Thank You,Hollywood!
Homosexuality is wrong,wrong,wrong. The Bible says so. End of discussion.
Go ahead and waste your breath trying to get me to change my views. I am sticking firmly to what I believe in....what is right.

Does it really? Or is it between the lines? Do you know the chapter it is in?

You might be right, but I just don't know where it says that in the Bible. I don't know.

This was not intending to sound angry or sacrastic. I truly want to know.

Yes it is JJ. The First chapter in "Romans". Verses 26 - 28.

HH, the Bible tells me to have free will. To believe in what I want. I believe in what I want, I believe in God. I believe in him with all my respect, faith, and religion. But that doesn't mean I have to agree with every little thing he writes. He said we can have free will, and I believe I can have my OWN beliefs as well as follow that religion. I don't have to go by EVERYTHING in the Bible; and not have my own beliefs. I'm very firm when it comes to my beliefs, and I will have my own views. And my views relfect alot of what the Bible says, but also, I disagree with some of it.

Why do I respect homosexuals? Because they are people. They have done nothing wrong. I disagree homosexuality is wrong BECAUSE THEY CAN'T HELP IT. God says homosexuals are wrong, but HE creates them. They are human beings like you and I, and being homosexual doesn't harm anyone. That's why I respect them. They are human.

ShortCake, why do you think everyone's trying to change your mind? I don't give a damn if you belief it's wrong. I think you're wrong; doesn't mean I'm trying to change you're mind. Debates and discussions are about trying to show people their beliefs, and contradictions, and what's wrong, and right, and etc. Doesn't mean we're trying to change your views.

"The Bible says so! End of discussion." Haha, I love it.

People from every reilgion know that Jesus was alive. Jews believe he was simply a prophet that thought too much of himself.

^ HH.

I always though Jews believed he was a good prophet, just not the son of God, and that they always thought his apostles stole his body.

What does anyone do to make themselves respectable?. It's all in the eye of the beholder. If you believe in the bible go by what it says. If not. Burn it. To me there's almost nothing I adjudge wrong.So; I could be very well out of this debate.

What do homosexuals do that make them so disrespectable ? They fuck guys in the ass. They suck cock.. As long as it's not mine. I don't care. Uzotopoke does that too.. *[smiles]* ( I respect you Uz.) It's a specific preference that I disagree with; all jokes aside. However, fuck a book. A dead book. It won't make me treat anyone less respectful unless they fuck with me, but for the bigger picture..

If you weren't trapped inside your Christian views, what makes them wrong? They're not raping anyone. They're not raping you.. Anal sex, oral sex and premarrital sex are also "wrong" according to the bible.

ShortCake, read my post. I was not out-right insulting you at all, but you would do good to. Now.



Hagan, I am an atheist. I'm sure Jesus was a real person, but I don't believe in it all...or I try to see things outside which is what you don't do.

I know a word that starts with "i" which sums you up entirely...


It's what they don't do, Hagan. They get all this shit put on them, why? They rarely cause any harm. Simple as that. What is the problem? They are still human beings who have every right to live as any of us...so why say they are going to hell while they are simply living their life in which they are homosexuals...it is something they cannot repair, may not want to repair, and I'm sure they'd be fucking sick of people like you always spouting shit about them because of a book. No matter how holy or "good" the book is, to condemn homosexuals is to condemn thy neighbour. I'm sorry, I don't put people in religion down unless they decide to put down and harm others, which is what you're doing.

ShortCake, I don't give a shit if I change my opinion or not, but I still want you to read what we're saying! We have an opinion as well, and I'm reading through your shit, so read through mine. And please, answer me about your fornication before marriage with your boyfriend...or will you NEVER answer that? I'm not insulting you too badly, so read my fucking posts or am I now branded as a homosexual?

-Penguin

Definately. GuineaPig, I love you, man! You reflect my views, for the most part, full heartedly. The Bible, although I don't read it daily, I know enough about God's ways to get by. Doesn't mean I have to fucking slave over it. Also, yes, there is NOTHING wrong with homosexuals. I respect every human being who hasn't done any harm to anyone, or hasn't done anything disrespectful. Being homosexual is NOT disrespectful to ANYONE. It's their own business, and GOD made them that way. It is not their fault, so to shun them over something they have no control of is disgusting.

