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Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past #803869
09/20/14 12:37 PM
09/20/14 12:37 PM
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,789
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Dwalin2011 Offline OP
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Dwalin2011  Offline OP
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Have asked this on another forum, but few people replied, would like to know what people think here as well:

Just have read a comment on a mafia blog by somebody who says he's an old-timer from an Italian neighborhood on a territory controlled by the mafia. The topic discussed is the growth of pointless violence by small time criminals after the mafia was decimated by trials. While I definitely agree that crime that knows its limits is better than what's happening with street gangs when there is no controlling force, I found the point of view of that poster rather bizzarre when he quoted 3 stories from old times in his neighborhood. In my opinion, if the wiseguys really acted like that, they were definitely exaggerating:
http://www.cosanostranews.com/2014/09/was-federal-hill-safer-when-mafia-ran.html
Quote:

What has happened to Federal Hill is the same that has happened to almost all Italian or Italian-American neighborhoods across the country: A CHANGE IN DEMOGRAPHICS (emphasis on the demographics.) It's true that organized crime can be violent, but it is organized violence. I'm not justifying it, but stating the facts. Once in a blue did an innocent bystander get caught in the middle? Yes, but once in a blue. They don't mention the respect and order that came with the old neighborhood.
Years ago on Pleasant Avenue, when East Harlem was an Italian oasis, a young man held open the apartment building door for a young lady who was the daughter of a very prominent person in the neighborhood. The young lady was carrying groceries. The kid not only held open the door, but helped her with the groceries to her apartment. After he came out of the building he was met by a couple of wiseguys who were permanent fixtures in one of many social clubs across the street. The kid was taken to the club and thoroughly interrogated on what his true intentions were and told next time to just hold open the door and never to allow himself to be outside of plain sight with the girl again.
Years ago on Elizabeth Street, when Little Italy was an Italian oasis, a very attractive young lady was walking down the street. Across the street was a man whistling and making all kinds of comments on her beauty, but a little to suggestive for her taste. Her uncle was a big shot on Mulberry Street. She reported what happened to her uncle. Everyone knew who the guy was as everybody knew each other in the neighborhood in those days. The wiseguys eventually got a hold of this man wherever he was and brought him to Mulberry Street. They called the big shot's daughter and told her to come to the club, but to wait outside. When she arrived outside the club, they brought the man outside and made him bend down on both knees to apologize and beg her forgiveness. As he humiliated the woman in public, he too was humiliated in public and told if it ever happened again he would get a lot worse.
Years ago on 17th Avenue, when Bensonhurst was an Italian oasis, a young hot piece of braciole was told to shut her face by a so called neighborhood tough guy. She too was related to someone big, and the tough guy got his arm broke. Being that it's Bensonhurst ( a johnny come lately Italian neighborhood that's now all Chinese) I'm pretty sure in this case the girl probably deserved to be told to shut her face.
THAT WAS THE TRUE ITALIAN NEIGHBORHOODS BACK IN THE DAY.
It is called CONTROL.
The "change in demographics" phrase usually means the neighborhood has been overrun by blacks and Hispanics. If it's anybody else, they just say the neighborhood changed. I'm not a racial guy, but why is it when blacks and Hispanics inherit a neighborhood they destroy it? In every one of their neighborhoods across the country it's the same thing: senseless killings, wanton violence, dirty streets, unkept yards, killing each other for a cellphone or ipod, numerous rapes. There are no more excuses. The president is half black, although they keep saying he's the first black president. There are many black and Hispanic high achievers in politics and medicine today. There's an old African proverb that states it takes a village to raise a child. I strongly disagree. It takes a FATHER and a MOTHER to raise a child. LA FAMIGLIA!!!
Now, that's the OLD SCHOOL.

What do you think? In my opinion, bullying a youngster just because he helped a woman to carry things to the apartement is crazy, as is breaking the arm to somebody who told somebody else to shut up. I mean, how's that different from modern extremes of political correctness, when you can be fired just for saying "Merry Christmas" instead of "Happy holidays" just because the job involves people of different religions. I am not familiar with Italian neighborhoods in USA, especially at the times when I wasn't even born, but to me the behavior of the wiseguys in these stories seems crazy. I mean, I can understand beating up rapists and thieves and keeping order, but these examples don't really show those "prominent people" in a good light imo. They acted like real jerks and assholes.


Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:

1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."

2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: Dwalin2011] #803874
09/20/14 01:12 PM
09/20/14 01:12 PM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 31
IlLupo77 Offline
Wiseguy
IlLupo77  Offline
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Posts: 31
No, It's not exactly crazy… I wouldn't say the youngster helping the girl with the groceries was "bullied". MY G.P.'s neighborhood is pretty much like this today. I don't live around the way anymore, but I am there for a week every month or so, and not much has changed. The lawns are mowed, the tulips are planted, and the gangways are swept.

If you were in a bar and someone talked smack to your wifey or sister, what are you gonna' do?? How's about on your block?? If some random was in your daughters apartment, wouldn't you wanna' know why?? People are suspicious of outsiders. We wanna' know why you are there and what you are doing. People have lived in these neighborhoods for GENERATIONS, Elmwood, Harwood Heights, Taylor St., Grand Ave., Oak Park, etc. When my dad, uncles, and brothers are in the old neighborhood to visit, it takes an HOUR to get from the porch to the car because EVERYONE who comes through stops to say "Hi", introduces new visitors, talks shit, and generally gets along. If there was some dude at the park harassing a young girl during the 4th of July block party, or told someones sister to "Shut the fuck up", you can believe that they would catch a beating. NO DOUBT.

