Thanks. There's a few bits on Turkish OC in London on Youtube. Not sure if they're any good. I'll have a look later and see if i can dig out links.



You may be right, but I really don't think any Italian group have a majority influence anywhere in Europe outside Italy. Germany is the closest they get, and they're outnumbered even though. I don't think they properly 'control' anything, but they certainly maintain a small presence in many places.



That's not right. Turkish gangs are properly organised. Proper structure with a proper hierarchy and, although they do profit from localized rackets, they are also heavily involved in international crime. Black gangs on the other hand have little or no proper structure in Europe. They certainly don't in London. The Jamaican 'Yardie' phenomena is a complete media exaggeration and has generally been debunked. They were violent and criminal yes, but not organised in any real way.

The black gangs are definitely 'connected' to organised crime, in the sense that they buy drugs etc from proper OC groups, and occasionally act as 'violence for hire', but that's about it. The bulk of their activities are street level drug dealing and muggings and nobody gets any real money. The police are generally all over these guys anyway, with wannabe gangsters regularly going down for silly shit like stealing a mobile phone.

Its weird though, these guys number in their thousands in London alone. Certain estates in London have hundreds of so-called 'soldiers'. But they never amount to anything. Violence is all postcode related or over girls, or getting dirty looks on the bus. They're willing to kill over that shit, so its not as if they lack ruthlessness. If these guys could unite in some way (as some did during the London riots - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-19182350 )and get themselves organised I have no doubt they'd be a major OC force, at least in London. They could actually be the rich gangsters they spend their time pretending they are.

The black gangs could really do with a Lucky Luciano figure...

It's true. Almost a majority of originally East End white families moved to Essex and Kent. I've also read reports on Essex and Kent nowadays being filled to the brim with drug traffickers and crime bosses. The East End in general doesn't have the gritty, homegrown working class atmosphere anymore. Some areas have undergone major redevelopment and most are populated by descendents of the Jamaicans and more recent Bangladeshi and Pakistani immigrants. Even Canning Town -a traditionally very white area- nowadays has around 30% blacks living there, which still makes it the most 'indigenous' area in all of the East End
South London will probably have it's fair share of homegrown crime indeed. Most of it minor idiots with also a couple of more major British criminals operating there.
As for the Southeast Asian gangs: I've heard about Pakistani ( ''Mirpuri'' actually ) groups being involved in major drug and weapon trafficking operations as well as prostitution and smaller incidences of extortion. Bangladeshi gangs on the other hand always struck the impression on me for being little more than retail drug salers or just plain annoying pricks.

Btw, I'm not from England but the dad of a friend of me grew up in Bermondsey ( which is more South London ) and still has some contacts in those places. That's why I know some stuff on England's southeast ( and probably also why I'm very interested in British organized crime lol).

Ha, my mum traced my dad's family. Went back 350 years and, until my grandad, they all had the same job (carman) and lived within the same mile or so in Bermondsey!! 350 years! Unambitious bunch.

You're completely right. Essex and Kent have a lot of crime guys, but the structure in the UK means they mostly act on their own. And the older they get the less active they are. In the pubs in south east London / north west kent (where i grew up) there are countless guys described as 'gangsters' and lots of people walking on eggshells around them. But a five min chat or a bit of research usually proves they're nobodies.

I know very little about Bangladeshi/Pakistani gangs other than I know the local protection rackets in Bethnal Green actually work. Some drunk guy started causing trouble in the newsagent my girlfriend lived above a few years back. According to her, the newsagents kicked this guy out the shop but he came back 5 mins later. Shortly after three Transit vans pulled up outside the shop and out the back jumped dozens of young kids all carrying planks of wood and baseball bats and things. They dragged the guy out the shop and chased him off down the street. The newsagents were definitely not properly connected to anything, it was run by a sweet old Bangladeshi couple who'd been there for years and their three shy, geeky sons. Rumour has it they just put in a call to whoever they pay protection to when the guy showed up again and, well, they were protected...

British 'Firms' ( it's the term mostly associated with British organized crime and sort of a local equivalent for 'mafia' ) usually operate in small cells. Sometimes as small as having 5 people in a group. Sometimes these groups cooperate with each other and sometimes they fall out with one another. There's no large structure as the Italian, Turkish, Kurdish, Albanian,...groups have. But on the other hand there are a shitload of those smaller groups throughout the country.

I don't think the Bangladeshi gangs are anything close to the Turks, Russians,...or even Pakistanis and British for that matter. But small protection rackets are, as in almost any big ethnic community, of course a given

that's right, but it's the same for russians, albanians and turks
even turks don't control germany although they are 4 millions, anyway according to german police chief ziercke and organized crime expert jurgen roth ndrangheta is the most powerful group in germany e among with some local bikers
of course italian diaspora ended in the 60s and you have not italian little italies like the 40s around europe, but i'm talking of organized crime, not low level thugs

according to who?

Turks don't have one structure like the Calabrians, but they do have lots of faily large family-based groups involved in heroin trafficking mainly, but also extortion among other things. They are very organized even though you do get some petty criminals. But there's Italian petty criminals too, as in any race

Slovak police made several arrests connected with the murder of journalist Jan Kuciak seven months ago. Eight people were arrested in an operation in southern Slovakia, Dennik N reports. Slovak TV station Markiza identified one arrested man as Tomas S., a former police investigator. Police had released few details about the arrests as of mid-day. Kuciak had been reporting on the activities of Italian organized crime groups in EU subsidy fraud in Slovakia and uncovered links between Slovak officials and Italians allegedly connected to ’Ndrangheta.