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Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: NickleCity] #954271
09/28/18 01:28 PM
09/28/18 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by NickleCity
Originally Posted by Ciment


The theory that Buffalo would give the go ahead, permission or contract to the Musitano's to have Papalia hit, does not make sense in my opinion. The Rizzuto's being behind it is more believable. They were allies with the Musitano's.

I believe more Peter Edwards and Antonio Nicasso's theory that Rizzuto wanted to expand into Ontario and Papalia,Violi and Luppino's were in his way.

Let's entertain that Buffalo gave permission then the Luppino/Violi's would have to have been consulted and be part of the decision because of their long history with the Buffalo crime family. What benefit would the Luppino's get from this. All that would do is give more power to their enemies. Rizzuto and Musitano's were allies and the Rizzuto's are no friends of the Luppino/Violi's.


Can both be true? Would it be too much of a stretch that Buffalo was fed up with Pops and signed off on the hit because he had Angelo run over and Pasquale beat up? Did the Rizzuto's use this bad blood to expand into Ontario? Did Buffalo get a piece for allowing this to happened? Weren't the Musitanos know to be allies of Buffalo too?

This raises a lot of questions. One thing is for sure Edwards is knowledgable and reputable, and we shouldn't dismiss what he wrote in Business or Blood.


While you were writing your message I was revising my message and entertained the fact they can both be the case. Refer to my previous message.

Last edited by Ciment; 09/28/18 01:51 PM.
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Sonny_Black] #954272
09/28/18 01:34 PM
09/28/18 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
The theory that Buffalo would give the go ahead, permission or contract to the Musitano's to have Papalia hit, does not make sense in my opinion.


If does if you understand how the Mafia works. Perhaps Papalia had fallen out of favor with Buffalo and had become disposable. I think the Rizzutos could've gotten into trouble with the admin in New York (Sciascia still being alive) if Buffalo wouldn't have sanctioned the hit and people having to answer for it. This is exactly what happened with Panepinto. Since nobody did answer for it (unless Angelo's murder was related) it makes a lot of sense.

Quote
I believe more Peter Edwards and Antonio Nicasso's theory that Rizzuto wanted to expand into Ontario and Papalia,Violi and Luppino's were in his way.


Then why didn't they just kill them all? Why leave the vengeful kids of Paolo Violi alive? Because Mafia politics protected their safety. Too many people opposed to it (Toronto and New York) so they couldn't do it.

Quote
Let's entertain that Buffalo gave permission then the Luppino/Violi's would have to have been consulted and be part of the decision because of their long history with the Buffalo crime family.


The Luppinos didn't need to be consulted at all if Buffalo gave permission as Papalia was a member of their family. If they gave permission, that'll be it.


My responses were based on the long standing relationship between the Luppino's and Buffalo.

What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.

Last edited by Ciment; 09/28/18 01:39 PM.
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Ciment] #954273
09/28/18 02:08 PM
09/28/18 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Ciment
What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.


It would be better for business perhaps (hence why Montagna consulted so many people), but if Buffalo decided to kill Papalia (or sanction his murder) the Luppinos could do nothing else than go along with it since it would be a family matter.


"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Sonny_Black] #954274
09/28/18 02:29 PM
09/28/18 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.


It would be better for business perhaps (hence why Montagna consulted so many people), but if Buffalo decided to kill Papalia (or sanction his murder) the Luppinos could do nothing else than go along with it since it would be a family matter.


Yes, there is nothing the Luppino's can do, but on the other hand the Luppino's can decide to form an alliance with other New York families that will gain their respect. This is why common sense prevails.

Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Ciment] #954277
09/28/18 02:44 PM
09/28/18 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Ciment
Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.


It would be better for business perhaps (hence why Montagna consulted so many people), but if Buffalo decided to kill Papalia (or sanction his murder) the Luppinos could do nothing else than go along with it since it would be a family matter.


Yes, there is nothing the Luppino's can do, but on the other hand the Luppino's can decide to form an alliance with other New York families that will gain their respect. This is why common sense prevails.



Really depends on the relationship between the Luppinos and Papalia.


"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Sonny_Black] #954278
09/28/18 03:18 PM
09/28/18 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
What happens in Hamilton affects the Luppino's. It is common sense that your business associates would be consulted.

and why he didn't go after the Violi sons was obviously a change of heart for precisely the same reasons you gave.


It would be better for business perhaps (hence why Montagna consulted so many people), but if Buffalo decided to kill Papalia (or sanction his murder) the Luppinos could do nothing else than go along with it since it would be a family matter.