Anal sex, oral sex, and premarrital are also wrong according to the Bible. Yes, Guineapig, you are very correct. And, also, the Bible says that you should only have sex for reproduction, and not pleasure. Are you going to abide by that, ShortCake and HH? ShortCake, you say that homosexuality is wrong 'cause the Bible says so. "The Bible says so, end of discussion!" was your quote. Well, the Bible also says sex before marriage and sex for pleasure is wrong... But, you've openly admitted on the boards you do those. So, why? Since the Bible says it's wrong, and you go by whatever the Bible says? It says so, so end of discussion, right? Please explain. I'm intrigued. PLEASE, ShortCake. I would really like to know.

I only like to argue when I know I'm right. And what I have to say has nothing to do with being wrong or right. But you people are driving me crazy...

Lombardi, Anton, and others, you can think that homosexuality is ok, and that's fine. You have your own views. What do you care if someone goes around bashing homosexuality? You know that it will turn from a debate into a pointless arguement. They believe that homosexuality is wrong, and you believe it is ok. There is no point in arguing because you won't change each others minds. So what if SC2 can't make up her mind? So what if they're against homosexuality? So what if your for it? So what if they go by everything the Bible says? Let them...let them do what they want to do and let them believe what they want to believe. I know this started out as a debate, but now it has turned into a bitter argument.

And Anthony, I do believe you were being arrogant. For all you know OS could have gone to Catholic school. And you tell him to stop trying to act smart. I'm sorry, but I think that's arrogant.

I shouldn't have said anything at all, but it was driving me crazy. I don't want to argue, I don't want to fight, I just want to stop this arugement and bring it back to a healthy debate. There, I said it.

Me too. I feel secure enough in my own religious beliefs that I really don't feel the need to fight over what I think is right and wrong. Because ultimately, that will get, at least me, nowhere.

Politics, to me, is different than religion. I will only fight with someone if they themselves say anything bad about my religion. And that has happened before, but probably won't happen with that person again.

I can't begin to imagine what would happen if Mistersixer did not leave two months ago.

This isn't an argument, at all. We are debating. We aren't slinging names at each other. We are intelligently discussing a topic of choice. There's nothing wrong with that. We're not trying to change anyone's views, at all. We're just pointing out certain things that can be contradictionary, or wrong, or right, or etc. in each other's beliefs. I, for one, find nothing at all wrong with that. And HH, and GP, and Geoff, and Anton, and anyone else involved, don't SEEM to find anything wrong with it. So why not keep on debating? Most of us have strong, and intelligent, beliefs... So why not share them, and discuss them?

Believe I was arrogant? Okay. OS is ignorant, and to me, unintelligent. Everyone else here can back up what they're saying intelligently, except for him. He must exaggerate and/or use bad examples. Did you see HH's post? NOW THAT is what I call a debate. Although disrespectful towards homosexuals, it's for the most part, intelligent. OS acts stupid in most posts(in this thread, AND elsewhere) and if he can't change that, then I will point it out, and be what you call "arrogant" to him. I realize he's a good friend of your's, but you shouldn't get involved in something between me in him, with all due respect.

Thanks for the post.

P.S. Vercetti... Actually, I'm glad Sixer is gone, with his shit-filled insults. But, to tell the truth, the debates with him were amusing, entertaining, and for the most part, "fun."

Absolutely. Lombardi, you said it all.

I try not to revert into arguments, I am guilty of that, but for the most part I have been sticking without it. I'm enjoying the debate.

-Penguin

Everyone seems to be upset by my comment about **** . First, I think it is immoral and against the word of God. That should be enough for you guys, but I see that it isn't. I also believe that what they do is disgusting. You will jump on me for that, but it's true. If you saw some guy eating a piece of dogshit, would you respect him? Probably not. Getting buttfucked or sucking some guys cock is just as bad as far as I'm concerned.

