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Toodoped: Fuck the ScottB & Button/Zipper Pants sites and fuck their paywalls. This forum gives you everything for free and so best wishes and good health to both JGeoff and TB!
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: Sicilian Babe]
#743160
10/06/13 02:59 PM
10/06/13 02:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296 Throggs Neck
pizzaboy
The Fuckin Doctor
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The Fuckin Doctor

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
Throggs Neck
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It's similar to the KKK being ultra-conservative Christians. They are a small and hateful group, just as the Muslim extremists are. I'm not in complete disagreement with you, Babe. But I'd have to see some research to back that up. Because something tells me that a higher percentage of Muslims born in the Middle East become radicals, than there are Southern White Christians who become KKK members.
"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743172
10/06/13 03:51 PM
10/06/13 03:51 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769 Massachusetts, USA
123JoeSchmo
OP
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Underboss
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769
Massachusetts, USA
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The Klan is pretty much a tiny minute fraction of southern white Christians. Many still hold conservative views, but there is virtually no connection between churches and the Klan anymore. The Muslim world is a different story. The faction of radical jihadists is certainly a minority, however there is a great percentage of regular Muslims, mostly among the men, that agree not with terrorism, but the implementation of Islam everywhere.
Now I know many Christians would like to see their doctrine implemented across the world as well. What is the difference?
The difference is this: Sharia Law. Any proponent of basic human rights would fight against this fundamental Islamist code of ethics. It subjugates women, bans homosexuality, prohibits free speech, etc. It dictates all law from hygiene, the economy, diet, and dress code.
Now I don't see white conservative pastors and priests trying make women wear hijabs, limit free speech or influence the economy. Fact is radical Islam is much more dangerous than conservative Christianity.
"Don't ever go against the family again. Ever"- Michael Corleone
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743185
10/06/13 04:34 PM
10/06/13 04:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 236
TheIsland
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 236
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743190
10/06/13 05:19 PM
10/06/13 05:19 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 8,534
IvyLeague
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 8,534
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The Klan is pretty much a tiny minute fraction of southern white Christians. Many still hold conservative views, but there is virtually no connection between churches and the Klan anymore. The Muslim world is a different story. The faction of radical jihadists is certainly a minority, however there is a great percentage of regular Muslims, mostly among the men, that agree not with terrorism, but the implementation of Islam everywhere.
Now I know many Christians would like to see their doctrine implemented across the world as well. What is the difference?
The difference is this: Sharia Law. Any proponent of basic human rights would fight against this fundamental Islamist code of ethics. It subjugates women, bans homosexuality, prohibits free speech, etc. It dictates all law from hygiene, the economy, diet, and dress code.
Now I don't see white conservative pastors and priests trying make women wear hijabs, limit free speech or influence the economy. Fact is radical Islam is much more dangerous than conservative Christianity. Part of the problem is, people can't even have an honest and frank discussion about the widespread and rampant extremism among Muslims today because when the subject is brought up, liberals (including on this board) immediately go into defensive mode. They have this ridiculous paranoia about others not realizing there are good Muslims too so they feel they have to remind us of that fact over and over again (or they bring up vague examples of bad Christians from hundreds of years ago, or ridiculous parallels with the KKK today) until the original point of Muslim extremism is completely lost.
Mods should mind their own business and leave poster's profile signatures alone.
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743205
10/06/13 07:24 PM
10/06/13 07:24 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841 OC, CA
Faithful1
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841
OC, CA
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Plenty of polls have been taken in the Muslim world. A majority want Sharia, less than a majority want it to apply to non-Muslims. Forty percent of Palestinians believe in suicide bombing. We have to remember that when people say that "only a minority of Muslims believe in Sharia and suicide bombing," that if there are a billion Muslims a minority is 499 million Muslims. Overall a majority DO want Sharia, so let's say that's half a billion. Let's say 30% believe in suicide bombing. That could be a million potential suicide bombers. How much damage can a million (or even 100,000) suicide bombers do? Even the Klan doesn't walk into mosques or synagogues and blow themselves up, taking a large number of the congregation with them as they do in Pakistan, Iraq, Kenya and Israel and other places. They might counter that the number includes children, but those children are raised to believe the same as their parents. The polls also show that young people are MORE likely to believe in Sharia and terrorism than older people. Here are some links: http://www.gallup.com/poll/108724/iranians-egyptians-turks-contrasting-views-sharia.aspxhttp://www.pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-w...s-about-sharia/http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/opinion-polls.htmhttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/30/muslim-survey_n_3186144.htmlhttp://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/jan/29/thinktanks.religionhttp://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/1/pew-poll-palestinians-favor-suicide-bombings-shari/http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timsta...ar-of-islamism/
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743217
10/07/13 01:43 AM
10/07/13 01:43 AM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602 Yunkai
afsaneh77
Mother of Dragons
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Mother of Dragons

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602
Yunkai
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I notice how Faithful and Joe have changed the subject from Europe to Muslim countries. Ironically, Joe who started this thread was worried about Muslims taking over the Europe, but now somehow he seems worried that they are taking over where they were already living for hundreds of years and don't know any other way of life.
