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Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607050
07/06/11 03:15 PM
07/06/11 03:15 PM
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tt120 Offline
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In no particular order ,

Carmine Persico - obvious one: spent half his childhood/teenage years in fights and shootouts, spent half his adult life in the can. been able to maintain control over the colombos through it all. plus if half the shit they say is true, him spitting out bullets and all that... well...

Nicky Corozzo - Went away on a pair of murders he (allegedly) had nothing to do with so a bunch of guys could stay out or cop to light plea deals. Plus since he's so short im guessing he could scrap in his younger years

Scarpa Sr. - mean son of a bitch, probably borderline psychopathic

Tony Frederici (sp) - dunno much about the guy but you dont get the nickname Tough Tony for nothin

Basciano - powerhouse on the street, been getting shitted on for the better half of a decade by the government/prison system. what hes been through would break or drive someone to suicide. and through it all he still looks like hes 35

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: tt120] #607062
07/06/11 06:36 PM
07/06/11 06:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 227
Montreal-Ottawa-Toronto
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ONTARIO613 Offline
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Originally Posted By: tt120
In no particular order ,

Carmine Persico - obvious one: spent half his childhood/teenage years in fights and shootouts, spent half his adult life in the can. been able to maintain control over the colombos through it all. plus if half the shit they say is true, him spitting out bullets and all that... well...

Nicky Corozzo - Went away on a pair of murders he (allegedly) had nothing to do with so a bunch of guys could stay out or cop to light plea deals. Plus since he's so short im guessing he could scrap in his younger years

Scarpa Sr. - mean son of a bitch, probably borderline psychopathic

Tony Frederici (sp) - dunno much about the guy but you dont get the nickname Tough Tony for nothin

Basciano - powerhouse on the street, been getting shitted on for the better half of a decade by the government/prison system. what hes been through would break or drive someone to suicide. and through it all he still looks like hes 35

I think the G-man had it in for anyone who was at The Infamous Bono Wedding and Basciano was the last on the list although I think he was there like Paulie was at the Corleane wedding 'Paulie More Wine!"

Last edited by ONTARIO613; 07/06/11 06:38 PM.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: ONTARIO613] #607078
07/07/11 12:25 AM
07/07/11 12:25 AM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 477
Ontario
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Mussolini14 Offline
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Ontario
Originally Posted By: ONTARIO613
Originally Posted By: tt120
In no particular order ,

Carmine Persico - obvious one: spent half his childhood/teenage years in fights and shootouts, spent half his adult life in the can. been able to maintain control over the colombos through it all. plus if half the shit they say is true, him spitting out bullets and all that... well...

Nicky Corozzo - Went away on a pair of murders he (allegedly) had nothing to do with so a bunch of guys could stay out or cop to light plea deals. Plus since he's so short im guessing he could scrap in his younger years

Scarpa Sr. - mean son of a bitch, probably borderline psychopathic

Tony Frederici (sp) - dunno much about the guy but you dont get the nickname Tough Tony for nothin

Basciano - powerhouse on the street, been getting shitted on for the better half of a decade by the government/prison system. what hes been through would break or drive someone to suicide. and through it all he still looks like hes 35

I think the G-man had it in for anyone who was at The Infamous Bono Wedding and Basciano was the last on the list although I think he was there like Paulie was at the Corleane wedding 'Paulie More Wine!"


Is that true about Baciano being last on the list? Poor Vinny. Well at least he got invited. I wonder if he was even made at that time.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: phatmatress] #607079
07/07/11 12:31 AM
07/07/11 12:31 AM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
TonyG Offline
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Texas
Originally Posted By: phatmatress

#3 ask how any luchesse guys if they give 2 shits about vic amuso. hes boss in name only. just like persico.


Agreed - Amuso and Persico are Boss in name only. Most Lucchese guys respect Amuso for doing his time, but do not give a shit about him. Most would like to take a shit on Gas for ratting. And being a bad rat. Oh and he killed / had killed a bunch of them.


Best way to catch the smart ones? Get an idiot working for them.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607116
07/07/11 01:42 PM
07/07/11 01:42 PM
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marty Offline
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Hey guys, I just found this site, and I like it a lot. I've been reading up on the Cosa Nostra in the United States for the last year or so, and I'm ready to discuss my overall impressions with some experts.

