Originally Posted By: Don Cardi
Originally Posted By: olivant

Again, local tactics are not going to affect the strategic outcome of a war.



from within that off limits place, and take refuge there, and store their weapons there, and put snipers on the roofs there who pick off your soldiers one after the other or force your troops to retreat because they are not allowed to fire back, you're going to tell me that tactics like that are NOT going to affect the strategic outcome of the war?




See, I may not be educated, experienced or trained in military strategies and tactics, but street smarts and common sense tells me that if your enemy is killing your soldiers one after the other because he is holed up in a place where he can fire upon you, but you cannot fire back, you cannot win the fight. Allowing your enemy to strategically base their position in a place where they can kill you from, but where you cannot even fire back at them, is a recipe for disaster as far as I'm concerned. You're doomed to fail when you have ridiculous, rules, strategies or whatever you choose to call them, like that when you are fighting a war.

Especially when fighting a war where the enemy has absolutely no respect or cares about who or what they blow up or kill.

If the enemy does not respect it's own supposed Holy place of worship, then why the hell should we?

Don Cardi


We keep going around and around on this. If you are obtaining ROE info from former soldiers who fought in Iraq, then the info they are giving you is either mistaken, incidental, or they are lying. I defy anyone to produce a genral order that precludes attacks upon mosques when those mosques are used as a fire base. The right of self-defense forms the basis of US military ROE. Ask those soldiers you refered to to quote the general order that precluded them from attacking a mosque. If they're unit commanders precluded such a tactical response, they made it for a good reason, which, if you were to confront them about it, they would tell you the reason.

I think you overestimate the value of your common semse. The strategic component of the war in Iraq addresses how the weapons and personnel got into the Mosque, not what disposition was made of them once they were there. Yes, lack of education, experience, and training in military staregies counts for a whole lot when one is critiqing operations in a military theater.

For example, one needs to know the diffeence between counter-attack and fire suppression; between fire for effect and for collateral damage; between a 5,56 and a 7.62 caliber shell and their effects. There's alot more to it than on TV.

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