Show me the polls on second generation Muslim-borns in Europe. Show me how many of them still want Sharia law. It would be mind boggling to me to see any sane person, having lived in a country that would grant them freedom of religion, after coming out of legal shadow of their parents when they come of age, wouldn't want to have what other kids have and want to restrict themselves to sharia law.
As for Sharia law and your view about it, you can't see it as a whole and the way people in Muslim countries see it, as screwed up as that maybe. For instance women in those countries are for it, as are men. They think it is right and just for women. So let me give you just one instance as to why women want it. It stipulates that women are in no way responsible for providing financial support for their family. Wives may work with the permission of their husbands, but what they earn is theirs only. Additionally men are to give them money regularly and failing to do so would be grounds for divorce. Men think it beneath themselves to revolt against such injustice and women find it comfortable, so why should they be against Sharia law? It's more complicated than the black and white picture you have in your mind.
"Fire cannot kill a dragon." -Daenerys Targaryen, Game of Thrones
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743277
10/07/13 11:58 AM
10/07/13 11:58 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468 With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso
Consigliere to the Stars
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Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
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Although not agreeing with vinnies choice of words, I do agree we should be more concerned about extreme Islamists than the tea party. Who shut down the United States Government? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants to default on the national debt? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants the current president to fail simply because he is black? Islamic terrorists or the tea party. Case closed.
"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"
"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."
"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: dontomasso]
#743283
10/07/13 12:14 PM
10/07/13 12:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769 Massachusetts, USA
123JoeSchmo
OP
Underboss
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OP
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769
Massachusetts, USA
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Although not agreeing with vinnies choice of words, I do agree we should be more concerned about extreme Islamists than the tea party. Who shut down the United States Government? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants to default on the national debt? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants the current president to fail simply because he is black? Islamic terrorists or the tea party. Case closed. Once again DT your own personal feelings get in the way of being objective. This government shut down, while largely due to the extreme branch of the Republican party, cannot be fully put on them. I think right now Congress as a whole is ineffective and useless. Both Dems and the GOP. Secondly you're throwing the racist card again which got old the first fifty thousand times you used it. Perhaps some of the members may not like that he's black, but we can't know that. This is a battle of ideals, not skin color. The tea party is conservative- lower taxes, smaller government, etc while Obama is on the left- higher taxes, stimulus packages, obamacare, etc. From the start they didn't like his health care bill. They did everything they could to sabotage it, but they failed. Yet still they try to prevent it, even though most of the law is already in effect. Let me also remind you the debt has quadrupled under Obama, I don't think anyone wants to default, but we have to figure out a way to lower it. Now to Islam. Extreme jihadists want to blow up our cities. They want to kill innocent people, behead our soldiers, ruin our lives and impose Sharia law. Oh yeah the tea party is certainly more dangerous 
"Don't ever go against the family again. Ever"- Michael Corleone
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: dontomasso]
#743297
10/07/13 01:03 PM
10/07/13 01:03 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841 OC, CA
Faithful1
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841
OC, CA
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Although not agreeing with vinnies choice of words, I do agree we should be more concerned about extreme Islamists than the tea party. Who shut down the United States Government? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants to default on the national debt? Islamic terrorists or the tea party? Who wants the current president to fail simply because he is black? Islamic terrorists or the tea party. Case closed. Obama and the Democrat Senate shut down the government. Period. Obama's already been on the record for wanting to default on the debt when he was a senator. Who is lying by claiming that anyone wants the current president to fail simply because he is black? Dontomasso.
