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The end of Micheal #410788
07/05/07 08:34 AM
07/05/07 08:34 AM
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wtwt5237 Offline OP
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Today I rewatched GF III. Found the last few minutes of the movie so touching. Michea is supposed to die in some patch in Sicily. This scene left me wandering. Why did he decide to stay here ,lonely, a place so old. Maybe Sicily is the place where he lost his two deeply beloving women. He decided to stay near. But what happened to the others? Vincent, probably returned to America to start out as Vito and Micheal did decades ago. Connie maybe stayed with Micheal, taking care of him, because in America she had no husband, no sibling. As for Kay, would probably leave Sicily and stay in her parents' house. Micheal died so lonely and pitifully, leaving all the stories of his life behind. An era was gone, a great man is gone and the legend that will never be repeated again is gone.


One has only one destiny, he cannot choose it.
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: wtwt5237] #410790
07/05/07 08:56 AM
07/05/07 08:56 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
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A few months back our esteemed friend Turnbull made an outstanding post about Micheal which I think will give you some excellent insight into the character of Michael :

 Originally Posted By: Turnbull
Yes, there’s a ton of tragedy in his life—all self-inflicted. He had free choice at every turn, and he freely chose the Mob life, with disastrous results. Here are four major examples that I’d like your opinions on:

First: He was right to think Sollozzo would try to kill his father after the failed hospital attempt. He was wrong to believe that only he could save his father, by killing Sollozzo and McCluskey. Ironically, an idea that Michael himself had suggested could have been modified to solve the problem bloodlessly. The Corleones could have fed the newspapermen on their payroll the story about McCluskey being a dishonest cop mixed up in drugs and murder before, not after, the trigger was pulled. McCluskey was on the take all his life, and the Corleones had all the details because they paid him. The newspapers would have given that story such headlines that the Police Commissioner would have been shamed into providing Vito with an army to protect him, to save further embarrassment. McCluskey and Sollozzo would have been neutralized without any bloodshed. At minimum, McCluskey would have been transferred or suspended pending investigation; with pressure from the Corleone judges, he’d have been indicted for taking bribes. Sollozzo would have been arrested and probably deported as an undesirable alien. With McCluskey alive, the cops would have had no reason to crack down on all Mob activities. There would have been no Five Families War of 1946, leaving it a contest between the Corleones and the Tattaglias—and as we know, Tattaglia was a pimp, alone he could never have outfought Santino. Michael could have married Kay and gone back to college (and we would have had no Godfather Trilogy!).
Instead, Michael chose to kill Sollozzo and McCluskey, setting in motion his abandonment of Kay, his Sicilian exile, the Five Families War, Carlo’s betrayal, Sonny’s murder, Apollonia’s murder.

Second: He could have resumed the legitimate life after returning from Sicily. He could have said to Vito: “Pop, I was wrong to distance myself from you. But I atoned: I saved your life. And I paid a heavy price: two murders, abandoned my beloved fiancée, lost months out of my life in Sicily, lost my beloved bride to a bomb intended for me. We’re quits. Now you run the family…Oh, not feeling well enough to take the reins? Fredo not equal to the task? Sorry, Pop, that’s not my problem. Besides, you always said you didn’t want this for me—you wanted me to be a pezzanovante. Well, I can’t be Senator Corleone or Governor Corleone if I’m Don Corleone. Bye-bye.”
Instead, Michael chooses to become the Don, setting in motion Tessio’s betrayal, the Great Massacre of 1955, Connie’s widowhood and breakdown, and the beginning of Kay’s disillusionment with him.

