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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: HairyKnuckles]
#660867
08/19/12 05:25 AM
08/19/12 05:25 AM
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,781
Dwalin2011
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,781
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Let us debunk the thought of Luciano as the "godfather´s godfather", "the founder of the US Mafia", "the creator of the five Families", "the boss of bosses" and whatever else is said about him on Wiki or on attention seeking "documentaries" produced by networks without having done any serious research on the matter.
First of all, the idea of a Commission was circulated among the bosses already during the Castellammarese war in an effort to stop the fighting between Masseria and Maranzano. Maranzano, who was about to win the war and had his eyes focused at the boss of bosses position, naturally rejected the idea. But the idea of a Commission as a governing and ruling body was picked up by Luciano and set in motion after the Maranzano killing with the help of Bonanno, the leader of the Castellammareses and the leader of the winning side in the war.
Second of all, Luciano was never the chairman of the Commission. He was a boss, equal with the rest of them. Simply put, he was just one of a number of Commission members with no special powers or status within the Mafia elite. Because of political ambitions, the myth of Luciano as some sort of a supreme criminal mastermind, was started by Dewey. Luciano was an easy target because he had become the visible face of the mob. Lazy and ignorant journalists further embellished the Luciano legend. He was never a boss of bosses, not even when put between brackets. The chairman´s position fell on Vincent Mangano because of his superior age. He was replaced by Bonanno and later Magaddino, temporarily, served in this position when Bonanno refused to come in for meetings.
Third of all, the chairman of the Commission never had more votes than the rest of the members. His vote counted the same. He was never a more powerful figure in that regards. His primary function was to serve as a contact person whenever a problem surfaced that needed attention. And it was his job to organize the meetings. Remember, the chairman had never more formal authority than any other Commission member. The number of members on the Commission was originally 5, then 7 and then 9. All odd numbers which would assure decisionmaking after voting.
So I don´t understand the jealousy thing. What else was there to be jealous of? Luciano sent away for 30-50 years for compulsory prostitution, or his deportation to Italy when finally released?
There is one thing I don't understand: if Luciano was in no way superior to other bosses, then why did the government free him and why did they deal with him and not the other bosses when organizing the landing of the army in Sicily using his mafia contacts?
Willie Marfeo to Henry Tameleo:
1) "You people want a loaf of bread and you throw the crumbs back. Well, fuck you. I ain't closing down."
2) "Get out of here, old man. Go tell Raymond to go shit in his hat. We're not giving you anything."
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Toodoped]
#660868
08/19/12 05:32 AM
08/19/12 05:32 AM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418 Secret location (WITSEC)
HairyKnuckles
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
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First Vincent Mangano was secretly controlled by Luciano,his whole Mangano family was controled by Luciano and Mangano knew this and he had to keep quiet anyway,second...you wanna say that when Gambino was on the commision table his vote was counted the same as others?!?!?!? ...plus Bonanno in his book told lies about Luciano,doesnt that tell you something?!even on the Bonanno interview his a little bit critical at Luciano Luciano controled the Mangano Family? First time I´m hearing that. How many votes did Gambino have? 10? Have you read the Bonanno book? Where do you find the lies on Lucky? I would like you to ellaborate on that. A little bit of critical on Luciano? I missed that as well. I think the only thing he says about Luciano is his "he loved to make money" Have you read the Bonanno book? Bonanno describes Lucky with great respect. So what are you talking about?
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: HairyKnuckles]
#660871
08/19/12 05:43 AM
08/19/12 05:43 AM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461 Underground
Toodoped
OP
Murder Ink
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OP
Murder Ink
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461
Underground
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Do your homework ...Luciano controled Mangano through Anastasia,Albert was the main force in the Mangano family,sometimes when Mangano ordered a hit..sometimes it was canceled by Lucky so Mangano grew to resent him.Bonanno sad that Lucky orchastrated the heroin ring and that Bonanno never had his hands in the narco biz,but the truth is they were together on the meeting in Palermo,and other stuff sorry for not remembering but i read the book long time ago....as for Gambino's votes...not 10,but 1000 "Luciano most probably had nothing to do with the landing of the US Army in Italy."..really?!you sure?!?!?!?
