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Moe's Big Mouth
#585297
11/09/10 12:27 AM
11/09/10 12:27 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 102 New York
Louren_Lampone
OP
Made Member
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OP
Made Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 102
New York
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Moe Greene really said a mouthful to Michael Corleone at that Vegas meeting: 1. admitted to slapping his brother around, 2. saying he could talk to Barzini and still keep the hotel 3. insulting Michael as a baby
So, was Moe Greene considered a dead man regardless? OR...had he NOT shot off his mouth, and tried to politic a deal, do you think he could have survived?
"Now, that plane goes to Miami." "That's right. That's where I want it met."
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: Sonny_Black]
#585347
11/09/10 01:17 PM
11/09/10 01:17 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466 Stewartstown, PA
VitoC
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466
Stewartstown, PA
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And he ofcourse already aligned himself with Barzini. Exactly. Vito told Michael that he would be invited to a meeting and then killed. Because Moe told Michael "I tocked to Barzini. I can make the deal with him, and still keep my hotel!", Michael had reason to consider Moe part of the plot to kill him and to view him as a mortal threat. Remember that Moe, like his real life counterpart Bugsy Siegel, was himself a gangster--to Michael he said: "I made my bones when you were going out with cheerleaders." This is why Hyman Roth's speech in Part II, where he discusses Moe's death and displays obvious anger toward Michael for having caused it, rings rather hollow to me. If Moe's and Michael's positions had been reversed, Moe would have had Michael killed--and so would Roth in the same situation. Michael may not have been justified in killing Moe in the eyes of the law, but he certainly was by the accepted standards of the world these people lived in. Moe was certainly not some innocent victim.
Last edited by VitoC; 11/09/10 01:27 PM.
Let me tell ya somethin my kraut mick friend!
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: getthesenets]
#585362
11/09/10 03:29 PM
11/09/10 03:29 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,024 Texas
olivant
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![](/ubb/5stars10k.gif)
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,024
Texas
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Haven't read the novel in a while but if Moe got hit in Vegas, wouldn't that have violated the no violence rule regarding Las Vegas.
Was he hit in Los Angeles or Vegas?
==========================
He was hit in Hollywood. With Moe dead, his ownership would pass to who ever was strong enough totake it, front man or not.
Last edited by olivant; 11/09/10 03:31 PM.
"Generosity. That was my first mistake." "Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us." "Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: BarrettM]
#585368
11/09/10 03:40 PM
11/09/10 03:40 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466 Stewartstown, PA
VitoC
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 466
Stewartstown, PA
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And what reason does Moe have to be part of the plot? Because of Michael's interest in the casino--remember Moe said the if he dealt with Barzini he wouldn't have to give up the hotel.
Let me tell ya somethin my kraut mick friend!
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: dontomasso]
#585393
11/09/10 07:26 PM
11/09/10 07:26 PM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
Sonny_Black
Underboss
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Underboss![](/ubb/3stars.gif)
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,568
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Interesting that Moe gave away Barzini as the power in New York when Barzini was trying to trick the Corleones into thinking it was Tatt. I think Barzini only tricked the Corleones before the meeting of the families. After the meeting, it was clear to everyone that Barzini was the new top dog and I don't think he would still pretend otherwise. Tessio even mentioned that Barzini's men were taking over his turf which meant that Barzini wasn't secretly moving against them anymore. By then, it were the Corleones themselves who were pretending to be weak. Michael denied Tessio and Clemenza to recruit more men so that Barzini and Tattaglia would think Michael would no longer be a threat, which was exactly what Michael wanted so he could carry out his plan by eliminating them.
"It was between the brothers Kay -- I had nothing to do with it."
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: olivant]
#587487
12/07/10 06:01 PM
12/07/10 06:01 PM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 246 NY
Buttmunker
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 246
NY
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Funny how similar the Moe Greene/Ben Siegel comparisons are: 01: both jewish names 02: both killed outside of Vegas 03: both shot in the eye They sure weren't discreet ![wink wink](/threads/images/graemlins/classic/wink.gif)
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: Louren_Lampone]
#588271
12/14/10 11:43 PM
12/14/10 11:43 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132 Ohio
Lorenzo
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132
Ohio
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I believed in a lot that he said but he said it to the wrong person at the wrong time.
It is better to beg for forgivness than ask for permission.
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: getthesenets]
#588272
12/14/10 11:44 PM
12/14/10 11:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132 Ohio
Lorenzo
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132
Ohio
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He was screwed either which way he went.
It is better to beg for forgivness than ask for permission.
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: Sonny_Black]
#588273
12/14/10 11:45 PM
12/14/10 11:45 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132 Ohio
Lorenzo
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132
Ohio
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Barzini, or being associated with him was the end for Moe.
It is better to beg for forgivness than ask for permission.
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: Turnbull]
#588274
12/14/10 11:46 PM
12/14/10 11:46 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132 Ohio
Lorenzo
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132
Ohio
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Moe should have played his card out a little more objectivly and seen what happened before he went off the deep end.
It is better to beg for forgivness than ask for permission.
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: VitoC]
#588275
12/14/10 11:48 PM
12/14/10 11:48 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132 Ohio
Lorenzo
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 132
Ohio
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Michael definatly saw this as an insult and that was not good for Moe. Plus he slapped Fredo around.
It is better to beg for forgivness than ask for permission.
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Re: Moe's Big Mouth
[Re: Lorenzo]
#588276
12/15/10 12:04 AM
12/15/10 12:04 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 20 NY (upstate)
Kuklinski
Wiseguy
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Wiseguy
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 20
NY (upstate)
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Moe thought he was untouchable because he invented Las Vegas. As spin off of Bugsy obviously.
You have to understand, that men like this, are kings of their domains. They dont see a threat the way you and I might. They only see potential threats as obstacles, while they reign as goads on Earth. That is the life.
And that is why is it difficult for a civilian to understand or to associate with men of this stature. They hold court like the kings of old, where a slip of a word, a wrong gesture, spells life and death.
“I never lie because I don't fear anyone. You only lie when you're afraid.” ~John Gotti
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