Also, people are criticizing ShortCake because of her beliefs. Whatever your views on **** , this is wrong. Religious persecution is intolerable. Debate is fine, but laughing at her for her beliefs is wrong.

Guineapig, I'm not trapped in my beliefs. I could just as easily abandon my faith. With all of this evidence AGAINST a divine being, it would be easy for me to just say "fuck it, it's too hard to believe in God and follow his rules". I won't do that. This is a choice. I'm not trapped. And I think I answered your question above. I don't care if it is harmful or not. It's fucking gross.

AL, this is where the problem lies. I feel that **** do have a choice. I think that crock of shit about them being born gay is a lie. It is made up by **** because it is easier to accept that than the reality of it: they are perverts who like the same sex. Forget religion for a moment, it is just fucking wrong for one guy to suck another's dick. Why do we all buy that lie about being born gay? Pedophiles say they are born pedophiles too, but no one buys that. Well, is fucking a kid any worse than fucking a dude? I don't think so. Both of them will go to hell.

Anton, I was just asking a question. You don't have to get defensive. I do look at things from an unbiased perpective, except this. As far as I am concerned, Catholicism is right and fuck all of you who can't see it. It's your ass. You may have more fun for 100 years or so, but I am gearing more for the next infinite amount of years.

Guinea, you are right about the Jews and Jesus. I was just shortening it. They never thought he was the Son of God, hence my use of the term "thought too much of himself".

I thought it stopped being a debate when people stared saying fuck and ****. But that's just me. I like to stay away from arguements unless I know I am right about something, and I shouldn't have said anything here at all. I like Anthony, and I like you Anton, but I couldn't keep quiet. I had to say something, and what I said probably wasn't that intellegent, but I wanted to say something.

Hey I thought it was very intelligent.

Finally someone who can uphold a somewhat strong and intelligent debate. I applaud that, HH.

But, I do find what you're saying to be incorrect. You're right about something, though, fuck the religion shit right now. Let's get to the shit about homosexuals. And please, for the respect of the board, and people with their beliefs... Can you use the term gay or homosexual? "*** " is very disrespectful to those who have the beliefs that I have, which is why it's censored... And everyone else is able to do it. And I'm not disrespecting your beliefs, so you shouldn't to ours/mine. Thanks ahead of time, I appreciate it.

Homosexuality is not a choice, though, man. You can't just say... "Hey, I think I'm gonna go straight!" It's impossible. And if it wasn't... There would be tons of homosexuals turning heterosexual. I mean, there are homosexuals who hate being homosexual... Why don't they just turn heterosexual? Simple. They can't. And if you can't see that man, no offense, but that's pretty thick headed. I think fucking a man is disgusting just as much as the next guy... But, plenty of people do disgusting things. Doesn't mean they are bad people.

Also, that example about eating dogshit is really bad. You have control of what you eat. Homosexuals do not have control of what ther are. Weather you believe it or not, someone can't just say "I'm straight now." It's impossible, bro.

And, we're not laughing at ShortCake or anything like that. She's not making sense, so we're simply fucking confused and asking what she means. Because, she's NOT unintelligent. She seems like a smart girl... But, she's not showing it by what she's saying. I dunno, but I know I'M not laughing or picking on her. I'd just simply like her to explain herself, and make more sense.

Omar -- bad language is common. It's a habit of some people. We just commonly use it, doesn't mean we're fighting. Still discussing, man. And, by all means, don't keep quiet when you got something to say. Freedom of speech, man. Your opinion counts just as much as the next guy.

Off topic:

AL, what's that website for movie scripts? Help me out, man.

JJ- http://movie-page.com/movie_scripts.htm

It is a great site.

Omar got it right.

Thanks alot man
but dang, they don't have the movie I'm looking for..Field of Dreams

AL, again, you try to disprove my arguments by saying that **** don't choose thier lifestyle. This is exactly the opposite of what I believe. Because we will NEVER agree on this, I think I'm going to call it quits.

