First, let me say that I am from New England. I don't know anything about Detroit but what I have read. Having said that, it seems to me that people have a tendency to distort both what Ivy actually says and what Scott Burnstein actually says.

Let's look at this from the angle of what the Feds have actually said, what Scott has actually said, and what Ivy's saying based on simple arithmetic.

In the mid 90's the Feds said that Detroit had 29 members. A few years later they were quoted as saying there were 30 members.

Scott said there were two making ceremonies roughly around 2001 and 2006. I don't
Remember exactly how many he said were made, but I THINK he said he THOUGHT
there were 4 or 5 each time.

Even if there were as many as 5 each time that is 10 new members in addition to the 30 quoted by the Feds. Quite a few of these guys have died in the last 13 years. 10 new guys would be barely enough to keep them at the 30 the Feds quoted 13 years ago. Maybe not even enough. Also remember that one of that roughly 30 is is a rat , one is shelved, and quite a few are very old and retired or semi- retired based on Scott's own information.

Based on simple math, it's hard to believe that there much more 30 and probably no more than 20 active, maybe less.

It could be that Scott's wrong, and others have been made, but if we are going to accept him as generally reliable, and I do, then it's hard to believe that both his street sources and his FBI sources missed a making ceremony.The Feds haven't said anything since 2001.

Now Scott did recently say that there are a half dozen sons and nephews of made guys that could be made in the near future. Maybe Jackie will make them. Maybe he will find other recruits and make them too.We don't know. It's speculation.

Speculation aside, it's hard to believe that there currently more than 30 made guys, give or take a couple, and hard to believe that there are more than about 20 active guys, give or take a couple. It's just math. I don' mean that in condescending way, and I'm not sure I'm right either. I don't know any more than you.