How old are the Violi brothers?

Did it ever occur to you that perhaps the FBI brought out the fat lady too soon?
That the power base shifted to Canada, for amoung other reasons they don't have R.I.C.O.

Also, at the time Buffalo got hit in Canada, that the Buffalo family was just too weak to fight off the Rizzuto's and the Bonnano families.

That they were basically in a holding pattern until something changed.

So you had the power shift to Canada, You have alot less activity and the FBI writing them off and that is the reason very little indictments were handed down.

When the opportunity presented itself they were able to exact revenge on their enemies.

Because we are seeing more of them and because their enemies are being shot up that now L.E. is starting to focus on them again hence the new indictments.


Are you saying this is just not possible?

Also you seem be stuck in structure and Hierarchy

In Canada the formal structure is alot different then American LCN

Look at the Rizzuto's at their peak way different

Do I think Buffalo has an American LCN hierarchy
Probably not.

Do I think a small family needs it
I don't

Do I think they could have some sort of structure in place yes I do.

Maybe two capos one in C.A. and one in America
or something

I am just saying I think it possible

Feliciano and Cardinale are both in their 40s actually. Theyve been on every possible chart in the last 15 years published by everyone and everywhere

@ Nicky...in the other thread you said that Localzo was the Boss of Tampa up until 2006 or that he was totally legit by 2007. What exactly was he Boss of in 2006?

And there is 20's and 30's associates at the very least, some may even be made, more likely with the Canadian crew I admit

Rooster where you from?

Originally Ft. Wayne, 20+ years Buffalo. You?

If it was that simple, there would still be 26 families in America like there were during its peak, as opposed to the 10 or so families now.
When it comes to defunct families, we have seen over the years that various sons, grandsons, and nephews of wiseguys continue committing crimes and, occasionally, taking over their descendant's ranks. This doesn't mean the overall mob family is active. At all.

Young wannabes (family ties excluded) probably don't feel any obligation to kick up to anyone. They have no reason to fear these old-time mobsters. Look at Bifulco, supposedly a powerful Buffalo capo. He was shot in 2001 by a crack dealer he was trying to extort, and he was also violently robbed in his store. When Rooster says "who are these younger guys in line with/kick up to" he is implying that young Italian-American criminals feel an obligation to kick up to some old guy.
The Mafia ruled by fear. Aspiring loansharks and bookies had to kick up out of fear. But in Buffalo city, the last (confirmed) hit ordered by the family was in 1980.

"Why have they been doing it for the last 100 years?" Because, previously, there were opportunities to make money in the Mafia through the vast connections that being a made guy could bring. With their union interests taken down, and their rackets seriously diminished in the late 90s/early 00s, there was no eagerness in the younger generations to join the "withering" Buffalo mob.

With all due respect, it seems like you're building speculations on other speculations. Of course it is possible that could have happened, there is really nothing to base that on.

Again, it of course is possible, but there is really nothing to base that on.

Sorry, I was slightly off with that one, it was from a 1998 article from the Buffalo News. Turns out the last confirmed Buffalo crime family hit (in the US) was 1993.

You can add the 98 bust mentioned in the article to the list of Buffalo Crime Family busts too

Slightly off by 13 years lol.....again Nicky, please Localzo, Boss of what in 2006?

Yes but there hasn't been any sort of verified, official chart in the last 15 years. The last one was the top-heavy one showing the remnants in 06.
Feliciano was in the Utica shoplifting bust and named as part of the fencing ring. I haven't seen anything official saying he was made, seems to be one of those things where one person on a forum says so and everyone just goes with it. He lived in Brooklyn at the time of the bust, so he wasn't even a Utica-based soldier like charts have him as.
Also, which Cardinale are you talking about? I can't think of any in their 40s.

Rackets diminished so much Nicoletti took in 20 million a year in bets in the 2000s, La Nova made 20 million a year for the last 10 years, Ciminelli makes millions and millions each year, Bifulco Im sure does well present day, the bust in Utica was in the millions, Carcone does well in his book.

Hes with Buffalo Nicky its known he is, its not a secret. One of the Cardinale brothers is in his forties

What was Localzo the Boss of? I think you know where Im going with this

The Trafficante crime family. Let me elaborate:

By 2007, LoScalzo was legit/retired. He was still running schemes (or at least one scheme) until (allegedly) 2000, and was investigated for loansharking in the early 2000s although no charges for those were laid. Which means that in 2006, 2007 and even today he is the "boss" of the Trafficante crime family but, as that article I linked to you mentioned, there was nothing to be the boss of by 07. I doubt there was any definitive moment where he stopped being the boss. It's not like he was demoted or anything, but it's like a Billy D'Elia situation.

So do you believe that in 2018 there is a Boss of Buffalo?

And if there is nothing to be the Boss of how is one the Boss?

By the way, Rooster, I am not trying to ignore your queries and comments but since there was a lot for me to reply to, and we are replying to eachother at just about the same time, it's hard for me to keep up.

In the big cities, where the mob is still active, there is still the pronounced threat of violence that compels people to pay tribute.

In some cities it died out because there weren't many Italians, but in Buffalo there's quite abit, plus alot of influence from Canada which has a crap ton of Italians, many of whom came not that long ago. Sure some sons become a lawyer or something, but some simply aren't cut out for that kinda life and want to get into the life. And there's tons of money to be made in buffalo, most of it from things like drug money or even into "legitimate" things, which Buffalo guys have long been entrenched in unions and the like. The buffalo family can offer these young guys these connections and a greater network of people, plus the vestige of being la Cosa nostra. Maybe they don't get a weekly kickup, just a nice Busta at Christmas time and a bigger cut of certain businesses

I don't, but I explained my reasoning in the post.

Mob murders are further and further apart in all the big cities. How do you have any idea about any threats or beatings that happen in Buffalo or who is scared of who? At this point you are also speculating upon other speculations.

Yes, all of us have reasons. The rackets arent diminished as you state, many of the things you state arent reality

Why do young guys want to join the Hells Angels?

A bookmaker taking in 20 million a year does not mean that he makes 20 million a year. That is just how many bets are placed with him. For comparison, Bonanno soldier John Zancocchio took in $280 million in bets until 1990, but he only made (in income) for himself a tiny fraction of that.

La Nova is a legitimate, large pizza chain.

"Ciminelli makes millions and millions each year" - Got any evidence?

"Bifulco Im sure does well present day" - Again, got any evidence?

"the bust in Utica was in the millions" - Key point - it was busted.

"Carcone does well in his book" - Got any evidence?

Which Carnidale brother? And how do you know he is made?

Also, saying "its not a secret" doesn't help your point.

He is/was the boss in name alone. Just like Billy D'Elia.

The last alleged boss in Buffalo was Leonard Falzone and the last official boss was Joe Todaro Sr.