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Re: If Chickenman Testa Wasn't Murdered? [Re: Giancarlo] #752648
12/10/13 02:49 PM
12/10/13 02:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 210
philly
SonnyL Offline
Made Member
SonnyL  Offline
Made Member
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 210
philly
[quote=Giancarlo]What those guys didn't understand back then but guys with a little real chemistry knowledge did is that while it was great to start with the p2p you really didn't need to buy it...you could easily make it using phenylacetic acid or several other chemicals as your starting chemical. There were guys that all they did was make the p2p and sell it....at one time the price of that shit was so high people were paying thousands for a lousy gallon of the stuff. A gallon would make you in the neighborhood of 10 lb's depending on who was doing the cook.

And then in the 90's all the underground cooks learned how to make better, stronger and cheaper meth using ephedrine or pseudoephedrine instead of p2p and on top of that you didn't need methylamine anymore either, it was already in the ephedrine/pseudo pills. Those guys didn't control shit after that became the popular and MUCH easier way to make speed. Any toothless hillbilly and their mother could make the shit then.

And they still don't control anything anymore. Everyone gets their shit from the mexicans these days.....even most of the 1%er clubs. It's just so much easier and cheaper to get it from them.....they control the meth production now. Not the mob and not the bikers. [/quote

Yeah but using p2p you'll get crystal meth which is high purity and worth more if you use all that other garbage the purity won't be high enough to make crystals

Re: If Chickenman Testa Wasn't Murdered? [Re: Iceman999] #752652
12/10/13 03:00 PM
12/10/13 03:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,220
Your Mom's House
Jimmy_Two_Times Offline
Underboss
Jimmy_Two_Times  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,220
Your Mom's House
Not that I know much about the Philly mob, but I'd have to say probably not. Chickenman seems like he was cut from the same bolt of cloth as Bruno. People seemed to like Bruno for the most part. I think Chicken man might have been a good bridge from the Bruno era to the modern era if he had lived.

Re: If Chickenman Testa Wasn't Murdered? [Re: NickyWhip] #752668
12/10/13 03:37 PM
12/10/13 03:37 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 222
Camden County NJ
jmack Offline
Made Member
jmack  Offline
Made Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 222
Camden County NJ
Originally Posted By: NickyWhip
Ok, semantics. Technically, I agree that Scarfo was not directly selling drugs. But he was well aware of drug dealing by made members in his organization. Scarfo inducted Long John Martorano. He was a lifelong meth dealer who Bruno never made but kept close to him and collected drug money from. In his book, Crow says he set up a sale of P2P to a guy who would make it to crank and sell it for Crow. That's drug dealing. And Tommy Del/Crow/Charlie White knew the deal. There is a specific line in the book where Crow asks Tommy Del how he's gonna present selling P2P to Scaro because of the drug ban and Tommy Del says Scarfo won't care; a score is a score.

The Scarfo mob directly entered into drug dealing when they graduated from just taxing dealers who were importing P2P and financing other peoples deals to becoming directly involved in the importation and manufacture of meth. Through Del/crow, the mob took control of the P2P importation ring that Chick DiTullio was running with Stevie Vento.

At the time, 2 associates of the mob named Ralph Staino and Mousie Massimino (neither had their button) helped turn everyone from Vento's P2P import ring over to Scarfo, through Tommy Del and the Crow. The failed hit on little Stevie (jailed vento's 18 year old son) probably swayed everyone towards Scarfo, more so than anything.

Mousie wasn't involved in the robbery of P2P in Germany that Staino committed with Kelly. That robbery is what kicked everything off. Mousie's role was to establish a new route to get the P2P into the country. Remember, they cut Kelly out because he was part of Vento's ring and he was the organizer of getting the stuff over here.

No one in the ring was a made guy, until Crow and Del got their hands on it. That's how the feds pinned the charges on Scarfo. The charges likely were weak because Crow and Del both turned and they likely had the most involvement so the feds had to take in on the chin with those charges against Scarfo.

Further, the guys who actually got convicted of P2P importation were not mob guys. They were all guys who wanted to be with the mob and either did their time out of loyalty or FEAR of retribution.

You can picture Scarfo telling Del about the P2P "I don't wanna hear what it is or what it does, just show me the money when you are done doing whatever it is you are going to do with YOUR friend DiTullio. Oh, and by the way, Kill little Stevie Vento because he's not nice".

Scarfo knew what P2P was, what it did, and more importantly, how much money could be made from it. It's much easier to say to Gigante "we sell oil, I don't give a fuck what happens to it after that" than say, we are a big part of the crank production process.


Listen, I agree with you. We are debating semantics. But since you brought it up, Scarfo warned Long John that he was NOT to sell drugs. Leonetti quotes the meeting in his book. This is where Scarfo learned that Bruno and Testa were selling drugs. I don't think Scarfo got directly involved with the Crow and Del about their activities. I certainly don't believe they told him where the money was coming from. Like I said Scarfo didn't follow every rule perfectly but he was a traditionalist. He followed just as many rules as the old world New York dons.
Scarfo was the last real don of Philly. I think Ligambi had a good run (as acting boss) but let's face it, he was really a captain. That's all. During his reign there weren't many soldiers on the street and they weren't involved in much beyond gambling and loansharking. While he brought stability he lacked real power. They didn't have any real muscle on the street to enforce a street tax and they didn't have any union control. Scarfo controlled Philly and Atlantic City. He had real power and was feared. When Scarfo was awaiting trial a newspaper interviewed a guard. He said it was "yes Mr. Scarfo, no Mr. Scarfo" and this was from the young black inmates. I bet you most of the black inmates at 7th and Arch wouldn't be able to pick Ligambi out of a lineup.