Last edited by Toodoped; 08/19/12 05:47 AM.
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: HairyKnuckles]
#660873
08/19/12 05:51 AM
08/19/12 05:51 AM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461 Underground
Toodoped
OP
Murder Ink
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OP
Murder Ink
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461
Underground
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First of all nothing is true in the Bonanno book(i hate that book)cuz its fictional...but you sayin that Lucania never had anything to do with the US army landing on Sicily...i dunno my friend...maybe you like the action of fantasy and conspiracy?! I mean whats next...Hoover was the head of LCN?!?!?!
Last edited by Toodoped; 08/19/12 05:52 AM.
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: HairyKnuckles]
#660881
08/19/12 06:22 AM
08/19/12 06:22 AM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461 Underground
Toodoped
OP
Murder Ink
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OP
Murder Ink
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461
Underground
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Why not?Don Calogero was connected to Genovese,Vito was under Lucky,after the war Lucky connected with Don Calogero and dont forget Calogero was one of the main players during WWII ...heres a piece of an article has nothing to do with the war...
Bonanno felt he deserved the vaunted position(boss of all bosses)since in his estimation he, unlike his so-called peers, was the only remaining man of honor in the tradition of the Sicilian Mafia.Wealth, he would later write in his controversial 1983 autobiography, was a by-product of power.According to Bonanno, Lucky Luciano and his ilk concerned themselves with the most primitive consideration:making money-an interesting statement coming from a man whose crime family made most of its profits from the sale and distribution of narcotics..............Joe always sayin that he was this and that...and others were something else diferent from him bla bla bla...
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Five_Felonies]
#660893
08/19/12 12:06 PM
08/19/12 12:06 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461 Underground
Toodoped
OP
Murder Ink
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OP
Murder Ink
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461
Underground
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Here's something about the Luciano's release and the heroin route... In 1946 American military intelligence made one final gift to the Mafia -they released Luciano from prison and deported him to Italy, thereby freeing the greatest criminal talent of his generation to rebuild the heroin trade. Appealing to the New York State Parole Board in 1945 for his immediate release, Luciano's lawyers based their case on his wartime services to the navy and army. Although naval intelligence officers called to give evidence at the hearings were extremely vague about what they had promised Luciano in exchange for his services, one naval officer wrote a number of confidential letters on Luciano's behalf that were instrumental in securing his release.Within two years after Luciano returned to Italy, the U.S. government deported over one hundred more mafiosi as well. And with the cooperation of his old friend, Don Calogero, and the help of many of his old followers from New York, Luciano was able to build an awesome international narcotics syndicate soon after his arrival in Italy. The narcotics syndicate Luciano organized after World War It remains one of the most remarkable in the history of the traffic. For more than a decade it moved morphine base from the Middle East to Europe, transformed it into heroin, and then exported it in substantial quantities to the United States-all without ever suffering a major arrest or seizure. The organization's comprehensive distribution network within the United States increased the number of active addicts from an estimated 20,000 at the close of the war to 60,000 in 1952 and to 150,000 by 1965. After resurrecting the narcotics traffic, Luciano's first problem was securing a reliable supply of heroin. Initially he relied on diverting legally produced heroin from one of Italy's most respected pharmaceutical companies, Schiaparelli. However, investigations by the U.S. Federal Bureau of Narcotics in 1950-which disclosed that a minimum of 700 kilos of heroin had been diverted to Luciano over a four-year period-led to a tightening of Italian pharmaceutical regulations. But by this time Luciano had built up a network of clandestine laboratories in Sicily and Marseille and no longer needed to divert the Schiaparelli product. Morphine base was now the necessary commodity. Thanks to his contacts in the Middle East, Luciano established a long-term business relationship with a Lebanese who was quickly