Third: After moving to Tahoe, Michael could have retired behind the walls of his compound and invested his wealth legitimately—even putting money up-front in the legal casinos of Nevada.
Instead, he chose to hide his ownership or controlling interest in three hotels; muscle Klingman out of his interest in a fourth hotel; dominate the New York mob scene through Frankie Pentangeli; undercut Pentangeli through his support of the Rosato Brothers and their drug-dealing; stake Fredo to ownership of a brothel, and plan for a huge international expansion of his gambling empire through his deal with Roth. Results: Fredo’s betrayal; the machinegun attack that nearly killed Kay in her bed and scared the bejesus out of his kids; Kay’s estrangement, abortion and divorce; Anthony’s estrangement; Fredo’s murder (and a host of other killings).

Fourth: he was “legitimate” in GFIII—but was he? He whines, “Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in.” But he was never out. He either was still a member of the Commission or influential enough to keep Zasa from rising (so Vincent tells us). He laundered his Mob cronies’ money through his “legitimate” businesses (maybe through his foundations) and cut Zasa out of his share. Result: the machinegun attack in Atlantic City that killed all his pals and precipitated his diabetic stroke. It wasn’t enough that he became a Papal Knight: he had to dominate International Immobiliare by bribing crooked-as-a-corkscrew Archbishop Gilday, setting in motion Altobello’s betrayal and putting him against Don Lucchese, who was far more powerful in Europe. And, in an act of supreme irresponsibility and egotism: told that Sicily’s top assassin—“a man who never fails”—has targeted him, Michael gathers his entire family around him in Sicily, making them all sitting ducks. Surprise, surprise: his beloved Mary gets killed and his budding reconciliation with Kay is nipped in the bud, leading to his own, lonely death, attended by a little dog.

Michael succeeded--in turning everything he touched into death, including his own.



Turnbull, I hope that you don't mind that I took the liberty to quote the above post that you made a few months back.



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: The end of Micheal [Re: Don Cardi] #410800
07/05/07 09:51 AM
07/05/07 09:51 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
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With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
That is a terrific and spot on post by TB, and thanks DC for bringing it back. Someone said that we are nothing more than the sum of our choices, and no one proves that to be true more than Michael Corleone.

While TB paints this picture with a broad brush there are other things that make Michael tick which show us how totally reprehensible he really is. Look, for instance on how he closesw the door on Kay for the "crime" of wanting to visit the children he has kept from her out of pure spite. Look at the way he treats Tom. He often makes trouble when he doesnt have to. Take Senator Geary. When Geary threatens him Michael's response is to murder a prositiute (who he saw as collateral damage) and blackmail Geary. Couldn't he have used all his money and influence to expose Geary some other way? I believe he could have.

And does he have to murder his brother? Like Hagen said. "Mike you've won do you have to wipe everybody out?" Obviously he did.


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: dontomasso] #410804
07/05/07 10:06 AM
07/05/07 10:06 AM
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Texas
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olivant Offline
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Of course, Vito was not that much different. But Vito packaged himself in a way that seemed to take the edge off of his horrendous crimes for many people. The fact alone that Vito would make his sons accomplices to his crimes is enough for me.

So, Michael dies alone and unloved in a foreign land. The contrast with Vito's death cannot be more graphic. But it was all an illusion.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: dontomasso] #410805
07/05/07 10:06 AM
07/05/07 10:06 AM
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New Market, MD
DeathByClotheshanger Offline
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Back to the original post, I think Michael died alone in Sicily because he either pushed everyone away from him, having learned his lesson, or everyone else pushed him away, having learned their lesson. Either way, Michael was alone in every meaning of the word.

Kay probably never recovered from Mary's death and never wanted to see Mike again. Connie probably saw what she was becoming and swore off the life and Vincent, too young and selfish to see what this life could do went back to NYC and was eventually killed when he got into the drug game.

But who knows. Maybe after Mary's death Vincent did what Turnbull is alluding to and got out of that life -- made the decision that Mike had several chances to make. But we'll probably never know.

What we do know is Mike was alone. After Mary's death he probably shut down completely. It looks like he even went blind.

