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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Immobiliare]
#609507
08/01/11 11:56 AM
08/01/11 11:56 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 172
Immobiliare
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Anything Micheal says to Kay regarding the business must be taken with a pinch of salt surely?
What do you make of the look on Frank's brothers face when he walks in to the hearing? Could be construed as disbelief in seeing his brother turning traitor but to me looks more like fear, almost a glance of 'help me' towards Frank.
Last edited by Immobiliare; 08/01/11 11:57 AM.
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Sicilian Babe]
#609524
08/01/11 02:15 PM
08/01/11 02:15 PM
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,544 AZ
Turnbull
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,544
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The statement, "The honor of the family is intact,"indicates that Vincenzo's presence was meant to shame Frankie out of testifying for the government.
BUT: later, when Tom visits Frankie, he likens the old Corleone Family to the Romans and concludes: "... Unless they went home and uh, killed themselves -- then nothing happened. And their families -- their families were taken care of..." Tom replies: "Don't worry about a thing, Frankie Five Angels."
We can infer that Frankie had been threatened--either that his own family in the US would be harmed, or that Vincenzo and his family would be harmed, unless Frankie not only recanted, but killed himself. So, I think both views--honor and threat--apply.
Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu, E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu... E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Immobiliare]
#609611
08/02/11 09:52 AM
08/02/11 09:52 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 172
Immobiliare
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I'm finding it hard to disagree with Olivant.
I think the threat of doing harm to Pentangelli's family was definately there in an unspoken and subtle form.
I think Micheal would have been quite confident that Frank would co-operate once he see's his brother and he would not have to follow through with the threat he implied.
Last edited by Immobiliare; 08/02/11 09:56 AM.
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: dontommasino]
#609805
08/04/11 10:11 AM
08/04/11 10:11 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Immobiliare
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So was Pentangelli's brother kidnapped by the family in Italy? Or did he himself understand and accept the risks? Good question. Its believable that the Corleones wouldn't have had to resort to making the actual threat. They may have worded it so, on the surface, it appears that they required Vicenzo to come to the hearing hoping that his presence will lead to Frank feeling shamed and therfore cease in his treachery towards Micheal. However, I think Vicenzo would have known, as did Frank, what the repercussions would have been if Frank didn't suffer this bout of 'shame'. More of an unspoken threat as I'v mentioned before. One thing this thread had led to me question though is this: why didn't Frank anticipate that Micheal would target his family? Sure theres not a lot he could have done about it but he probably wouldn't have even got as far as the hearing and thus wouldn't have been forced to commit suicide.
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Immobiliare]
#609808
08/04/11 10:34 AM
08/04/11 10:34 AM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
Sonny_Black
Underboss
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Posts: 3,568
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So was Pentangelli's brother kidnapped by the family in Italy? Or did he himself understand and accept the risks? Good question. Its believable that the Corleones wouldn't have had to resort to making the actual threat. They may have worded it so, on the surface, it appears that they required Vicenzo to come to the hearing hoping that his presence will lead to Frank feeling shamed and therfore cease in his treachery towards Micheal. The threat was implied. But Vincenzo's facial expression and Frank's response clearly shows (at least to me) that it was all about their family's honor.
"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Sonny_Black]
#609817
08/04/11 11:08 AM
08/04/11 11:08 AM
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 172
Immobiliare
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So was Pentangelli's brother kidnapped by the family in Italy? Or did he himself understand and accept the risks? Good question. Its believable that the Corleones wouldn't have had to resort to making the actual threat. They may have worded it so, on the surface, it appears that they required Vicenzo to come to the hearing hoping that his presence will lead to Frank feeling shamed and therfore cease in his treachery towards Micheal. The threat was implied. But Vincenzo's facial expression and Frank's response clearly shows (at least to me) that it was all about their family's honor. I think the Corleones had two cards to play: The family honour card and the threat to Vicenzo card. The latter made it so the former was undoubtedly going to work, whilst at the same time saving face for everybody. Expertly played by Micheal.
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Re: Frank's brother
[Re: Immobiliare]
#609821
08/04/11 11:15 AM
08/04/11 11:15 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468 With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso
Consigliere to the Stars
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Consigliere to the Stars
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
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So was Pentangelli's brother kidnapped by the family in Italy? Or did he himself understand and accept the risks? Good question. Its believable that the Corleones wouldn't have had to resort to making the actual threat. They may have worded it so, on the surface, it appears that they required Vicenzo to come to the hearing hoping that his presence will lead to Frank feeling shamed and therfore cease in his treachery towards Micheal. The threat was implied. But Vincenzo's facial expression and Frank's response clearly shows (at least to me) that it was all about their family's honor. I think the Corleones had two cards to play: The family honour card and the threat to Vicenzo card. The latter made it so the former was undoubtedly going to work, whilst at the same time saving face for everybody. Expertly played by Micheal. In 'mafia-speak" there is a way to make Frankie's brother know he was needed in D.C. without the need for threats or kidnapping.
"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"
"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."
"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."
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