becoming known as the Middle East's major exporter of morphine base-Sami El Khoury. Through judicious use of bribes and his high social standing in Beirut society,El Khoury established an organization of unparalleled political strength. The directors of Beirut Airport, Lebanese customs, the Lebanese narcotics police, and perhaps most importantly, the chief of the antisubversive section of the Lebanese police,protected the import of raw opium from Turkey's Anatolian plateau into Lebanon, its processing into morphine base, and its final export to the laboratories in Sicily and Marseille. After the morphine left Lebanon, its first stop was the bays and inlets of Sicily's western coast. There Palermo's fishing trawlers would meet ocean-going freighters from the Middle East in international waters, pick up the drug cargo, and then smuggle it into fishing villages scattered along the rugged coastline. Once the morphine base was safely ashore, it was transformed into heroin in one of Luciano's clandestine laboratories. Typical of these was the candy factory opened in Palermo in 1949: it was ]eased to one of Luciano's cousins and managed by Don Calogero himself.The laboratory operated without incident until April 11, 1954, when the Roman daily Avanti! published a photograph of the factory under the headline "Textiles and Sweets on the Drug Route." That evening the factory was closed, and the laboratory's chemists were reportedly smuggled out of the country. Once heroin had been manufactured and packaged for export, Luciano used his Mafia connections to send it through a maze of international routes to the United States. Not all of the mafiosi deported from the United States stayed in Sicily. To reduce the chance of seizure, Luciano had placed many of them in such European cities as Milan, Hamburg, Paris, and Marseille so they could forward the heroin to the United States after it arrived from Sicil concealed in fruits, vegetables, or candy. From Europe heroin was shipped directly to New York or smuggled through Canada and Cuba.
Last edited by Toodoped; 08/19/12 12:15 PM.
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Toodoped]
#660901
08/19/12 01:05 PM
08/19/12 01:05 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 368
ht2
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 368
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First Vincent Mangano was secretly controlled by Luciano,his whole Mangano family was controled by Luciano and Mangano knew this and he had to keep quiet anyway,second...you wanna say that when Gambino was on the commision table his vote was counted the same as others?!?!?!? ...plus Bonanno in his book told lies about Luciano,doesnt that tell you something?!even on the Bonanno interview his a little bit critical at Luciano I believe this also. Anastasia was regularly associating with members of Luciano's inner circle (Joe Adonis, Costello etc.) and there are reports that this was a source of arguments, but Mangano was powerless to do anything about it. On an older thread someone described Luciano as "first among equals". As leader of the most powerful family with syndicate ties to non italian gangsters, Luciano held sway over the other bosses.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Toodoped]
#660917
08/19/12 02:04 PM
08/19/12 02:04 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 418 New York
Imamobguy
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 418
New York
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First Vincent Mangano was secretly controlled by Luciano,his whole Mangano family was controled by Luciano and Mangano knew this and he had to keep quiet anyway,second...you wanna say that when Gambino was on the commision table his vote was counted the same as others?!?!?!? ...plus Bonanno in his book told lies about Luciano,doesnt that tell you something?!even on the Bonanno interview his a little bit critical at Luciano Bonanno didnt tell lies, Toodoped you believe Wikipedia. Wikipedia are made up from Sources and References linked up from Newspaper's and "Historian"'s bullshit. Bonanno was a real man, He knew the truth and he wasnt a lieing man like I said before, I did an Interview with his Bill Bonanno in early 2000 and did an Interview with Daniel, Bonanno's adopted son. Bonanno spoke the truth. Believe the fact's Toodoped not the Newspaper.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Toodoped]
#660918
08/19/12 02:10 PM
08/19/12 02:10 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461 Underground
Toodoped
OP
Murder Ink
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OP
Murder Ink
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,461
Underground