It's just the way it is. You don't shit where you eat, also. And that is what I think the old head in the post you brought up is so salty about. He doesn't get it, and I don't blame him.

Last edited by IlLupo77; 09/20/14 01:14 PM.
Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: Dwalin2011] #804069
09/21/14 07:04 PM
09/21/14 07:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,434
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mightyhealthy Offline
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mightyhealthy  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2014
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Sounds like a bunch of fascists. Can't help a woman bring her groceries inside?

Regardless, the idea that these guys ever treated women well - as a group - is absurd.

Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: mightyhealthy] #804070
09/21/14 07:09 PM
09/21/14 07:09 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
Throggs Neck
pizzaboy Offline
The Fuckin Doctor
pizzaboy  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
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Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
Sounds like a bunch of fascists.

Xenophobia is a wonderful thing. Unless you're an outsider. Then it kinda sucks.

Originally Posted By: mightyhealthy
Regardless, the idea that these guys ever treated women well - as a group - is absurd.

And Janice Rossi is still a whore.

I really amuse myself sometimes whistle.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: Dwalin2011] #804135
09/22/14 08:41 AM
09/22/14 08:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 70
PaulieSenter Offline
Button
PaulieSenter  Offline
Button
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 70
Hi Canarsie Brooklyn had a stronghold there back in the day

Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: pizzaboy] #804151
09/22/14 11:27 AM
09/22/14 11:27 AM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 220
BennyB Offline
Made Member
BennyB  Offline
Made Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 220
Originally Posted By: pizzaboy
And Janice Rossi is still a whore.

I really amuse myself sometimes whistle.



Hello is this the super? I want you to know you have a whore living in your building.

Re: Mafia control in Italian neighborhoods in the past [Re: Dwalin2011] #804165
09/22/14 01:31 PM
09/22/14 01:31 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,571
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Scorsese Offline
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Scorsese  Offline
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,571

Quote:

What has happened to Federal Hill is the same that has happened to almost all Italian or Italian-American neighborhoods across the country: A CHANGE IN DEMOGRAPHICS (emphasis on the demographics.) It's true that organized crime can be violent, but it is organized violence. I'm not justifying it, but stating the facts. Once in a blue did an innocent bystander get caught in the middle? Yes, but once in a blue. They don't mention the respect and order that came with the old neighborhood.
Years ago on Pleasant Avenue, when East Harlem was an Italian oasis, a young man held open the apartment building door for a young lady who was the daughter of a very prominent person in the neighborhood. The young lady was carrying groceries. The kid not only held open the door, but helped her with the groceries to her apartment. After he came out of the building he was met by a couple of wiseguys who were permanent fixtures in one of many social clubs across the street. The kid was taken to the club and thoroughly interrogated on what his true intentions were and told next time to just hold open the door and never to allow himself to be outside of plain sight with the girl again.
Years ago on Elizabeth Street, when Little Italy was an Italian oasis, a very attractive young lady was walking down the street. Across the street was a man whistling and making all kinds of comments on her beauty, but a little to suggestive for her taste. Her uncle was a big shot on Mulberry Street. She reported what happened to her uncle. Everyone knew who the guy was as everybody knew each other in the neighborhood in those days. The wiseguys eventually got a hold of this man wherever he was and brought him to Mulberry Street. They called the big shot's daughter and told her to come to the club, but to wait outside. When she arrived outside the club, they brought the man outside and made him bend down on both knees to apologize and beg her forgiveness. As he humiliated the woman in public, he too was humiliated in public and told if it ever happened again he would get a lot worse.
Years ago on 17th Avenue, when Bensonhurst was an Italian oasis, a young hot piece of braciole was told to shut her face by a so called neighborhood tough guy. She too was related to someone big, and the tough guy got his arm broke. Being that it's Bensonhurst ( a johnny come lately Italian neighborhood that's now all Chinese) I'm pretty sure in this case the girl probably deserved to be told to shut her face.
THAT WAS THE TRUE ITALIAN NEIGHBORHOODS BACK IN THE DAY.
It is called CONTROL.
The "change in demographics" phrase usually means the neighborhood has been overrun by blacks and Hispanics. If it's anybody else, they just say the neighborhood changed. I'm not a racial guy, but why is it when blacks and Hispanics inherit a neighborhood they destroy it? In every one of their neighborhoods across the country it's the same thing: senseless killings, wanton violence, dirty streets, unkept yards, killing each other for a cellphone or ipod, numerous rapes. There are no more excuses. The president is half black, although they keep saying he's the first black president. There are many black and Hispanic high achievers in politics and medicine today. There's an old African proverb that states it takes a village to raise a child. I strongly disagree. It takes a FATHER and a MOTHER to raise a child. LA FAMIGLIA!!!
Now, that's the OLD SCHOOL.



i bet this was written by some 20 year old bronx tale fan. From the examples he gives those places were great if you had a "prominent relative".

Also if your ok with an innocent getting caught in the middle only once in a blue moon, then you deserve any gang bangers and rapists that move in after your precious wise guys are thrown in jail.


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