What a pass Mike got with his confession. After 30 years all he had to confess was just his cheating on his wife and his involments in murders, and his confessor simply said "go and sin no more"!

I'll assume you were watching GFIII on AMC?

That's just the Catholic Church for you. I'm not going to go bashing Catholicism (as I have in the past, but I've done it with many religions), but it's the way it works. Sin, sin, sin, confess, repent. The problem is, many people don't repent and that's what makes them a good/bad Catholic.

Michael's confession and breakdown was a manufactured, fabricated moment just like so many others in GFIII.

While as always Pacino's acting was wonderful...it was nothing more than a patronizing nod to those in the GF audience who couldn't find justification in the killing of Fredo. And even to those who could...it was another patronizing indication that Michael was supposed to feel guilty about it.

Too bad they didn't take it in another direction...like explaining exactly the damage Fredo did.

Apple

Lets just say Im trying to watch GFIII on AMC, the more I watch, the more I don't like it. It was not my intention to bash the Catholic Church either. As a Catholic myself, I was trying to point out how unrealistic that confession scene was. After 30 years Mike had more then the murders and cheating to confess. If nothing else he was excommunicated for missing his Easter Duty! Of course anyone that give 100 million to the Church deserves a free ride.

How well would you say, GFIII represents the Catholic Church?

Worse then the current priest scandals!

Thanks an fascinating idea, Apple. You always hear about Michael's guilt, but never about the "bad blood" that Fredo caused. It would have been an interesting role to take on in part 3. It may have even added on to the quality of the movie.

Maybe you are just kidding, but just in case you are not, what's worse than murders and cheating?


of course you miss the inner meaning of the catholic confession. The priest is just a means. It's God who forgives you. And you cannot make a fool out of God.

what should his confessor have done? Crucify him? "Go and sin no more" are Christ's words.

I had 12 years of Catholic Education and I am fully aware of the meaning and intricacies of the Catholic confession. Michael made was is known as a general confession, and as such, the standard procedure is for the the priest, acting as God, to go through the 10 Commandments, and not just hear what the penitent considers important.

I can't imagine any priest after hearing that a penitent, has killed and ordered to have men killed, would have acted as that priest did.

AFAIK (and, trust me, I had a Catholic education too) in a Catholic confession, a priest basically listens to you. He may help you remebering/confessing your sins. But you, the penitent, know very well what is to be considered important and what is not. Micheal did know too well it was murders and cheating. In my experience I never had to go through the 10 Commandments as in a questionnaire or in a courtroom. That would be sooooooooooo horrible. It's the Spirit that counts. And if Michael sincerely repented, he certainly was forgiven. God always forgives us, if we repent. No matter what our sins are. He forgives us because He loves us and wants us to be safe.

OMG, it's called love. Love in God's name. I wonder what kind of priests you came across!!!!

Do you remember?
"And forgive us our trespasses,
as we forgive those who trespass against us."

How do you know? Didn't you recently post that you haven't and probably will never watch GFIII?


Personally, for me, I thoroughly enjoyed that part of the plot. His seeking forgiveness and being over ridden with guilt for ordering the death of his own brother.

While giving his confession, you can see that he still cannot find it within himself to forgive himself for what he did to Fredo. Even if God and the church were willing to forgive him. And Cardinal Lamberto recognized this fact during Michael's confession to him.

Regardless of if you like GFIII or not, or if you've even watched it , it does manage to bring Michael's character full circle.


Don Cardi

I saw that scene.

I've also watched various other scenes while switching back & forth from other channels...such as the opening party, gnoochi rolling, Michael's stroke, Connie giving the insulin injection shortly after the confession and pretending she still thought Fredo had drowned, Michael and Anthony trying to talk Mary out of the affair with Vincent, Michael proudly talking to Hagen's son the priest...and a few others. Catching these particular moments was all a matter of chance, depending on when I'd happen to switch channels.

I've always been honest about having seen bits & pieces of the film, but never having the patience to sit and watch it straight through.

And probably never will.

Apple

same here. To me, this is probably the best part of the movie and yes, it brings Michael's character full circle. Maybe Michael's repentment and confession is the "let's do it politically correct" kind of thing, but that's precisely why I like it. I don't want to think Michael dying alone and dammned for eternity to boot.

