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The real reason Tony ...... #473399
02/17/08 02:50 AM
02/17/08 02:50 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
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My own world.
Sorry if this has been posted before,but what is the real reason Tony killed Christopher???

Did He do it because he really thought Chris wasn't going to make it after the crash,or was it because of his paranoia,thinking Chris fantasized his downfall,or even he thought Chris was weak and would "flip"??

I've re watched the episode a few times and i really couldn't place my finger on it.I know he was relieved to some point,but did he really want him dead??


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473405
02/17/08 05:39 AM
02/17/08 05:39 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
chopper Offline
Gaetano Lucchese
chopper  Offline
Gaetano Lucchese

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
I think it was because he thought he was weak and would eventually flip if he was brought up on some strong charges


If i come across the table and take your f*****g eyes out ,will you remember

Aniello Dellacroce
__________________________________
TFI 2nd Bday - Dj Topgroove + Mc Domer
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wN58sasrpYc

TFI Lucky Star
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uw-Uw0DUAGo

Happy Hardcore DJ Hixxy
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Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: chopper] #473416
02/17/08 07:14 AM
02/17/08 07:14 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 44,945
DE NIRO Offline
DE NIRO  Offline

Joined: Sep 2004
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If i remember didn't the airbag crush Chris's wind pipe has he didn't have a seatbealt on, so maybe Tony did him a favor has he wasn't going to make it. But it could have that he was parinoid.


The Mafia Is Not Primarily An Organisation Of Murderers.
First And Foremost,The Mafia Is Made Up Of Thieves.
It Is Driven By Greed And Controlled By Fear.

Between The Law And The Mafia, The Law Is Not The Most To Be Feared

"What if the Mafia were not an organization but a widespread Sicilian attitude of hostility towards the law?"

"Make Love Not War" John Lennon
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: DE NIRO] #473422
02/17/08 10:21 AM
02/17/08 10:21 AM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 381
The BING
Sopranorleone Offline
Capo
Sopranorleone  Offline
Capo
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 381
The BING
In the episode, the doctors actually said that Chris could have survived his injuries. Tony probably told himself after the fact that he was helping Chris by relieving him of his pain. But, the real reason is that Tony felt "afraid" of Chris. Not afraid in the actual sense of the word. Tony thought that Chris, "a weak, lying, sniveling drug addict - the worst kind of bet" would easily flip to the Feds. Then, to add fuel to the fire, Chrissy making Cleaver, a film whose boss represents Tony in more ways than one and ends with the boss being brutally hacked to death, surely didn't ease Tony's suspicions.

It all really started when Adrianna was killed (sorry Olivant). I always felt that Chris thought that he had a choice - and that whoever he sided with would be obliged to thank him. So, Chris expected a thank you from Tony. But to T, Chris had no choice. Due to the nature of his profession, Chris had to give up Ade. So, why should he be thanked just for doing his job? Which is validated in "Walk Like a Man," when Chris says after the AA meeting, "Fine. But he never appreciated it."

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Sopranorleone] #473460
02/17/08 04:36 PM
02/17/08 04:36 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 554
Philadelphia
BDuff Offline
Philadelphia's Consigliere
BDuff  Offline
Philadelphia's Consigliere
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Philadelphia
True Sopranoleone, but don't forget this. Tony had given up on Chris as his successor, at the time of Chris's death, Tony had already been grooming Bobby Bacala his unofficial Underboss.

A scene in 6B that proves this is in "Walk like a Man" where Chris comes to tell Tony about Paulie's boosting. Who's in the room? Tony, Sil, and Bobby. Hell, when Bobby asks Chris what happened, Chris doesn't even acknowledge him just shoots him a look.

Since the end of 6A, Tony was phasing out Christopher and Paulie from his inner circle. Tony could have given Esplanade to Chris, but no he gave it to Carlo. Carlo and Bobby made money and were low profile whereas Tony viewed Paulie as incompetant and Chris as a huge risk. Both Chris and Paulie were prone to violence and could be an easy target for the FBI.

I know I'm off topic, so back to my point. So when Chris crashed that car, did Tony really need Chris? He was using again, phased out by Bobby and alienating himself from the other DiMeo Capos. Killing Chris at that point didn't mean much to Tony, Chris was long gone in his eyes.

PS - Episode 9 "Glorified Crew" will be up soon


"When my time comes, tell me, will I stand up?"
Paulie "Walnuts" Gaultiere - The Sopranos

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: BDuff] #473466
02/17/08 05:28 PM
02/17/08 05:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
Some good points.I just couldn't believe it when i first saw that episode.

Tony is one cold hearted prick.Chris would have never flipped.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473467
02/17/08 05:31 PM
02/17/08 05:31 PM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 44,945
DE NIRO Offline
DE NIRO  Offline

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But you can never trust a junkie,i suppose thats what Tony was worried about..


The Mafia Is Not Primarily An Organisation Of Murderers.
First And Foremost,The Mafia Is Made Up Of Thieves.
It Is Driven By Greed And Controlled By Fear.