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: DeathByClotheshanger] #410831
07/05/07 11:53 AM
07/05/07 11:53 AM
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Pittsburgh, PA
The Last Woltz Offline
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 Originally Posted By: DeathByClotheshanger
What we do know is Mike was alone. After Mary's death he probably shut down completely. It looks like he even went blind.


Blindness, through retinal damage, can be a consequence of diabetes. But it is easily avoided through medical attention and is almost unheard of in countries where doctors are available.

If Michael is blind, that's a clue that he may have shut down to the point that he stopped treating his diabetes. Untreated diabetes also leads to cardiovascular disease, which was probably a major factor in his death.

Perhaps the end of Michael was self-inflicted, over a period of years.


"A man in my position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous!"
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: The Last Woltz] #410834
07/05/07 12:19 PM
07/05/07 12:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline
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With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
So what happened to Anthony's opera career?


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: dontomasso] #410842
07/05/07 12:37 PM
07/05/07 12:37 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,624
AZ
Turnbull Offline
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If I were Anthony, after that feeble performance in "Cavalleria Rusticana," I'd go back to law school. "Father knows best." He ain't no Jussi Bjoerling. \:p


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: The Last Woltz] #410845
07/05/07 12:50 PM
07/05/07 12:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,029
Texas
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olivant Offline
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 Originally Posted By: The Last Woltz
 Originally Posted By: DeathByClotheshanger
What we do know is Mike was alone. After Mary's death he probably shut down completely. It looks like he even went blind.


Blindness, through retinal damage, can be a consequence of diabetes. But it is easily avoided through medical attention and is almost unheard of in countries where doctors are available.

If Michael is blind, that's a clue that he may have shut down to the point that he stopped treating his diabetes. Untreated diabetes also leads to cardiovascular disease, which was probably a major factor in his death.

Perhaps the end of Michael was self-inflicted, over a period of years.


Mike's self-admonishment was probably monumental after Mary's death. The silent scream is evidence of that. Yes, he may have simply lost his will to live and the illness took over.

Last edited by olivant; 07/05/07 12:50 PM.

"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: olivant] #411427
07/06/07 09:32 PM
07/06/07 09:32 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 20
Margaritaville
Tish Offline
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Tish  Offline
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Margaritaville
I've always liked that the family came full circle, I guess. Vito was alone so he left Sicily seeking a new life and then Michael sat there, in Sicily, alone, quietly waiting for death, perhaps even willing it to come. And who could blame him for that?? Don or not, he was still raised Catholic. His guilt ate him alive.


Leave the gun...take the cannoli.
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: Tish] #412311
07/08/07 10:54 AM
07/08/07 10:54 AM
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wtwt5237 Offline OP
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Thinking about whether Vinnie and the others would come back and visit his tomb? Vito and Micheal had so much relationship with Sicily while Vinnie did not. It would be sadder should Corleone forget the old Sicily.


One has only one destiny, he cannot choose it.
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: wtwt5237] #415285
07/14/07 11:13 PM
07/14/07 11:13 PM
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DarthPipes Offline
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I'm pretty sure once Mary was killed, Kay and Anthony wanted nothing to do with him. This crushed Michael but he probably understood why. I guess he stayed in Sicily because he always liked it and because there was nothing left for him in America. Or Sicily too for that matter.

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: Don Cardi] #416412
07/16/07 11:42 PM
07/16/07 11:42 PM
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Darkshowers Offline
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Turnbull brings up some good observations and points. However, I disagree with many of them. It's easy to look back now and say whether Michael should have done this or should have done. He did what he thought was best at the time and from we can tell from all the mob movies and even real life mobsters, life in the mafia rarely ends happily. Now to address his 4 points.