As far as toughness, here's the list that I had in mind before I found this thread. Keep in mind that I don't know a lot about many of the lower lever mafia players, so my selection is pretty much limited to the various bosses.

1. Vito Genovese
2. Carmine Galante
3. Albert Anastasia

I am very curious why nobody in this thread has mentioned Genovese. His reputation for brutality among guys of his generation was rivaled only by Anastasia. Lucky Luciano once called him "the world's greatest hitman." And I read the earlier discussion about toughness vs just being a mean bastard, and while I agree that there is a difference, I think that if you are a mean bastard who has made it to the top of the mob, you're probably pretty tough. All three of the guys on this list are psychopaths, and violent psychopaths are some of the toughest guys out there (unfortunately).

Other factors that I believe contribute to Vito's toughness include the following (please correct me if I'm wrong):
-He immigrated to the United States when he was a teenager, with no family or support
-He was on the team that assassinated Joe the Boss, which would take massive balls
-When he fled to Italy for ten years, he basically pulled together a huge black market organization from scratch, and managed to play both sides of the war against each other (you gotta be tough to successfully deal with the Fascists and the US Army)
-When he was sent away to prison as an old man, he didn't say shit (I'm looking at you Joey Massino!)

Some of you guys seem more well-read on the Mafia than I am, so I'm wondering what you think about my view of Don Vittono.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607118
07/07/11 02:29 PM
07/07/11 02:29 PM
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
Sonny_Black Offline
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Coincidentally I made a screenshot of Genovese's FBI file which is shown in the documentary Crime Inc.

(right-click on the pic to see it enlarged)



"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: marty] #607119
07/07/11 02:56 PM
07/07/11 02:56 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
TonyG Offline
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Texas
Originally Posted By: marty
Hey guys, I just found this site, and I like it a lot. I've been reading up on the Cosa Nostra in the United States for the last year or so, and I'm ready to discuss my overall impressions with some experts.

As far as toughness, here's the list that I had in mind before I found this thread. Keep in mind that I don't know a lot about many of the lower lever mafia players, so my selection is pretty much limited to the various bosses.

1. Vito Genovese
2. Carmine Galante
3. Albert Anastasia

I am very curious why nobody in this thread has mentioned Genovese. His reputation for brutality among guys of his generation was rivaled only by Anastasia. Lucky Luciano once called him "the world's greatest hitman." And I read the earlier discussion about toughness vs just being a mean bastard, and while I agree that there is a difference, I think that if you are a mean bastard who has made it to the top of the mob, you're probably pretty tough. All three of the guys on this list are psychopaths, and violent psychopaths are some of the toughest guys out there (unfortunately).

Other factors that I believe contribute to Vito's toughness include the following (please correct me if I'm wrong):
-He immigrated to the United States when he was a teenager, with no family or support
-He was on the team that assassinated Joe the Boss, which would take massive balls
-When he fled to Italy for ten years, he basically pulled together a huge black market organization from scratch, and managed to play both sides of the war against each other (you gotta be tough to successfully deal with the Fascists and the US Army)
-When he was sent away to prison as an old man, he didn't say shit (I'm looking at you Joey Massino!)

Some of you guys seem more well-read on the Mafia than I am, so I'm wondering what you think about my view of Don Vittono.


Welcome aboard....your position is compelling. I rarely think of the young mean Vito. I always think of the old man with glasses who had others do his murdering for him.

Don't forget he had a man murdered so he could marry his wife (Anna was her name I believe). Anna eventually ratted Vito out and he did nothing to her that we know about. He loses toughness points in my book for that. Compare that to Mad Sam DeStefano who made his wife have sex with a random black dude off the street once when she pissed him off.


Best way to catch the smart ones? Get an idiot working for them.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: TonyG] #607120
07/07/11 03:16 PM
07/07/11 03:16 PM
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Posts: 3,568
Sonny_Black Offline
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Originally Posted By: TonyG
Anna eventually ratted Vito out and he did nothing to her that we know about. He loses toughness points in my book for that. Compare that to Mad Sam DeStefano who made his wife have sex with a random black dude off the street once when she pissed him off.


Imo, this has nothing to do with "toughness". From such a perspective, every lunatic would be tough...