Yes, there is nothing the Luppino's can do, but on the other hand the Luppino's can decide to form an alliance with other New York families that will gain their respect. This is why common sense prevails.



Really depends on the relationship between the Luppinos and Papalia.


Yes, it does but the Luppino's would also be cautious of the Musitano's gaining more power or territory.

Last edited by Ciment; 09/28/18 03:19 PM.
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Sonny_Black] #954318
09/29/18 10:45 AM
09/29/18 10:45 AM
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Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
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Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
Originally Posted by Sonny_Black
Originally Posted by Ciment
The theory that Buffalo would give the go ahead, permission or contract to the Musitano's to have Papalia hit, does not make sense in my opinion.


If does if you understand how the Mafia works. Perhaps Papalia had fallen out of favor with Buffalo and had become disposable. I think the Rizzutos could've gotten into trouble with the admin in New York (Sciascia still being alive) if Buffalo wouldn't have sanctioned the hit and people having to answer for it. This is exactly what happened with Panepinto. Since nobody did answer for it (unless Angelo's murder was related) it makes a lot of sense.

Quote
I believe more Peter Edwards and Antonio Nicasso's theory that Rizzuto wanted to expand into Ontario and Papalia,Violi and Luppino's were in his way.


Then why didn't they just kill them all? Why leave the vengeful kids of Paolo Violi alive? Because Mafia politics protected their safety. Too many people opposed to it (Toronto and New York) so they couldn't do it.

Quote
Let's entertain that Buffalo gave permission then the Luppino/Violi's would have to have been consulted and be part of the decision because of their long history with the Buffalo crime family.


The Luppinos didn't need to be consulted at all if Buffalo gave permission as Papalia was a member of their family. If they gave permission, that'll be it.



What about the fact that Papilia and Boriello borrowed $7,200,000 from Nicolo Rizzuto, and he wanted to get paid back, neither one made any effort to pay him the money back.

$7,200,000 that is a BIG slap in the face.



.

Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: bronx] #954329
09/29/18 01:55 PM
09/29/18 01:55 PM
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Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
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In my opinion you do not go to the remnants of a defunct familyal and ask their permission to whack on e of them.

You just whack em, and say F.U. You can't do anything aabout it.







Last edited by BensonHURST; 09/29/18 01:55 PM.
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: BensonHURST] #954330
09/29/18 01:56 PM
09/29/18 01:56 PM
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Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
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In my opinion you do not go to the remnants of a defunct family and ask their permission to whack one of them.

You just whack em, and say F.U. You can't do anything about it.








Last edited by BensonHURST; 09/29/18 01:57 PM.
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: bronx] #954332
09/29/18 02:54 PM
09/29/18 02:54 PM
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Larry's Bar
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That's against protocol. Of course New York breaks the rules all the time.


"I have this Nightmare. I'm on 5th avenue watching the St. Patrick's Day parade and I have a coronary and nine thousand cops march happily over my body." Chief Sidney Green
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: BensonHURST] #954333
09/29/18 03:31 PM
09/29/18 03:31 PM
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Sonny_Black Offline
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Originally Posted by BensonHURST
What about the fact that Papilia and Boriello borrowed $7,200,000 from Nicolo Rizzuto, and he wanted to get paid back, neither one made any effort to pay him the money back.

$7,200,000 that is a BIG slap in the face.


Could be a legitimate reason, also for Buffalo to go along.

Originally Posted by BensonHURST
In my opinion you do not go to the remnants of a defunct familyal and ask their permission to whack on e of them.

You just whack em, and say F.U. You can't do anything aabout it.




In 1997 Buffalo was still a viable family.


"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: bronx] #954344
09/29/18 07:55 PM
09/29/18 07:55 PM
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They all want influence in Hamilton because there is also a pretty big Sicilian community.


"The king is dead, long live the king!"
Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: Giacomo_Vacari] #954347
09/29/18 11:50 PM
09/29/18 11:50 PM
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Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
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Originally Posted by Giacomo_Vacari
That's against protocol. Of course New York breaks the rules all the time.


What's against protocol?

Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: bronx] #958024
11/17/18 11:46 AM
11/17/18 11:46 AM
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Re: another mob guy murdered [Re: bronx] #1030213
02/18/22 11:05 PM
02/18/22 11:05 PM
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When California Dreaming Becomes Deadly: Was Hamilton (ON) Mob Figure “Made” In L.A. In The Weeks Before He Was Killed?

https://gangsterreport.com/when-cal...n-l-a-in-the-weeks-before-he-was-killed/

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