That's the difference between Paul and Carlo.
Carlo wasn't afraid of upsetting his underboss
Paul was.

well said and true

He was on trial with the Demeo Crew and also indicted on the commission case he really had his back against the wall and was in no position to make a move, had to many other problems.

he could have given the hit out to chin..

When your the Boss of bosses you have to deal with these things
I don't see what the problem was?
If Paul could get rid of Demeo (eventually) he could get rid of Gotti

And most assuredly would have done so had Gotti not hit first.

Thats what im saying he obviously didn't take Gotti that seriously. Plus with the other problems he had he probably wasn't thinking to much about Gotti, he probably would've beaten the Demeo crew case so I think if Gotti didn't make his move he would have probably busted Gotti down and Killed Ruggiero and maybe Gene Gotti before going on trial in the commission case.

I think the other bosses of remaining families in New York thought he was good boss. He had a lot of scrutiny placed on him as soon as Gambino died, yet he had a good run till commision case. Killing DeMeo seems to have been neccesary, and he had it done. If he had taken care of Gotti too, a transiition after him being convicted would have gone smoothly I would think.

I know this is off topic, but since Mr. Castellano is being discussed...something has always bugged me about that oft shown photo of him lying dead in front of Sparks. What the heck is that he is holding in his hand?! (Please forgive a newbie, if this is a well documenting thing)

It is a leather glove.

Ohhhhh Thank you Mr. Knuckles.

You´re welcome Mr Dane.

The other bosses made money with him, but it doesn't mean they thought he was a good boss. What matters most is what your family thinks of you. Apparently, enough people didn't think he was a good boss that they killed him and nobody in the family did anything about it. Imagine if some renegade capos in the Genovese family whacked Gigante. All the conspirators would be dead.

That's Ms. Dane...I must need a more girly avatar, lol.

Not necessarily.

The Bergin crew was the most feared in the family (keep in mind this is post Demeo).
Going to war with them was a very serious problem.

Additionally Jimmy Brown and Marino conspired with Chin to have him removed. And who knows who they had in their pockets?

So just because Gotti wasn't hit is absolutely not indicative of a general dislike of Paul as a boss.

The other 23 crews combined were so afraid of the bergin crew that they allowed one crew to kill their boss?

The Brown/Marino conspiracy was never verified. I doubt it ever happened or else one or both would have been killed when the story came out.

1. The point is the other 23 crews were not combined.

2. The conspiracy is commonly accepted as have taken place.

Oops! Sorry about that. It´s just that females are very rare on these kind of forums.

How about Winny the pooh as your avatar?

Welcome to the boards!

Thanks, lol!

1. That's right, they were not combined because they didn't respect their boss enough to avenge his death. If guys like Carlo Gambino, Tommy Lucchese, or Gigante had been killed by a renegade crew, that crew would have been wiped out.

2. Commonly accepted by who? That was a story told by Anthony Casso and the media took off running with it despite having no corroboration that it ever existed. There were no other testimony or wiretaps to prove it ever happened. The fact that nothing ever happened to Marino and Failla makes the story hard to believe. If the Gambinos believe MArino and Failla plotted to kill Gotti, they would have been killed, demoted or shelved.

Well Gotti wasn't totally alone, he won over Frank Decicco who was respected throughout the family.
Gotti also reached out to People in the Bonnano, Lucchese and Colombo families to gauge what their reaction would be.
Not surprisingly he made no attempt to contact the Genovese!

Paul was more of a racketeer as opposed to a gangster. The 80's approached and he took the Family in a more lucrative direction. While the blue collar wing remained steeped in the streets. He also didn't help his campaign by being greedy and allowing Gigante to clip Frank Piccolo, amongst many other offenses. Still if you majored in book making, shylocking, numbers etc... you can't be mad at another guy if he infiltrates the stock markets and unions.

Was Costello really that much different than Castellano?

His biggest mistake was not declaring that he'd make Frank DeCicco acting boss if he would go to jail. If he would've done that, he wouldn't have gotten hit and it would've been way better in general for the family, as DeCicco was respected by both factions and had great leadership skills.

Just my two cents upon further reflection... I think Paul and a chance to be a good boss and by that i mean knowing how to get the most out of his people while instilling loyalty. The fact that he was more white collar crime then blue collar crime showed how the family was diverse. Instead of purposefully not acknowledging the blue collar crew (and only taking their $$), he should have tried to welcome that diversity, like any corporation (and like he liked to think of himself as a corporate leader). Where Paul I thought was weak as a leader is that he was me-first and didn't really understand his "work force." What he did to Frank Piccolo was a crime, and clearly demonstrated his lack of care for family members. I don't know if he called in and had talks with Piccolo, but he should have, or at least broken him down to soldier, before ever allowing another family to execute him. He may have been a smart businessman, but i think he was a poor leader.

Damn right.
Tommy Bilotti was a walking pitbull and no doubt was a good bodyguard but was NOT Underboss or acting Boss material.

Good point. Definitely a lot of similarities.