But I just want you to know that if you are to refute my points, you should do it using fact or at least a common belief that we share. I think **** do have a choice, and that is what makes them sick. They knowingly choose to get buttfucked.

The only way that I would excuse them from thier disgusting ways is if it was proven that gayness is a mental disorder. This would mean that they have no choice, but would also mean that they would have to recognize that thier lifestyle is wrong. Either way they are wrong. If they choose to get fucked up the hairy ass, that is undeniably sick. If they have no choice, they have a mental disorder, which means that they are wrong. A disorder can only be such if it does not follow society's norms.

I don't like homosexual sex either, Hagan, but to tell the truth, it's as simple as this: they are human beings and they deserve to be left alone because as long as they aren't harming anyone, then it's okay. The can go and buttfuck each other as much as they want, I don't give a damn, it's got nothing to do with me. They aren't harming anyone, just leave them alone. Why do they deserve to be put down like that?

And a note, it is worse to fuck a kid than to have gay sex with a guy. Paedophilia is the worse possible thing on this planet.

-Penguin

I guess you ignored my request not to use the word "*** ." Thanks alot. It's not like I'm sitting here disrespecting your beliefs, you don't have to do it to me.

But, the thing is... Can a homosexual just say "I think I'm gonna be straight." There are homosexuals, as I said, who HATE to be homosexual. Why can't they just stand up and change? I mean, even Family Honour said... They've proven, I think, that there is a gene that causes homosexuality.

You tell me to get proof/facts, and that I have none... Do you? Is it a proven fact that it is a choice? No. Maybe it isn't a proven fact that it isn't a choice; but there's a HELLUVA lot more evidence. You can't JUST STOP. Can YOU, HH, go homosexual? For one second, can you just find men attractive, be attracted to them, want to love them, etc.? Can you? No. And you can say you are and that you could; but, really, you can't. Which is my point, you can't just change it.

I realize we'll never agree on it, but seriously... There's way more evidence that's it's not a choice. What's your's? Are you homosexual? No. So how do you know you can just change it? You don't even like homosexuals. So, you must not have any homosexual friends. And if you do, you've said they're disgusting, so you must not get along with them all that well. I DO have homosexual friends, and I DO get along with them very well because I respect them, which you don't, so I think I have more of a perspective from them than you.

Let me ask you a question. If you had a friend for a LONG time, who never had a girlfriend... But you didn't think much of it. What if he came out of the closet? Would you hate him because he's homosexual?

I have to go, now. When I come back, I'll look for your answer. It's been interesting thus far... Let's see if we can continue this without getting harsh.

This is directed to Hollywood ONLY - since it is his viewpoint only that I am curious about right now...

You have made your views on male on male sex crystal clear. Do you feel the same way about woman on woman?

As a self proclaimed "horndog" - do you feel as passionate about female gayness? Alot of men seem to invoke their double standard rules on this one - buttfucking involving 2 guys is sick but they will sit around and watch women go at it all day. Is it the same morally?

I have no desire to debate you - just curious about how you feel about it....

I think you're both talking about different things. AL is right that gay people didn't choose to be gay. But HH, I think, is trying to say that they do choose to *act* upon it.

According to HH, I guess, it's better for a gay person to live a hetero life (even though it's not fulfilling or 'right' for that person). Or, live their lives alone.

A homosexual cannot love a person of the opposite sex the same way as heteros do. I'm talking true love, passion, lust, etc. (Bi's can though, hence the term).

I suppose it's their "choice" to deny their own feelings and live a secluded, lonely life like HH would like them to. But it's not their choice to have those uncontrollable feelings to begin with.

Some people find it disgusting, that's fine. But it's also judgemental and unfair to those who find hetero sex disgusting.

If people would accept others differences, then this wouldn't even be debatable.

I'm think I'm done w/ this topic now - as it's going no where...

Lust is not true love. It is sexual craving or loving one's body etc. Lust is an example of Vulgar Love, not True Love.

I never said it was. I said "etc", which means "things like these"...

Oh, sorry, I thought you were relating them as in being the same thing.

Shit sure gets deep around here some days...