Re: If Chickenman Testa Wasn't Murdered? [Re: jmack] #752799
12/11/13 01:01 AM
12/11/13 01:01 AM
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 294
Merica
NickyWhip Offline
Capo
NickyWhip  Offline
Capo
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 294
Merica
Agreed. Semantics dude. Let's move on because we both agree. Bottom Line is that Scarfo was the last real powerhouse in Philly. Totally agree with you; he was a fucking animal. Yes, it was done through fear and intimidation, but he had the absolute totally backing of NYC. Back then the NYC commission ran LCN. Chicago, LA, other areas are not under their influence, as I am sure some pockets on the east are much less dependent. But, time and time again Leonetti says that Scarfo understood what most others in Philly didn't: NYC makes or breaks a boss. And at the time the commission was Castellano, Gotti, Amuso, Persico, Rastelli, and it was the Chin. That's a powerful group to have on your side or at least to sit at the table with and have a say.



Originally Posted By: jmack
Originally Posted By: NickyWhip
Ok, semantics. Technically, I agree that Scarfo was not directly selling drugs. But he was well aware of drug dealing by made members in his organization. Scarfo inducted Long John Martorano. He was a lifelong meth dealer who Bruno never made but kept close to him and collected drug money from. In his book, Crow says he set up a sale of P2P to a guy who would make it to crank and sell it for Crow. That's drug dealing. And Tommy Del/Crow/Charlie White knew the deal. There is a specific line in the book where Crow asks Tommy Del how he's gonna present selling P2P to Scaro because of the drug ban and Tommy Del says Scarfo won't care; a score is a score.

The Scarfo mob directly entered into drug dealing when they graduated from just taxing dealers who were importing P2P and financing other peoples deals to becoming directly involved in the importation and manufacture of meth. Through Del/crow, the mob took control of the P2P importation ring that Chick DiTullio was running with Stevie Vento.

At the time, 2 associates of the mob named Ralph Staino and Mousie Massimino (neither had their button) helped turn everyone from Vento's P2P import ring over to Scarfo, through Tommy Del and the Crow. The failed hit on little Stevie (jailed vento's 18 year old son) probably swayed everyone towards Scarfo, more so than anything.

Mousie wasn't involved in the robbery of P2P in Germany that Staino committed with Kelly. That robbery is what kicked everything off. Mousie's role was to establish a new route to get the P2P into the country. Remember, they cut Kelly out because he was part of Vento's ring and he was the organizer of getting the stuff over here.

No one in the ring was a made guy, until Crow and Del got their hands on it. That's how the feds pinned the charges on Scarfo. The charges likely were weak because Crow and Del both turned and they likely had the most involvement so the feds had to take in on the chin with those charges against Scarfo.

Further, the guys who actually got convicted of P2P importation were not mob guys. They were all guys who wanted to be with the mob and either did their time out of loyalty or FEAR of retribution.

You can picture Scarfo telling Del about the P2P "I don't wanna hear what it is or what it does, just show me the money when you are done doing whatever it is you are going to do with YOUR friend DiTullio. Oh, and by the way, Kill little Stevie Vento because he's not nice".

Scarfo knew what P2P was, what it did, and more importantly, how much money could be made from it. It's much easier to say to Gigante "we sell oil, I don't give a fuck what happens to it after that" than say, we are a big part of the crank production process.


Listen, I agree with you. We are debating semantics. But since you brought it up, Scarfo warned Long John that he was NOT to sell drugs. Leonetti quotes the meeting in his book. This is where Scarfo learned that Bruno and Testa were selling drugs. I don't think Scarfo got directly involved with the Crow and Del about their activities. I certainly don't believe they told him where the money was coming from. Like I said Scarfo didn't follow every rule perfectly but he was a traditionalist. He followed just as many rules as the old world New York dons.
Scarfo was the last real don of Philly. I think Ligambi had a good run (as acting boss) but let's face it, he was really a captain. That's all. During his reign there weren't many soldiers on the street and they weren't involved in much beyond gambling and loansharking. While he brought stability he lacked real power. They didn't have any real muscle on the street to enforce a street tax and they didn't have any union control. Scarfo controlled Philly and Atlantic City. He had real power and was feared. When Scarfo was awaiting trial a newspaper interviewed a guard. He said it was "yes Mr. Scarfo, no Mr. Scarfo" and this was from the young black inmates. I bet you most of the black inmates at 7th and Arch wouldn't be able to pick Ligambi out of a lineup.


Boss of tha toilet!
Re: If Chickenman Testa Wasn't Murdered? [Re: Iceman999] #753079
12/12/13 04:19 PM
12/12/13 04:19 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,091
W
Wilson101 Offline
Underboss
Wilson101  Offline
W
Underboss
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,091
I heard walter white made some quality meth!

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