Over the years, I have had any discussions with people such as yourself, and unanimously, they go on, stuck in their viewpoints, and not able to grasp the concept of what someone, that differs from them, is trying to say. In the confessional the priest is taking the place of Christ and has the power to forgive sin. This power was given to the first priests, the Apostles,In John 20, 22, 23, we read: "Jesus breathed on the apostles and said: Receive ye the Holy Ghost; whose sins ye shall forgive, they are forgiven them, and whose sins ye shall retain, they are retained." And again Jesus said to his apostles : "To me is given all power in heaven and on earth, as my Father hath sent me, so I also send you." John 20, 21. Jesus was sent to forgive sins, and he sent the apostles to forgive sins.

With this power, there is no way a priest would allow someone such Mike, who hasn't confessed in 30 years, get away with such a short confession and apparently no penance. A priest at the very least will review the 10 Commandments to make sure the penititent, as least realizes his sins, and to make him aware of what he has to do, to be reinstated back in the church.

Has nothing to do with Confession.

I would agree that the confession is one of the more poignant scenes in the film, my point is merely that it wasn't an accurate portrayal of a Catholic Confession. I would have expected more attention to detail from FFC, such as the Baptismal scene in GFI

I think many fallen away Catholics would love to run into the priest that Mike had for confession! After being away for 30 years or more, all the priests wants to hear is what the penitent considers important, then gives him a quick pass to heaven.

As a born & raised Catholic myself...this may be at least part of the reason I was so disgusted by the scene.

If I recall, it was also an unplanned, almost off-the-cuff confession drawn out of Michael in large part from the Cardinal's encouragement. A bit of sobbing and all's forgiven.

Completely staged...and while I agree GFIII does bring Michael's character full circle, it accomplishes this in a completely unbelievable way.

Apple

The confession scene was especially poignant because the whole theme of GFIII is Michael trying to redeem himself. He wants outof the mob and into legitimate business, he wants to reconcile with Kay and his children (or at least end the estrngement) and he wants to go into his old age peacefully.

BTW the the coinfession scene the priest does a lot more than say go and sin no more. He admoinishes Michael and he says "Your sins are terrible" and he says that Michael can yet be redeemed, but that he probably won't be becuase he (Michael doesnt really have any faith.

All of this ties in nicely with the price Michael pays for redemption -- the death of his daughter.

For all the trashing of GF III this symbolism alone makes the film worthwhile.

I think we simply have a different opinion (and possibly a different experience) about what a Catholic confession is. You have been taught it is more a procedure to follow than a love act. I've been taught differently. That's all. But please, don't assume you know me ("people such as yourself") because you don't.

Well said Don T. As you've correctly pointed out, he said :

"Your sins are terrible, and it is just that you suffer. Your life, could be redeemed, but I know that you don't believe that. You will not change."

So while he prayed for Michael and resolved him, he also aknowledged that Michael's sins were horrible ones, and that he deserved to suffer as he did. I believe that the Cardinal felt that Micahel was sincere in his seeking forgiveness from God but also knew that even though Michael was sincere in seeking God's forgiveness, he still could not forgive himself no matter what.


Don Cardi

The Catholic confession is a process. In truth, the first step is for one to thoroughly examine their own conscience before going to confession. One has to sincerely be sorry for their sins and be totally sincere in seeking forgiveness from God for those sins. And when confessing those sins, the sinner should be humble while standing before God and should be seeking the guidance of God to know the difference between right and wrong. The Priest, or in this case the Cardinal, is a mere vessel - an intercessor between the sinner and God, and truthfully cannot know the sinners heart as only God can see the true heart of the sinner. So the intercessor is only the mediary and in reality does not, himself, resolve the sinner of his or her's sins. They are simply passing the forgiveness granted by God, to the sinner.


Don Cardi

Thank you being so brief, concise and to the point. You did a much better job of explaining then I did.

Excellent observation, and I agree. I just felt that the only thing the priest (Cardinal) could say was "Your sins are terrible"! Plus the fact it is the job of a priest to help a person gain salvation, not just "hear" a confession!

The only difference is that I am only saying that the scene wasn't that realistic or accurate from a religious viewpoint. You on the other hand just want to debate the theological procedures of confession.

No I don't know you personally, but I know people like you, who, whenever religion is mentioned, immediately break out their Bibles. If you notice I took mine out first, so fire away with your thoughts....

torture was abolished centuries ago, I guess!
I have to repeat myself, if you sincerely repent, if you are disgusted by your sins, you will be forgiven. God forgives. Jesus forgave the thief's sins on the cross. No other "procedure" needed.

You stated the first mistake, that Mike didnt throughly examine his conscience. He just confessed the things that bothered him the most. I would think at the least the priest would have been more concerned with Mikes future salvation, and would have mentioned to him about receiving Communion, making his Easter duty, attending Mass on Sunday etc. etc. etc.