Not a pissing contest at all, just tell me one page in either book that backs up your claim, it will take you 2 minutes. Most informed members on hear know Vitale is the only source for that and I know I'm not the only one who would be interested in seeing your source. It will take you 2 minutes to find the page and post it as anyone who has actually read the books will know or you can claim " you don't want to get into a pissing contest" because you know there are no sources and you want to save face from stating your opinion as fact.