Just ignore this guy Elmwood. His posts influence no one.

That was Fosco's opinion. Personally I don't think that's the motive. I can confirm that some sources say that during Al Capone's day people were asked to put their hand on a Bible and take an oath. Turns out the Bible belonged to Jim Colosimo and was passed on to Mike "the Greek" Potson and Capone never had it. When the FBI was investigating in the 1960s they found that Chicago did not have any initiation ceremony. When the ceremony was used it was during the period when Aiuppa was in charge. Why did Aiuppa start using the traditional ceremony? Possibly with the encouragement of the other Families, but that's just my guess. It had nothing to do with some sort of Sicilian revival since Accardo and Giancana were both born to Sicilian parents.

Could be. I don't know. I do know that I doubt many of these guys--cynical, ruthless, greedy, killers all--would care much for some corny Boy Scout style pledge of loyalty. In the long run.

The Chicago Crime Commission Report said in 1997 there were 70 made guys in the Outfit and 700 to 1,200 Associates. If the Outfit downsized 10 years 50% or more, then the Associates would still number AT LEAST 300 TO 500. How could the Made guys go down 50 to 60% and the associates go down 90%???? How is that possible??? if you want to quote Feds reports, then you can quote the one in 2007 and I'll quote the one in 1997 reducing everything at least 50%. No problem.

Do anyone have a full list of the 20-30 made guys and the outfit?

This is from a year or two ago, originally posted by Ivy, I believe. Of course, Frank Sr. is dead and maybe one or two others are too. I think Joe Culotta may be dead. Fat Mike Sarno and Chris Spina aren't listed either.

1. Joseph Andriacchi
2. Dominic Basso
3. Robert Bellavia
4. Frank Calabrese
5. Bruno Caruso
6. Frank Caruso
7. Leo Caruso
8. Marco D'Amico
9. John DiFronzo
10. Joseph DiFronzo
11. Peter M. DiFronzo
12. Salvatore DeLaurentis
13. Rudolph Fratto
14. Michael Gurgone
15. James Inendino
16. Joseph Frank LaMantia
17. Joseph Lombardo
18. Rocco Lombardo
19. Michael Magnifichi
20. James Marcello
21. Louis Marino
22. John Matassa
23. Salvatore Muserino
24. Albert Roverio
25. Michael Spano Sr.
26. John Eugene Spizzirri
27. Richard Allen Spizzirri
28. Michael C. Talarico

Calabrese is dead; Fratto, Lombardo and Marcello are in prison; Magnifichi is shelved

I've done extensive reading on the Family Secrets trial but have never seen any indication that Paul Schiro was a made guy. Then again, I've never seen any indication that he wasn't either.

Thank for list some name i know

Joe Calato is not dead

The Spizziri Brothers are not made. They are soldiers who used to make collections with my Uncle who is older than them in the Elmwood Park Crew. I've seen this list before but didn't pay much attention to it. If this is the big Feds list of 28 made guys, it is very imcomplete and a little inaccurate in a few instances. A lot of names are missing. Cautadello (Cicero), Dote (Elmwood Park), Spina, Mike Sarno and Rudy Fratto (I know they are in jail, but this list was done before they went to jail), and a lot of new men that were made in the last 5 years, plus several other men who are specialists that the Feds either don't know about or they think are Associates instead of made men. All the Specialists that are made participated in a murder years ago. I will not name them.

The 70 members was an estimate by the CCC. Not an exact count like the more recent FBI figures. And, if you subtract the Outfit members who have died since 1997, it matches up with the 28-30 members the FBI cited in 2007. As for associates, that's obviously going to be a much more flexible figure, as definitions of what makes an associate are going to differ. Considering the modern day Outfit's size in terms of core members, a little over 100 associates is much easier to believe than 700-1,200.



The list isn't from the feds. It was a list posted by a poster over on the RD forum. The guy was well researched on the Outfit and those names were the ones he had seen specifically listed as made members here or there.

Elmwood--Did your uncle also have Big Sean doing collections along with the Spizziri brothers? Are the Spizziri brothers still active?

That is if there weren't any new guys made within that time period.

I remember reading about this Sean character on ANP. Apparently he was a huge gorilla of a man; I think someone described him as an "ogre."

I tried to find a picture of him or what happened to him but never got very far.

Yes, but considering the Outfit is around 30 made members or so, it seems unlikely that new members have been made in large numbers since then.

That 28-30 number seems ridiculously low, considering the FBI report left off important guys like Sarno and Dote. You would have to be a fool to believe that report knowing what we know. Are they saying Sarno wasn't a member of the Outfit in 2007?

I attribute the bad report due to the decreased focus the FBI has had on the Outfit since the late 1990's. After the convictions of Carlisi and Infelice, not much has happened until the Family Secrets case. How many agents are currently investigating the Outfit? What is there to investigate other than video poker machines, gambling and some loansharking? There are hardly any murders and they lost the unions. Chicago will eventually go the way of the KC and Detroit families, where their income will come from bookmaking and lending money to degenerate gamlers along with a few other scams here and there.

That isn't the FBI's list. The FBI never released a list, just the figure.

That was a list someone came up with guessing.

Ivy, very well stated. The term Associate was used to mean many things. It was used to describe mainly 4 different kinds of Outfit connected men: 1) It was used to describe a full time man who worked under a made man in his sub crew. 2) It was used to describe high level Non Italian members. 3) it was used to describe Politicians or Judges who were controlled by the Outfit. 4) It was used to describe bookmakers or tavern owners who partnered with the Outfit either by choice or by force. I would describe it in these 4 ways: Note* I'm talking about the OLD POWERFUL OUFIT, not the current Outfit .


1) Guys who belonged to a crew and worked full time under a made man were called MEMBER/ASSOCIATES. (sometimes they were refered to as soldiers, but not always).

2) Men who were high level non Italian members were generally called HIGH LEVEL/ ASSOCIATES.

3) Politicians under the control of the Outfit were generally called CONNECTED/ASSOCIATES.

4) Men who were partnered with the Outfit on the street level as bookmakers or tavern owners were referred to as STREET/ASSOCIATES.

I agree with Ivy, that for reasons of semantics and simplicity, it is better to refer to all non made men in the Outfit as Associates. Then, you have to add a word in front of Associates to describe WHAT KIND OF ASSOCIATE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
Chicago, in the old days, always had a very large number of Associates. The actual number of made men was purposely kept on the lower side for 2 reasons. 1) Maximize the profit structure so each made man earned a lot of money. 2) Maximize the Security

The MEMBER/ASSOCIATES who belonged to the crew were the ones in line to move up and get made at some point. Their power began and ended under the man they worked for. They naturally interacted with the Boss of the Crew sometimes and it would be the Crew Boss who would ask the Top Bosses if his man could be promoted because he was loyal and would be a good earner/supervisor. The Top Boss of the Outfit always made the final call because this new man would not only be a partner with his Capo, but also with him. Occasionally if a guy started to undermine the made guy he worked for in hopes of moving up a little sooner, that was either the beginning of a death sentence or he would be blackballed and never move up like Elmwood's big mouth Uncle.