Very True you don't need to be part of the lvyleague to know that..

Over the years we've seen some of the hardest squeal...

That's a good point... I mean, I'm sure alot of rich kids workign for their parents are the equivalent of no show jobs..

i get why ppl think those 2 might flip i just dont think they will...have no problem with others opinion

I still think that most will walk away free and the few that face any time it will minimal at best. I think when the case goes on for months, without any big news, the jury checks out.

Plus, it took like 10 years just to bring this 'weak" case and the jurors will see this as vindictive.

there are no smoking gun, Gotti like, wiretaps here IMHO...ie, costra nostra till I die....

Damion is a stand up guy and WHEN he beats this case and comes home he isn't flipping on anyone

Obvioulsy you know him and I respect your opinion on your friend or relative and he will probably win this case but man if and thats a BIG IF he is ever brought up on murder due to recent events that is possibly a life sentence, tough to stand up and not be first to the Feds

Well, guilty or not guilty remains to be seen. But you can't just say "minimal at best" because this is a Federal case and there are Federal sentencing guidelines in place.

If a guilty verdict comes in, the judge has to follow those guidelines. Even if convicted of the lesser charges, I can't see anyone walking free in less than five years because they all have prior felonies and the Judge has no choice but to take that into consideration. It's written into those guidelines.

And five years is not "minimal" for Ligambi at 72 years old.

So from what I'm reading here by watchers more informed than myself, this case is much ado about nothing? I except for Ligambi, most of these guys are looking at 3-5's and 5-7's? That's what, 22 months and 48 months respectively (assuming nobody gets in trouble while in the can)? This seems like a duck fart relative to trials of years past.

It seems that the potential money lost to other street crews while away with no bail is almost a bigger deal than the sentences themselves.

I think Canalichio is looking at something like 240 months if convicted across the board. That's no "duck fart." And even ten years for Ligambi, given his age, can be a life sentence. Mousie, too. But the other guys are more in the 5 to 10 bracket.

It was a good day for the defense yesterday. Bent Lou is the only thing holding Borgesi to this case and a former council aide who was bent Lou's friend and neighbor testified for the defense yesterday and did a good job. I think Scoops and Borgesi might beat the charges. Hell, they all could but I doubt they will. Then i don't know who will get what time. You would seem to think Staino, Mousie and Ligambi are def going to be found guilty of something because of the poker machines and the extortion of the company. But you have a guy like Staino whose never been arrested and then a guy like Mousie who has time shares all over the countries Federal prison system.

And those are HUGE factors under the Federal Sentencing Guidelines. It's not like State Court where the Judge can freely use a bit more discretion. He has no choice because prior convictions have to be considered in Federal Court. A prior felony or two pretty much guarantees you the maximum.

I didn't know the sentences were potentially that large.
No, 5-10's definitely aren't duck farts.

This board should post a by-defendant list of guilty's, not guilty's and each's sentence as soon as it comes out. Granted sentencing won't come til later; It'd be cool to see what the final "scoreboard" is.

Oh, and whether it's an all-guilty-all-count or only 1 conviction; I can't wait for the Federal Prosecutor to do his self serving, "We have just brought an end to the Mafia in Philadelphia" speech. Seems par for the course of any rising star prosecutor lol

Now how many charges do these guys have are their seperate charges or is all rolled into the RICO charge for hanging around one another? Because the gambling charge seems like a minor state charge or should be and not a federal one and then Uncle Joe's thing as stated above is via a private business activity.

Not sure where the jurors are from or their backgrounds but slot machines in coffee shops is a pretty weak individual charge to go away for a long time

http://www.bigtrial.net/2012/12/juror-dismissed-as-defense-rests-in-mob.html#more

Juror Dismissed as Defense Rests in Mob Case
A juror who apparently was leaning toward a guilty verdict was dismissed Wednesday shortly before the defense rested in the racketeering trial of mob boss Joseph "Uncle Joe" Ligambi and six co-defendants.

Following a closed-door session before U.S. District Court Judge Eduardo Robreno, defense attorneys and prosecutors returned to the 15th floor courtroom where Robreno told the other members of the jury panel that "juror number five will not longer be sitting with us."