Between The Law And The Mafia, The Law Is Not The Most To Be Feared

"What if the Mafia were not an organization but a widespread Sicilian attitude of hostility towards the law?"

"Make Love Not War" John Lennon
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: DE NIRO] #473484
02/17/08 07:40 PM
02/17/08 07:40 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
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My own world.
Yeah i guess so,but geez.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473493
02/17/08 08:53 PM
02/17/08 08:53 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 381
The BING
Sopranorleone Offline
Capo
Sopranorleone  Offline
Capo
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Posts: 381
The BING
Whisper, I respectfully disagree. I think its even possible that he did flip before he was killed - the cat in "Made in America" could have symbolized Chris being a rat just as easily as it could symbolize the re-incarnation of Ade or Chris.

One line of thinking: Why shouldnt he flip? He could continue writing, do something he actually enjoys doing, hang around people he wants to be around (show business people), and still have a family. In reality, he would have been better off flipping when Ade asked him too, and I think he realized that by the time of his death.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Sopranorleone] #473508
02/17/08 11:54 PM
02/17/08 11:54 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
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My own world.
Good point Sopranorleone,
It is definitely possible and no doubt Chris contemplated it and then thought about how his life would have been if he had when he was with Ade.But i still think Chris would have stayed loyal.That was the type of guy he was i think.I couldn't picture him turning rat,even if he really wanted to.

Great theory of the cat though,i never thought of it like that.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473543
02/18/08 06:05 AM
02/18/08 06:05 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
chopper Offline
Gaetano Lucchese
chopper  Offline
Gaetano Lucchese

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
 Originally Posted By: whisper the don from down under
Some good points.I just couldn't believe it when i first saw that episode.

Tony is one cold hearted prick.Chris would have never flipped.



once a smack head always a smack head

they can never be trusted


If i come across the table and take your f*****g eyes out ,will you remember

Aniello Dellacroce
__________________________________
TFI 2nd Bday - Dj Topgroove + Mc Domer
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wN58sasrpYc

TFI Lucky Star
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uw-Uw0DUAGo

Happy Hardcore DJ Hixxy
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pv7H4YkFKs
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: chopper] #473548
02/18/08 06:56 AM
02/18/08 06:56 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
 Originally Posted By: chopper
 Originally Posted By: whisper the don from down under
Some good points.I just couldn't believe it when i first saw that episode.

Tony is one cold hearted prick.Chris would have never flipped.



once a smack head always a smack head

they can never be trusted


whatever crack head \:p


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473549
02/18/08 07:05 AM
02/18/08 07:05 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
chopper Offline
Gaetano Lucchese
chopper  Offline
Gaetano Lucchese

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
How did you know \:p


If i come across the table and take your f*****g eyes out ,will you remember

Aniello Dellacroce
__________________________________
TFI 2nd Bday - Dj Topgroove + Mc Domer
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wN58sasrpYc

TFI Lucky Star
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uw-Uw0DUAGo

Happy Hardcore DJ Hixxy
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pv7H4YkFKs
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: chopper] #473552
02/18/08 07:36 AM
02/18/08 07:36 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
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My own world.
 Originally Posted By: chopper
How did you know \:p


Because you remind me of myself. \:D


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #473559
02/18/08 08:14 AM
02/18/08 08:14 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK
chopper Offline
Gaetano Lucchese
chopper  Offline
Gaetano Lucchese

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,228
Sheffield UK


If i come across the table and take your f*****g eyes out ,will you remember

Aniello Dellacroce
__________________________________
TFI 2nd Bday - Dj Topgroove + Mc Domer
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wN58sasrpYc

TFI Lucky Star
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=uw-Uw0DUAGo

Happy Hardcore DJ Hixxy
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pv7H4YkFKs
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #477322
03/04/08 12:18 PM
03/04/08 12:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 13
deadmeadow Offline
Wiseguy
deadmeadow  Offline
Wiseguy
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Posts: 13
I think he saw a weakness in christopher and didn't want him to take over if he were to get killed.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: deadmeadow] #477768
03/06/08 12:24 PM
03/06/08 12:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 21
Aristotle Offline
Wiseguy
Aristotle  Offline
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Posts: 21
he knew he would become a rat to have any chance in the life chris wanted to live.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Aristotle] #489702
05/24/08 05:55 AM
05/24/08 05:55 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 949
M
MiniMafiaBoss Offline
Underboss
MiniMafiaBoss  Offline
M
Underboss
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 949
You can never trust a drug taker, even ir they earn soooooo good, its time to make them go or lower them in rank, even further, so info won't get to them.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: BDuff] #490040
05/27/08 06:18 PM
05/27/08 06:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Longneck Offline
Longneck  Offline

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Originally Posted By: BDuff

Since the end of 6A, Tony was phasing out Christopher and Paulie from his inner circle.


Chris yeah, but Paulie?