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Heres a part from another article taken from Gangstersinc.com written by Thom L.Jones and its about the drug route and Genovese member Mike Coppola... From February to April 1937, Coppola rented a house on East 5th Street in Tuscon, Arizona, and along with Cleveland mobster Al Polizzi, Lepke Buchalter from New York, Pete Licavoli from Detroit and Joe Zucker, an aide to Frank Costello, spent time socialising with Jewish gangster Moe Dalitz, who went about purchasing a chain of laundries in the area, (Dalitz seemed to have a thing about laundries, owing a string of them in Detroit and Cleveland,) but just what these other gangsters were discussing as they went hunting and partying has never been disclosed, although it's fairly certain they had not travelled all this way just to get a tan. It has been suggested that with the Nazi government disrupting traditional drug trafficking routes out of Europe, these men had gathered here, close to the Mexican border, to try to sort out alternate routes for their raw materials source. If in fact this is what they had assembled here for, they were probably dealing with Enrique Diarte, a Tijuana based Mexican narcotics trafficker, who in the late 1930s and early 1940s was probably the biggest drug dealer in Mexico. By the early 1940s Coppola had consolidated his position in the Luciano family, growing rich on the proceeds of his gambling activities. His place in the mob was obviously a mystery to law enforcement officials at city and government level. The Federal Bureau of Narcotics (FBN,) who were probably the most active agency tacking the Mafia at this time, wrongly perceived him as a lieutenant in the 107th. Street Mob, which is known today as the Luchese family.The agency had created a file in 1936 showing the group was led by Tommy Luchese assisted by Coppola and Dominck Petrelli. They believed the overall boss of the 107th Street Mob to be Ciro Terranova. Petrelli, Coppola and Terranova were part of the Mafia clan that was controlled by Charlie Luciano. The FBN did however, get Luchese’s place in the 107th correctly identified, just not his position. The family at this time was controlled by Tommaso Gagliano. The FBI would never “officially” recognize the existence of the Mafia for almost another twenty years, which no doubt suited Coppola and his mob friends down to the ground. Mike Coppola was part of a crew operating in East Harlem that would become famous for at least four of its other members in the years to come: Joseph 'Socks' Lanza, who became the czar of the Fulton Fish Market for the mob, making it for many years a major cash-cow for the Luciano crime family. Lanza probably worked for Coppola as a “muscle” man in the early stages of his mob career, but became a man of such standing, when he married in 1941, his best man was Frank Costello, then the head of the family. Phil Lombardo, a small, bald, and cross-eyed gangster, who at one time was driver/bodyguard for big boss Charlie Luciano and would become the family boss himself one day. Anthony ‘Fat Tony’ Salerno, one of three brothers in the mob, the others being Alfred and Angelo, who would also rise in ranking to be the big cheese in the Genovese crime family, at least the 'front' big cheese. And Barney Bellomo who may or may not have reached that exalted position in the 21st century. According to informant Joseph Valachi, “Trigger Mike’s” crew was the biggest in the family, which if true, would have made him one if not the most powerful capo in what was perhaps the biggest Mafia unit in New York, at the time. and here's a link for the whole article.. http://gangstersinc.ning.com/profiles/blogs/man-is-the-cruelest-animal-the
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: Luciano vs. Genovese
[Re: Imamobguy]
#660924
08/19/12 02:17 PM
08/19/12 02:17 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809 Scotland
Camarel
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809
Scotland
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First Vincent Mangano was secretly controlled by Luciano,his whole Mangano family was controled by Luciano and Mangano knew this and he had to keep quiet anyway,second...you wanna say that when Gambino was on the commision table his vote was counted the same as others?!?!?!? ...plus Bonanno in his book told lies about Luciano,doesnt that tell you something?!even on the Bonanno interview his a little bit critical at Luciano Bonanno didnt tell lies, Toodoped you believe Wikipedia. Wikipedia are made up from Sources and References linked up from Newspaper's and "Historian"'s bullshit. Bonanno was a real man, He knew the truth and he wasnt a lieing man like I said before, I did an Interview with his Bill Bonanno in early 2000 and did an Interview with Daniel, Bonanno's adopted son. Bonanno spoke the truth. Believe the fact's Toodoped not the Newspaper. So you actually believe Joe banned drugs and wasn't making millions off them with Galante? Or he knew nothing about what was going to happen to Maranzano?
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