Robreno offered no other explanation, but told the jury it had nothing to do with an impropriety and that the trial would continue.

The juror, a middle-aged white male (the jury was chosen anonymously) was one of nine members of the panel who said they had read or heard about a gangland murder last week in South Philadelphia. Eight other jurors (there are five alternates) said they had not heard about the incident.

Robreno questioned each juror individually. The defense and prosecution were then permitted to review transcripts of that questioning. Based on the answers of juror number five the defense moved that he be dismissed.

While what the juror told the judge has not been made public, sources in the defense camp said his answers raised questions about whether he could continue to sit and impartially evaluate the case. According to one source, the juror indicated that he was already have trouble finding any evidence or testimony that supported the defendants' claim to innocence.

The juror's dismissal, came on the heels of testimony from defense witnesses Tuesday that challenged some of the charges in the case and bouyed the hopes of defense attorneys, defendants and their family members.

One source from that group noted that it was ironic that an event that was perceived as a negative for the defendants -- a gangland hit coming during a trial in which the defense had argued that their clients were non-violent -- could turn out to be a benefit for the Ligambi camp.

Had the hit not occurred, there would have been no reason for the judge to question the jurors and juror number five would have taken his thoughts and leanings with him into jury deliberations.

The trial recessed shortly after noon Wednesday after more testimony from a gambling expert called by defense attorney Margaret Grasso, the lawyer for mob soldier Damion Canalichio. Grasso attempted to use wiretapped conversations introduced by the government to show that while Canalichio may have been a gambler, he was not a bookmaker.

The often esoteric and contradictory testimony took up several hours over two days. Assistant U.S. Attorney Frank Labor was able to point out in his cross-examination that an individual could be both a gambler and a bookmaker. More important, he alluded to a taped conversation in which Canalichio described his role in a gambling operation as a collector of debts.

Collecting debts, the gambling expert reluctantly conceded, was a part of a bookmaking operation.

Defense attorneys and the prosecution will be back in front of Robreno Thursday to discuss the jury charge -- Robreno's instruction to the panel on the law that applies to the case. Ligambi, 73, and the others have been charged with racketeering conspiracy tied to allegations of sports betting, loansharking, extortion and the operation of illegal video poker machines.

The defendants and the jury are not due back in court until Jan. 3 when closing arguments are to begin. The jury will likely get the case and begin deliberations after Robreno's charge on Jan. 7.

Family members and friends wished the defendants well as they were lead out of the courtroom. Only defendants Anthony Staino, and Gary Battaglini are free on bail. They, like the jurors, will be home for Christmas.

Ligambi, Canalichio, mob underboss Joseph "Mousie" Massimino and mob capos Joseph "Scoops" Licata and George Borgesi (Ligambi's nephew) are being held without bail and will spent the holiday break in the Federal Detention Center next door to the courthouse where they have been held since their indictment in May 2011.

Massimino has been predicting for the past week that he will be coming home soon.

His sister Patty, who has attended the two-month trial regularly, said she and other family members were hopeful.

"My brother would give you the food off his table and the shirt off his back," she said of the oft-convicted 62-year-old mobster who has spent nearly half of his adult life in prison for convictions tied to gambling, racketeering and drug dealing.
Read more at http://www.bigtrial.net/2012/12/juror-dismissed-as-defense-rests-in-mob.html#UMgqgKYDd2uSkSMB.99

How/why would they say "A juror who apparently was leaning toward a guilty verdict"

How do they know that..??

They always poll a juror after he's dismissed.

heck of scoop if GA or the other inquirer guy gets an interview with this juror just to see how he felt and why he thought this

Well, if the jury is cut off from outside media they could technically interview him. But I doubt it. It's close to Christmas and the jurors are sure to go home for the holidays, so I just can't see it. It could "taint" them.

But if one juror was leaning towards a guilty verict, well, chances are these guys are gonna get convicted on at least one count. But like every defense lawyer in the world will tell you: Juries are unpredictable. You just never know.

Time will tell.

