Aires, Argentina
Don Pappo Napolitano Offline
Underboss
Don Pappo Napolitano  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,019
Buenos Aires, Argentina
I agree with you, I told everybody here before Al Neri deserves to be the Don because of his loyalty to Michael all these years. And Vincent did not make a carrear from soldier to caporegime, and you know... Al Neri did it. Some people say it would be the same as making Luca Brasi a Don, but Neri is more clever than Luca Brassi. And I think he is qualified enough to take over. But some people here say it was a strategic move making Vincent a Don, but I think it is the biggest mistake Michael has done in his whole life. Vincent will take the family to drug business, which Vito and Michael have avoided. And that would be the end for them.


Pelé is the King
Maradona is God!
Re: Vincent #32402
09/06/05 08:30 PM
09/06/05 08:30 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Welcome, Don Jimbob.
As I posted before, Michael recognized Vincent as a violent pazzo who had limited use to him going forward. I believe he offered Vincent the Donship as a quid pro quo for giving up his courtship of Mary. I think that if Michael had had his way, Mary would have married someone truly "legitimate." He (Michael) would have been increasingly "legitimate" through his domination of International Immobiliare. Vincent would have been the head of a shrinking "olive oil business"--the ever-diminishing "illegitimate" end of the Corleone enterprise. Vincent would have provided just enough threat and muscle to keep the vultures away from Michael. But Vincent would have had no part in Michael's going-forward life.


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Vincent #32403
09/07/05 10:48 AM
09/07/05 10:48 AM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 607
Peter_Clemenza Offline
Underboss
Peter_Clemenza  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 607
I think Michael Corleone's decision to allow Vincent Mancini to become Boss of the Corleone Family was a great idea for the same reasons as Turnbull.

Re: Vincent #32404
09/07/05 11:46 AM
09/07/05 11:46 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 139
Chicago
BarrytheBull Offline
Made Member
BarrytheBull  Offline
Made Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 139
Chicago
I think Michael letting Vince be the Don was a good idea as well.....time were changing, just like when they changed for Don Vito, they were changing for Michael.....Vincent was better suited to "take it to the streets" which is where the businesses were going.......


The Bull!!!

"...you straightened my brother out??"

"Give him a living, but never discuss the family business in front of him."
Re: Vincent #32405
09/07/05 03:00 PM
09/07/05 03:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,019
Buenos Aires, Argentina
Don Pappo Napolitano Offline
Underboss
Don Pappo Napolitano  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,019
Buenos Aires, Argentina
Barry, I know the times change but Vito`s opinion about drugs will live trough those times.


Pelé is the King
Maradona is God!
Re: Vincent #32406
09/07/05 03:07 PM
09/07/05 03:07 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 139
Chicago
BarrytheBull Offline
Made Member
BarrytheBull  Offline
Made Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 139
Chicago
No, no, no.....I didn't mean "take it to the streets" as meaning drugs.....I meant......Michael didn't have the ice in his heart anymore to kill or have people killed.....in order to assure the survival of the family, someone who had that "ice" in their veins needed to be in charge....that is what I meant.
sorry for the confusion. blush


The Bull!!!

"...you straightened my brother out??"

"Give him a living, but never discuss the family business in front of him."
Re: Vincent #32407
09/07/05 05:35 PM
09/07/05 05:35 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Belfast, Northern Ireland
Don Jimbob Offline OP
Associate
Don Jimbob  Offline OP
Associate
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8
Belfast, Northern Ireland
Wow Turnbull that's an excellent way to explain it. I think I'll choose to believe that, it makes me sad to think that Michael had lost it.


"It's A Sicilian message. It means Luca Brasi sleeps with the fishes."
Re: Vincent #32408
09/13/05 04:21 PM
09/13/05 04:21 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Turnbull's point is well taken, but what I dont get is how Vincent transforms so quickly. He goes from a thug biting Zasa's ear off to a well dressed, sophisticated assistant Don who in Sicily 1) Confers with Dontomassino; 2) Is able to fool Altobello; and 3) Is placed in charge of settling all family scores AND providing security at the opera house.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Vincent #32409
09/13/05 08:36 PM
09/13/05 08:36 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Quote
Originally posted by dontomasso:
Turnbull's point is well taken, but what I dont get is how Vincent transforms so quickly. He goes from a thug biting Zasa's ear off to a well dressed, sophisticated assistant Don who in Sicily 1) Confers with Dontomassino; 2) Is able to fool Altobello; and 3) Is placed in charge of settling all family scores AND providing security at the opera house.
Because FFC could only make the movie 3 hours long! wink

I always thought that they could have at least shown us more of Michael and Vincent together, showed Michael tutoring Vincent more that the one or two scenes that they did.

Don Cardi cool



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Vincent #32410
09/13/05 11:13 PM
09/13/05 11:13 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Well said, DC! We could give FFC and Puzo the benefit of the doubt--that after Michael sternly shouted his disapproval of Vincent's assassination of Zasa without Michael's ok ("I still command this family...that is not what I wanted...never give that kind of order again...") Vincent might have taken it as tutoring and mended his ways. But I doubt it. I'm with dt here--and I'm saying it's another example of poor direction and poor continuity.
DC, to your point about the movie being "only" three hours long smile : One of my erudite movie pals, after seeing it with me for the first time, remarked, "There must be 18 hours of film--whole scenes and chapters--on Paramount's cutting room floor."


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Vincent #32411
09/14/05 11:16 AM
09/14/05 11:16 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Its a small point, but Vincent also apparently learned how to shave other people.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Vincent #32412
09/14/05 11:22 AM
09/14/05 11:22 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,518
AZ
Quote
Originally posted by dontomasso:
Its a small point, but Vincent also apparently learned how to shave other people.
lol
Yes, it's that great "Barber of Seville" tradition so popular among Italian-Americans. (But the music blaring from that Sicilian hotel window sounded like Elvis Costello, not Rossini.)


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Vincent #32413
09/14/05 04:27 PM
09/14/05 04:27 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Yes it was definitely Elvis Costello... I didn't hear anyone singing Figaro Figaro Figaro Figaro


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."


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