Response to First: I don't think the cops would have been shamed into protecting Vito. They would probably rather throw McCluskey out of the police force and label him as a corrupt cop then use their manpower to protect Vito. Furthermore, simply protecting Vito doesn't solve the problem of Sollozzo who would keep on trying to kill Vito. Maybe he would try to bribe another cop into doing it or poisoning Vito through a nurse or numerous plots. As the Godfather book states, all Sollozzo needed to do was take out Vito and the Corleone family would have to go his way. If the Corleone family doesn't try to retaliate against Sollozzo and simply tries to protect Vito, they are made to look foolish and weak. Eventually, Sollozzo would have killed Vito. Also, the Tattaglias and Corleones would have eventually fought if not over the drug issue, then something else. As Clemenza said in the movie, mob wars are inevitable and happen every 10 years or so.

Response to Second: Wow, so you want Fredo to become Don and Michael to go legitimate?? Guess what would have happened? The Corleone Family would have been picked apart and destroyed by its enemies as Fredo is not nearly as smart and ruthless to take control of the family. I'm not even sure Michael would have been safe if he tried to become legitimate. As Vincent said, Michael had to take control to save the Family, which he did at the cost of his own happiness and dreams.

Response to Third: I think many of the events set in motion in the Godfather Part II can be attributed to Fredo and not Michael. Fredo's betrayal allowed for Michael almost become a target of a hit. You see that after the hit is when Michael goes away and tries to find out who the traitor in his family is setting in motion what happens in the rest of the movie. It is my belief that Fredo would have eventually betrayed the Family if he didn't go with Roth as he took sides with Moe Greene in the first movie and Michael said "don't ever side against the Family again" or something like that. Fredo is stupid and wanted power and respect for himself and he would have taken any opportunity to accomplish this. As we see though, he let himself get played by Roth and Oala so he jeopardizes the entire family.

Although it is a tough decision, I think Michael had to order the execution of his brother Fredo although he broke his heart. Fredo has proven to be stupid and his actions almost got Michael killed and the entire Corleone Family ruined. Fredo may have jeopardized the entire family a few years later if Michael didn't do something about it. Again, Michael had to think of saving his family.

Response to Fourth: By this point, although Michael tries to become legit, it is really difficult. He has made too many enemies. He tries to cut ties with the Commission and he is close to doing so but Zasa and Lucchese drag him back. And also, I don't get this last part about Michael gathering his family. So Michael is not supposed to have any family gatherings for the rest of his life because an assassin is after him?? Obviously he trusted Vincent to provide enough security but that didn't work out. I guess I can see your point here though. Perhaps Michael could have gone into hiding until the assassin was killed or everything resolved but then again, who would know if another assassin is sent to try to kill Michael again? Would he really have to hide for the rest of his life?

Although Michael ended up pushing most of his family away, I think he did as best as he could to protect the Corleone Family. He was as Connie said, strong for the Family and sacrificed his own happiness and dreams to keep the Corleone Family in power.

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: DarthPipes] #416814
07/18/07 01:14 AM
07/18/07 01:14 AM
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lildago66 Offline
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As I see it, Michael tried all his life tryin to protect his closest family members and when his favorite child MARY was gunned down in front of him that is when he died himself internally. He gave up and went back to Sicily to die an old man and all alone. BUT how do we know the fate of Connie or Vincent. That could've been a part IV where VIncent took over the reins or maybe not. By the way, did anyone ever notice where was Connie's children? Im still tryin to find out the name of the song that played right when MARY was shot and Michael was screaming outloud in shock. Im tryin to download a soundtrack and cant find that one song.

Re: The end of Micheal [Re: lildago66] #416861
07/18/07 05:15 AM
07/18/07 05:15 AM
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wtwt5237 Offline OP
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After that scene, the names of the songs that appear in Part III will come up onto the screen along with director, actors and etc. Check it.


One has only one destiny, he cannot choose it.
Re: The end of Micheal [Re: wtwt5237] #417084
07/18/07 04:50 PM
07/18/07 04:50 PM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 831
New Market, MD
DeathByClotheshanger Offline
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I'll give it to you easy... it's the Intermezzo from Cavalleria Rusticana, the opera that Anthony was in at the end of Part III.


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