"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607144
07/07/11 07:23 PM
07/07/11 07:23 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
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JasonAnthony74 Offline
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Gotta go with Carlo Gambino.......The guy could bench three plates and squat a volkswagen.....Not bad for a short, wispy squirrely looking man with a big nose!

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607145
07/07/11 07:27 PM
07/07/11 07:27 PM
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JasonAnthony74 Offline
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I don't think I'd like to fight John Gotti Sr. Too many stories/accounts of him being a very brutal, violent, physical guy. As he got older, he put on weight and was built like a sanitation truck.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: Sonny_Black] #607150
07/07/11 09:16 PM
07/07/11 09:16 PM
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Posts: 498
Texas
TonyG Offline
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Originally Posted By: Sonny_Black
Originally Posted By: TonyG
Anna eventually ratted Vito out and he did nothing to her that we know about. He loses toughness points in my book for that. Compare that to Mad Sam DeStefano who made his wife have sex with a random black dude off the street once when she pissed him off.


Imo, this has nothing to do with "toughness". From such a perspective, every lunatic would be tough...


I hear you Sonny....and I agree, any man who beats a woman is coward. But to whack a woman you love, because she ratted on you, does that qualify as tough? I do not know how to answer it because I cannot even conceive of it!

This is a weird area of toughness, but because we are talking about a wife, a woman, it changes perspective.


Best way to catch the smart ones? Get an idiot working for them.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: JasonAnthony74] #607154
07/08/11 12:18 AM
07/08/11 12:18 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,171
pittsburgh pa
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phatmatress Offline
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pittsburgh pa
Originally Posted By: JasonAnthony74
Gotta go with Carlo Gambino.......The guy could bench three plates and squat a volkswagen.....Not bad for a short, wispy squirrely looking man with a big nose!



WHAT?!@?!?!!?!?!?!? come back in from left field buddy


I hate Dicknoses!!!!!!
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: JasonAnthony74] #607156
07/08/11 02:00 AM
07/08/11 02:00 AM
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Posts: 7
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marty Offline
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Originally Posted By: JasonAnthony74
Gotta go with Carlo Gambino.......The guy could bench three plates and squat a volkswagen.....Not bad for a short, wispy squirrely looking man with a big nose!


Instead of Chuck Norris facts, we can do Carlo Gambino facts.
I'll start. When Don Carlo stares at the sun, it goes blind. Don Carlo can cut through a hot knife with butter. Don Carlo finished the Neverending Story. Carlo Gambino is the reason why Waldo is hiding. Etc Etc

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: marty] #607157
07/08/11 02:02 AM
07/08/11 02:02 AM
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,171
pittsburgh pa
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phatmatress Offline
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Originally Posted By: marty
Originally Posted By: JasonAnthony74
Gotta go with Carlo Gambino.......The guy could bench three plates and squat a volkswagen.....Not bad for a short, wispy squirrely looking man with a big nose!


Instead of Chuck Norris facts, we can do Carlo Gambino facts.
I'll start. When Don Carlo stares at the sun, it goes blind. Don Carlo can cut through a hot knife with butter. Don Carlo finished the Neverending Story. Carlo Gambino is the reason why Waldo is hiding. Etc Etc
please don't..............


I hate Dicknoses!!!!!!
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607159
07/08/11 03:17 AM
07/08/11 03:17 AM
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Posts: 1,635
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VinnyGorgeous Offline OP
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Don Carlo lol. Fuck him! Do Sonny Franzese.

Sonny Franzese is so tough, he prefers doing time inside a piranha tank without oxygen.

Sonny Franzese is so tough, he once shot himself five times in the chest to level the playing field during a war with Albert Anastasia.

Sonny Franzese is so tough, he regularly complains about improving conditions while doing fifty years in solitary confinement.

and finally...
Sonny Franzese is so tough, he once raped Carlo Gambino in front of the commission.


"What is given, can be taken away. Everyone lies. Everyone dies." - Casey Anthony, in a poem, July 7, 2008
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #607189
07/08/11 03:09 PM
07/08/11 03:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 727
Northumberland England
GaryH Offline
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Northumberland England
Vito Arena (DeMeo crew) was a stocky guy who could handle himself................and he would want to rape some guy if he got the chance!

