I have watched all three of these movies more than a few times, and yet there is one thing that I do not completely understand. What motivation does Roth have to kill Michael? I realize that he wants him out, but then why go into business with him in the first place? I apoligize of this is a stupid question, but I simply cannot seem to completely understand Roth's motivations. Thanks!

That's a good question. But Roth kind of telegraphs his punches a little in that famous "this is the business we've chosen" speech, when he reminds Michael that he set up Moe Green, his No. 1 protege, to be killed.

Sorry, it has to do with Michael moving into Hymans Roths empire and trying to take over. Having him as a partner is just not trying to go head to head with him over the same things. Better to have him as a partner then a rival. This way he can keep him close and take him out.

"Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer." After Roth fails to kill Michael in Nevada, Roth has to realize that Michael would suspect him so Roth figures the best way to have Mike let down his guard and at the same time put doubt in Michaels head of suspecting Roth, he'd make him a partner in his venture hoping that Mike would trust Roth and no longer suspect him of being behind the attempt on his life. This way Mike let's down his guard and trusts Roth, and then Roth could finally take Mike out. Boy did Roth underestimate Mike's witt. Mike knew it was Roth all along, so he played it out with Roth and made Roth think that he ( Mike ) trusted Roth. It was a game of chess between two great minds and although Mike did win out in the end by having Roth shot, Roth was not conned that easily by Mike either.


Don Cardi

Well, at least I do not feel quite so stupid any more. There is some confusion on the matter, it seems. But both seem quite valid. Thank you very much.

I think the Roth character sums up much of the theme from GFII: treachery & deception. I agree with the post stating that part of it was revenge for the killing of his friend Moe Green. But perhaps just as important was that Roth could see how Michael was taking over several casinos in Vegas. Roth was certainly smart enough to realize that he could never survive a fight with a mafia family with the depth of the Corleones. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. By creating that appearance, Roth was able to get close enough to Michael in an effort to have Michael let his guard down. When that happened, Roth thought that he could make a second attempt on Michael's life. So it made good business sense for Roth to join Michael. It also helped keep Roth protected.

If you've seen "Casino," the example of DeNiro's character, Sam Rothstein, can be viewed as a parallel to Hyman Roth. Both Rothstein & Roth were Jewish. They didn't want their profitable businesses shaken down by the mob. Instead of fighting the mob, they chose to become partners. I'm paraphrasing here, but during the narration of "Casino," Pesci's character said that keeping the mob boss happy with money was the best insurance policy that Sam Rothstein could ever buy.

yeah I have seen casino and you make a good connection mwith Roth and the other Jews from the movie Casino.

I always thought Don Rickles was miscast in Casino. After years of being "Mr Warmth", it was hard to see him as a hard nosed Casino operator. I always pee my pants, when he comes to DeNiros house carrying the rifle

Actually I thought that he was pretty convincing and acted well in the part where he goes nuts on the guy in the casino and cracks him with the phone!


Don Cardi

Im a gonna watch Pt2 tonight, but what is Roths official position?

I think Rickles was hit with a phone (by Pesci?), and it was Pesci who used a phone to hit the big cowboy who had his shoes off and his feet on the table.