Long Long holiday and break for those guys locked up in center city waiting on this

I never even want to ever bring the name up of Casey Anthony but the only reason I am is because trust me you can not read a juror's mind.I mean with that evidence there's no way she's walking,none.Expert jury watchers saying she's cooked,and well you know the rest.Not 1 other person I know that followed that trial thought she was walking.You can't speculate on a jury,you just can't.I go back to this neighbor of Bent Finger,if I was on the jury I would laugh at that.I would think the defense is paying somebody[hey it is Christmas time] to bad mouth him and make Borgesi look good.You know yourself Borgesi had ears probably all over the street and if Lou was using his name to help himself Borgesi would have put a stop to it.You know he fear's Borgesi.

Everyone is quick to give their opinion about canalichio and borgesi. What you have to realize is that borgesi is coming off a 13 year sentence and canalichio is coming off a 5 year sentence. They never made it home before this indictment and if convicted they are both looking at some serious time. Nobody is saying I hope these guys go home to their families. Neither one of these guys will cooperate! Not guilty across the board.

'' Assistant U.S. Attorney Frank Labor was able to point out in his cross-examination that an individual could be both a gambler and a bookmaker. More important, he alluded to a taped conversation in which Canalichio described his role in a gambling operation as a collector of debts. Collecting debts, the gambling expert reluctantly conceded, was a part of a bookmaking operation.''

This is exactly what I argued a few pages back in regards to Damion.

Beating a dead horse here..Say if you or me knew a bookie and he is only going to take bets from you. You have 5 friends who want to bet on some games also...so now your putting bets in for 5 people ...you and your friends lose you go to make up the collections does that make you part of a bookmaking operation? But considering who Damion is who he is associated with they are going to go after him for anything they can. Dap you were in a frat right? Everyone in the frat wants some action your putting in twenty bets whats that make you?

I agree with you ,many people ,legit will collect money/bets and pay bets ! That doesn't make them the bookmaker ! Maybe the reality ishe was just placing or collecting larger bets ! Bigger money ,

I have to collect each week for my degenerate friends who can't seem to win so that would also make me part of the collections, the problem he has is the associations or their past and the criminal enterprise it may OR may not be associated with. And to teh point of them being locked up during the holidays, I do not agree with them being locked up the entire case seeing that this is not a murder case, I think the government overreached on their authority regarding this "RICO lite" trial but this is going to be tough to get out from

AMEN

Well, if some of them got 5 years, they have already served like 2, would be home in another 2 to 2 1/2 with good behavior. More than I want to do, but not 10 or 15 years either..

I'm glad you phrased it like that, AzGuy. That's honest of you and I admire that. Because anyone who ever posts something like, "five years is nuthin to dem guys," never spent a day in prison. I can guarantee you that. Until you hear that door close behind you, your opinion on the matter really doesn't count. And I know that Gamms (Sit) will agree with me.

Lets reminisce a little bit. Eighteen months ago, words and opinions out there ranged from The Stephanelie Tapes where they were talking about unsolved murders meant that the South Philly guys were Guilty AUTOMATICALLY, also George Bourgesi recordings from the visiting room meant he was guilty according to most of you. Canalichio threatening Mickey Orlando was an auto Guilty Verdict!!! This was the Prosecutions case in the beginning holding Canalichio and Scoops without bail! The Prosecution never argued any of these original allegations during trial in the past 12 weeks! They did refer to Orlando and on the stand Orlando stated that he was NEVER threatened. Anastasia also touched on all these subjects to sell his news and failed to mention they never used George's's tapes, Scoops was never talking about any unsolved murders and Canalichio never threatened anyone! Bare minimum was $8Milion Spent... NOT GUILTY ACCROSS THE BOARD!!1

I honestly don't give a fuck one way or the other. But if you're going to post this so emphatically you better be ready to get absolutely skewered if they're convicted.

The fact is, you're very nervous about losing someone close to you for the next twenty years, so you're brimming with OVER confidence to blind yourself to that possibility. Wishing it to be won't make it happen. Only a jury can do that. And where juries are concerned, you just never know.

Anyway, best of luck to you and your friends/family.