LOL

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #653012
06/24/12 07:33 PM
06/24/12 07:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809
Scotland
Camarel Offline
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Camarel  Offline
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Scotland
1.roy demeo
2.carmine galante
3.albert anastasia
4.crazy joe
5.tony mirra

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: Sonny_Black] #653013
06/24/12 07:36 PM
06/24/12 07:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809
Scotland
Camarel Offline
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Camarel  Offline
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Scotland
sorry i mean this guy

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: Mussolini14] #653014
06/24/12 07:38 PM
06/24/12 07:38 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,809
Scotland
Camarel Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mussolini14
Originally Posted By: TonyG
Originally Posted By: Mussolini14

Honorable mention goes to Harry Riccobene because at age 71 he over powered 24 year old Wayne Grande after taking 3 bullets and took the gun away from him.


Yes, big props to the Hunchback. I saw the interview where he describes it. He had no fear.

But Nitti? He whacked himself rather than go back to the can. Where I am from, can you say P U S S Y!


Actually he had terminal cancer which is the main reason he shot himself. And I doubt being a p u s s y is a character trait of someone who rises to the top of the Chicago outfit.


i read it was because he was claustrophobic if im talking about the same guy

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: Camarel] #653019
06/24/12 08:10 PM
06/24/12 08:10 PM
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BarrettM Offline
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Thomas 'The Chinaman' Sinito. His matter of fact approach to murder really scares me. It's when guys have the attitude that somewhere down the line, their friends might be informants that really scares me. His decision to murder David Perrier is really terrifying, and he exhibited Gravano-like behavior, lying about his worker's misdeeds to have hits placed out on them and take over more and more of the underworld.

After years of research I've concluded Fiore 'Fifi' Buccieri was the most terrifying of the terrifying outfit guys. He choked Tony Spilotro half to death with his bare hands and had a weird fetish for torture with a cattle prod.

Last edited by BarrettM; 06/24/12 08:11 PM.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #653080
06/25/12 09:26 AM
06/25/12 09:26 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
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Your Mom's House
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I think just going with the contemporaries... Persico, Amuso, Franzese... these men have not wavered from the life they chose... steely in their convictions...

Old days... Genovese, Gambino, Galante, Anastasia... must be something with the "Gs"..

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #654677
07/06/12 10:23 PM
07/06/12 10:23 PM
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fergie Offline
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There's no need to go on too much here - from the guys we normally here about (I'm sure there are worse though!) it was Galante or Genovese.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: phatmatress] #655256
07/12/12 09:44 PM
07/12/12 09:44 PM
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Posts: 50
New Hampshire
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Obviously many interpretations of tough, but I'd say:

1- Frank Calabrese, Sr
2- Roy DeMeo
3- Greg Scarpa
4- Sam Gravano
5- Lord High Executioner (for good measure)

Originally Posted By: phatmatress
i see alot of people putting demeo on here. i find him the most interesting gangster and if you want to go as to call him my fav i guess you could do this. he was very psycopathic and cruel but i don't know how tough he really was. he def had a tough stomach. but also killed a man who gave him a black eye. although the line he muttered about the guy who gave him a black eye was "last important thing he will ever do!"

Roy was known as a burly tough guy that was good with his hands, even if he only used his trigger finger and bone saws most of the time...

Also, I believe it was Nino Gaggi that got punched, not Roy. Nino was definitely not a street fighter type.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #655420
07/14/12 03:44 AM
07/14/12 03:44 AM
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jace Offline
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Galante and Gotti. Both were tough on streets, and both did a lot of prison time.
John "Sonny" Franzese would fit in that category also.

Last edited by jace; 07/14/12 03:45 AM.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #655746
07/16/12 10:33 PM
07/16/12 10:33 PM
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Joined: May 2012
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frank salemmi and his kid killed a club owner together, is that a first father and son just wacking some bum? they were both made guys the owner of a club held out on money. when salemmi fliped he forgot to tell the feds and they gave him 5 more yrs. i think conelly might not be guilty he got railroaded whitey might save his ass.but he's still a shitbag.

Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #655804
07/17/12 02:22 PM
07/17/12 02:22 PM
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600
Underground
Toodoped Offline
Murder Ink
Toodoped  Offline
Murder Ink

Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600
Underground
I cant belive nobody mentioned Tony Spilotro or Milwaukee Phil


Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?

Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: Toodoped] #655812
07/17/12 03:35 PM
07/17/12 03:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 840
BarrettM Offline
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BarrettM  Offline
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Do you think Milwaukee Phil was tougher than Chuckie Nicoletti? I always pictured him being a true sociopath but a lot of people say Phil takes the cake.

Last edited by BarrettM; 07/17/12 03:43 PM.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: VinnyGorgeous] #655813
07/17/12 03:51 PM
07/17/12 03:51 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
TonyG Offline
Capo
TonyG  Offline
Capo
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 498
Texas
The definition of tough guy from the Free Dictionary:

Noun 1. tough guy - someone who bullies weaker people

plug-ugly
bully, hooligan, roughneck, rowdy, ruffian, yob, yobbo, yobo, tough - a cruel and brutal fellow

Ted, Teddy boy - a tough youth of 1950's and 1960's wearing Edwardian style clothes

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/tough+guy


Best way to catch the smart ones? Get an idiot working for them.
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: ONTARIO613] #655819
07/17/12 04:13 PM
07/17/12 04:13 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,845
cheech Offline
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cheech  Offline
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Posts: 1,845
Originally Posted By: ONTARIO613
Originally Posted By: tt120
In no particular order ,

Carmine Persico - obvious one: spent half his childhood/teenage years in fights and shootouts, spent half his adult life in the can. been able to maintain control over the colombos through it all. plus if half the shit they say is true, him spitting out bullets and all that... well...

Nicky Corozzo - Went away on a pair of murders he (allegedly) had nothing to do with so a bunch of guys could stay out or cop to light plea deals. Plus since he's so short im guessing he could scrap in his younger years

Scarpa Sr. - mean son of a bitch, probably borderline psychopathic

Tony Frederici (sp) - dunno much about the guy but you dont get the nickname Tough Tony for nothin

Basciano - powerhouse on the street, been getting shitted on for the better half of a decade by the government/prison system. what hes been through would break or drive someone to suicide. and through it all he still looks like hes 35

I think the G-man had it in for anyone who was at The Infamous Bono Wedding and Basciano was the last on the list although I think he was there like Paulie was at the Corleane wedding 'Paulie More Wine!"






what is the infamous Bono wedding?


When Interpol?
Re: The toughest motherf***er [Re: cheech] #655827
07/17/12 04:58 PM
07/17/12 04:58 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
HairyKnuckles Offline
Underboss
HairyKnuckles  Offline
Underboss
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
Originally Posted By: cheech
Originally Posted By: ONTARIO613
Originally Posted By: tt120
In no particular order ,

Carmine Persico - obvious one: spent half his childhood/teenage years in fights and shootouts, spent half his adult life in the can. been able to maintain control over the colombos through it all. plus if half the shit they say is true, him spitting out bullets and all that... well...

Nicky Corozzo - Went away on a pair of murders he (allegedly) had nothing to do with so a bunch of guys could stay out or cop to light plea deals. Plus since he's so short im guessing he could scrap in his younger years

Scarpa Sr. - mean son of a bitch, probably borderline psychopathic

Tony Frederici (sp) - dunno much about the guy but you dont get the nickname Tough Tony for nothin

Basciano - powerhouse on the street, been getting shitted on for the better half of a decade by the government/prison system. what hes been through would break or drive someone to suicide. and through it all he still looks like hes 35

I think the G-man had it in for anyone who was at The Infamous Bono Wedding and Basciano was the last on the list although I think he was there like Paulie was at the Corleane wedding 'Paulie More Wine!"






what is the infamous Bono wedding?


I think Bono was a banker of some sort who was involved with the Sicilian faction of the Bonanno Family. At his wedding in New York in 1981, many Bonanno mobsters showed up. And they were all taking pictures. When the FBI and FBN started to investigate the Pizza Connection, they used these pictures to identify the players.
Salvatore Catalano, who was the top dog, was in Sicily at the time and didn´t attend the wedding. For a moment (without even knowing it I guess) he managed to escape under the radar. But in the end they were all caught anyway.
Basciano was there, Giaccone, Trinchera and many others who associated with the Sicilians were there. Bonventre, Amato, the Montreal crew...
The pictures connected them to eachother.

Last edited by HairyKnuckles; 07/17/12 05:03 PM.

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