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: afsaneh77]
#743299
10/07/13 01:11 PM
10/07/13 01:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841 OC, CA
Faithful1
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,841
OC, CA
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First of all, all Muslims aren't Arabs. Arab is race, Islam is a religion. Second of all, for them to be able to have Sharia law implemented in Europe, first they must get elected to the parliaments or such law making bodies and pass their laws through that. So how many Muslims are now part of the law making body of those countries that suddenly has made you concerned? Arab is an ethnicity not a race. Anyway, just because Muslims are not serving in some European country's parliament today does not mean they won't be in it tomorrow, next year or in the next decade. It's just a silly argument to claim that because something is not X today it will never be X. The massive increases in Muslim immigration to Europe has only been relatively recent. As for European Muslim attitudes, see this: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_-_Shariah. It covers, Germany, Ireland, UK, Norway and Belgium. A sizable number in each of these countries does want Sharia and agree that people that convert from Islam to another religion should be killed. One of the polls I provided a link to DID included second generation Muslims. Don't forget, if you are an Iranian Shi'ite you also are considered a heretic by the majority Sunni Muslims, and in almost each case where Sharia would be implemented (Canada, so far, as allowed Sharia for inheritance laws) it would be the Sunni version.
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: Faithful1]
#743302
10/07/13 01:35 PM
10/07/13 01:35 PM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602 Yunkai
afsaneh77
Mother of Dragons
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Mother of Dragons

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602
Yunkai
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Arab is an ethnicity not a race. Anyway, just because Muslims are not serving in some European country's parliament today does not mean they won't be in it tomorrow, next year or in the next decade. It's just a silly argument to claim that because something is not X today it will never be X. The massive increases in Muslim immigration to Europe has only been relatively recent. As for European Muslim attitudes, see this: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_-_Shariah. It covers, Germany, Ireland, UK, Norway and Belgium. A sizable number in each of these countries does want Sharia and agree that people that convert from Islam to another religion should be killed. One of the polls I provided a link to DID included second generation Muslims. Don't forget, if you are an Iranian Shi'ite you also are considered a heretic by the majority Sunni Muslims, and in almost each case where Sharia would be implemented (Canada, so far, as allowed Sharia for inheritance laws) it would be the Sunni version. Point is some Arabs are Christian. Some Muslims aren't Arab at all. Some may speak Arabic while their race is another and some don't speak Arabic altogether. It's not proper to call them Arabs when you are actually trying to refer to Muslims. Yes, my background is Shi'a, and yet I'm not worried. I don't know, if you wanna be worried, then be worried. 
"Fire cannot kill a dragon." -Daenerys Targaryen, Game of Thrones
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: afsaneh77]
#743305
10/07/13 02:03 PM
10/07/13 02:03 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769 Massachusetts, USA
123JoeSchmo
OP
Underboss
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OP
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,769
Massachusetts, USA
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Arab is an ethnicity not a race. Anyway, just because Muslims are not serving in some European country's parliament today does not mean they won't be in it tomorrow, next year or in the next decade. It's just a silly argument to claim that because something is not X today it will never be X. The massive increases in Muslim immigration to Europe has only been relatively recent. As for European Muslim attitudes, see this: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_-_Shariah. It covers, Germany, Ireland, UK, Norway and Belgium. A sizable number in each of these countries does want Sharia and agree that people that convert from Islam to another religion should be killed. One of the polls I provided a link to DID included second generation Muslims. Don't forget, if you are an Iranian Shi'ite you also are considered a heretic by the majority Sunni Muslims, and in almost each case where Sharia would be implemented (Canada, so far, as allowed Sharia for inheritance laws) it would be the Sunni version. Point is some Arabs are Christian. Some Muslims aren't Arab at all. Some may speak Arabic while their race is another and some don't speak Arabic altogether. It's not proper to call them Arabs when you are actually trying to refer to Muslims. Yes, my background is Shi'a, and yet I'm not worried. I don't know, if you wanna be worried, then be worried.  Do you not think it's important to keep western values Europe and the USA? I agree with faithful in the sense that just because something doesn't happen today doesn't mean it won't tomorrow. I don't think all Muslims are out to revolutionize the world in their image far from it. But I do think that Europe cannot allow radical Islamist groups to gain any foothold
"Don't ever go against the family again. Ever"- Michael Corleone
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Re: Is Islam taking over Europe?
[Re: 123JoeSchmo]
#743309
10/07/13 02:23 PM
10/07/13 02:23 PM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602 Yunkai
afsaneh77
Mother of Dragons
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Mother of Dragons

Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,602
Yunkai
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Do you not think it's important to keep western values Europe and the USA? I agree with faithful in the sense that just because something doesn't happen today doesn't mean it won't tomorrow.
I don't think all Muslims are out to revolutionize the world in their image far from it. But I do think that Europe cannot allow radical Islamist groups to gain any foothold I still fail to see where this foothold is to begin with. I don't see large numbers of Muslims, getting elected to the office there. Moreover, most part of Europe have secular governments. They resist any sort of religion to influence their law making process. So honestly I'm not sure why you are worried.
"Fire cannot kill a dragon." -Daenerys Targaryen, Game of Thrones
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