Chris was an addict. An addict can be trusted to be unreliable and Chris had risen too high up to be able to be unreliable. Tony killed him here because of his close relationship with him years earlier when he promoted Chris while overlooking his numerous faults and then it got to a point where they weren't as close and Chris couldn't be saved by Tony's favoritism this time.




Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Longneck] #490049
05/27/08 06:55 PM
05/27/08 06:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
Still, he could have told him to F#ck off. He didn't have to kill the poor bastard.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #490061
05/27/08 08:01 PM
05/27/08 08:01 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Longneck Offline
Longneck  Offline

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Originally Posted By: whisper
Still, he could have told him to F#ck off. He didn't have to kill the poor bastard.


You commit numerous federal crimes with a guy, kill people, etc. and want to leave him alive when he has been harboring resentment for you for awhile now and probably always will?

It was only a matter of time one way or another where Christopher would cause a clusterfuck in Tony's life.




Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Longneck] #490094
05/28/08 04:11 AM
05/28/08 04:11 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
That is not something you can prove though! Perhaps Chris may have gotten over it!! Had one of his cries in Tony's arma etc etc


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #490155
05/28/08 02:02 PM
05/28/08 02:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
O

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,019
Texas
To all Mafia members, everyone is utilitarian and expendable.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #490341
05/29/08 04:39 PM
05/29/08 04:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Longneck Offline
Longneck  Offline

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Originally Posted By: whisper
That is not something you can prove though! Perhaps Chris may have gotten over it!! Had one of his cries in Tony's arma etc etc


Riiiiiiiiiiiight. And Ade is alive.




Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Longneck] #490343
05/29/08 05:05 PM
05/29/08 05:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 381
The BING
Sopranorleone Offline
Capo
Sopranorleone  Offline
Capo
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 381
The BING
No matter how many times Chrissy would cry in T's arms (or whatever else), it would only be a temporary relief. Eventually, something would come along and he'd be back to dreading him all over again. Also, if the FBI were to come knocking down his door, he'd turn T and the gang in in a second if he was facing jailtime.

The Sopranos series really showed the evolution of Christopher Moltisanti. He really loved T and the mob life in the early seasons, but, as things changed and developed, he desired something else in his life - and a different career.

I always thought (and this was confirmed in this past season's "Walk Like a Man") that the whole Aide fiasco (no matter HER fate) was the sparkplug that let things deteriorate very quickly between Chris and T. Tony saw it as, hey, you're in the mafia and you took an oath. This thing of ours is above family. If Aide is a rat, you have no choice but to turn her over to us. Then, why should you be thanked and be given special favors and requests when you're just doing your job? ("How many times are you gonna play the Adrianna card?").
Now, from Chrissy's point of view, he had to make a DECISION and whoever he sided with should be grateful. Chris went with the rules of the mob and turned her in to T. ("But he never appreciated it!"). Chrissy wanted a "hey, thank you, Christapha. You made the right choice," from someone.
But, "they shit on your pity."

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Sopranorleone] #490447
05/30/08 01:43 PM
05/30/08 01:43 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
Looks like I stand alone in this. I just don't think he would have flipped. I like to think, despite some harbored resentment towards Tony, he wouldn't have turned rat. I'm the opposite to you all. I reckon Tony and Chris would have mended the relationship. Oh well..dare to dream.


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Longneck] #490449
05/30/08 01:44 PM
05/30/08 01:44 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
whisper Offline OP
Underboss
whisper  Offline OP
Underboss
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,539
My own world.
Originally Posted By: Longneck
Originally Posted By: whisper
That is not something you can prove though! Perhaps Chris may have gotten over it!! Had one of his cries in Tony's arma etc etc


Riiiiiiiiiiiight. And Ade is alive.


and Ade is alive. Silvio keeps her as a sex slave!!


The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters. Cus D'Amato
Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: whisper] #490454
05/30/08 01:51 PM
05/30/08 01:51 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Longneck Offline
Longneck  Offline

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,527
In a van down by the river!
Originally Posted By: whisper
Looks like I stand alone in this. I just don't think he would have flipped. I like to think, despite some harbored resentment towards Tony, he wouldn't have turned rat. I'm the opposite to you all. I reckon Tony and Chris would have mended the relationship. Oh well..dare to dream.


Can I have some of whatever the hell you're smoking?




Long as I remember The rain been coming down.
Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground.
Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun;
And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Longneck] #490731
06/01/08 11:11 AM
06/01/08 11:11 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 263
Kentucky
Mr.MojoRisin Offline
Capo
Mr.MojoRisin  Offline
Capo
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 263
Kentucky
I always figured he was just sick of his always lying to him about his drug use and was pissed at him for always being such a wreck. He was a liability plain and simple.

Re: The real reason Tony ...... [Re: Mr.MojoRisin] #491276
06/03/08 04:44 PM
06/03/08 04:44 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,893
The 5th circle of hell
Don Smitty Offline
Underboss
Don Smitty  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,893
The 5th circle of hell
He killed Chris because he knew he couldnt trust him anymore.

ds


I woke up this morning with nothing to do and went to bed with only half of it done.


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