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Re: WWE Raw
#262365
06/15/05 01:50 PM
06/15/05 01:50 PM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 67,782 The Villa Quatro
Irishman12
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Originally posted by Capo de La Cosa Nostra: When do you think the WWF/E was in its prime? Who were the main-eventers, who was champion, which kind of alliances/storylines were there, and so on?
Mick For me, I think it was probably in its prime during the late 1980s to early 1990s (maybe 1988-1992). The main-eventers were Hulk Hogan, Ultimate Warrior, Ric Flair, Macho Man Randy Savage with mid-carders such as Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Jake the Snake Roberts, etc. As for storylines, I did like the Corporate angle, as well as the original DX (HHH, Shawn Michaels, and Chyna). But the WWF did get a second wind during the late 1990s (1998+) with Stone Cold Steve Austin, The Rock, Mick Foley, New Age Outlaws, etc
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Re: WWE Raw
#262366
06/15/05 06:25 PM
06/15/05 06:25 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145 East Tennessee
ronnierocketAGO
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What made the "nWo" work especially was that besides the really good tag team in the "Outsiders"(remember when Tag Team Wrestling was actually considered serious by its respective group?), was also how the unthinkable had occured: Hulk Hogan as the heel. Real brilliant coup there. What was odd about the tag team was that Hall was a decent good wrestler, but Kevin Nash(or we kiddies remembered him as The Diesel back in the WWF days) was never a good wrestler.
Too bad Scott Hall aka Razor Ramon had his never-conquerable problems with alcohol and drugs which got him kicked out of wrestling, and Nash....he just never worked for me as a serious heavyweight champ.
Now the WWF was powerful back in 1998/1999, to the point that when ABC's MONDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL tried to move its game time to 8 PM mondays at the time, WWF *whipped* it in the ratings. Ouch. Not to mention that as legend claims, the Walt Disney Corporation(parents of ABC, ESPN, etc.) tried to *bribe* the WWF into moving RAW to another night with about $100 million. Of course this was before Vince Big Mac's company deflated and the disaster that was the XFL.
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Re: WWE Raw
#262371
06/15/05 11:21 PM
06/15/05 11:21 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,950
DonMichaelCorleone
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Originally posted by Double-J: Bah, now it's clear that MNF kills Raw, WWE's ratings have declined steadily over the past few years, especially since WCW went under, because now, without competition, the product has turned to shite. Which is why I think ECW will be brought back under Paul Heyman- the buy rate for ECW one night stand was something like 3times what they expected it to be and was the highest buyrate in years if I remember correctly. Vince needs ECW [img] http://www.wwe.com/content/media/touts/feature/29062/603518[/img]
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Re: WWE Raw
#262376
06/17/05 12:49 PM
06/17/05 12:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 66 Toronto
Maple Leafs
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In regards to the question of Flair, Hogan or Hart, I would have to agree with you guys and say Hogan. He made wrestling mainstream, when it was thought of as a circus, attracting old ladies with canes, and illiterate fans. He also made all the headliners in all the territories more money due to the attention wrestling was now getting.
My favourite though is Flair. No one could cut a promo like him, and he was fantastic in the ring. Woooooooo! (even though he is almost 100% comedy now, he is still great!)
Bret was an underated champion. He had excellent skills and could carry a match. Too bad he will always be remembered as a whiner for the Survivor Series.
just my 2 cents (canadian money)
Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson, Neil Peart...RUSH
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Re: WWE Raw
#262377
06/17/05 12:58 PM
06/17/05 12:58 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543 Gateshead, UK
Capo de La Cosa Nostra
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As regards Hart's whining for the Gang Rulez Survivor Series (at which, may I note, every single heel won, from which I still haven't recovered!), do people think he was right to do so? Or are you loving Vince McMahon all the way?
I still lament how Hart's career turned out. Luck (if we can be so bold as to call it that) hasn't been kind to him, with many sudden deaths in the family.
For me, he was always, and still is, and will always be the excellent of execution. And the best out of the Hogan, Flair and Hart contest would be Bret. Hogan may be more important for wrestling, but he could never wrestle. Flair was always a mere cartoon, though an excellent wrestler. But Bret was cool man. He was cool.
Mick
...dot com bold typeface rhetoric. You go clickety click and get your head split. 'The hell you look like on a message board Discussing whether or not the Brother is hardcore?
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Re: WWE Raw
#262378
06/17/05 01:10 PM
06/17/05 01:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 66 Toronto
Maple Leafs
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Don't get me wrong Mick, I love Hart. I just think his legacy is a little tarnished. Too many questions remain unanswered regarding the SS. I think it was all true, and no, i am not a big fan of Vince McMahon. He is an excellent promoter, but a lousy person.
Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson, Neil Peart...RUSH
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Re: WWE Raw
#262379
06/17/05 01:31 PM
06/17/05 01:31 PM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 67,782 The Villa Quatro
Irishman12
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Originally posted by Maple Leafs: Bret was an underated champion. He had excellent skills and could carry a match. Too bad he will always be remembered as a whiner for the Survivor Series.
just my 2 cents (canadian money) A whiner!? The man spilt blood, sweet, and tears for that company. He put his body on the line night in and night out, was away from his family 200+ days out of the year, worked through injuries, etc etc. And all he asked for was to be treated with respect and to allow him to drop the title in the United States as opposed to his home country of Canada. VERY understandable in my book, nor do I think it's asking a lot (if anything at all). Bret has every reason in the world to "whine" as you so put it Mick, I agree. Bret was and still is the best. IMO, he's probably one of the best "wrestlers" (wrestlers who can actually wrestler and not just a gimmick). He was the best technical wrestler I ever saw.
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Re: WWE Raw
#262380
06/17/05 01:38 PM
06/17/05 01:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 66 Toronto
Maple Leafs
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I guess I should try and write more clearly. I did not say "I" thought he was a whiner, but it has been seven years since the Survivor Series, and he still talks about it regularly, and when people discuss him, it is always brought up. I repeat "I love Hart" ![](/threads/images/graemlins/classic/cool.gif)
Geddy Lee, Alex Lifeson, Neil Peart...RUSH
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Re: WWE Raw
#262381
06/17/05 03:09 PM
06/17/05 03:09 PM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543 Gateshead, UK
Capo de La Cosa Nostra
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543
Gateshead, UK
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Originally posted by Maple Leafs: I repeat "I love Hart" Me too! I heart him. Mick
...dot com bold typeface rhetoric. You go clickety click and get your head split. 'The hell you look like on a message board Discussing whether or not the Brother is hardcore?
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Re: WWE Raw
#262382
06/17/05 09:44 PM
06/17/05 09:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145 East Tennessee
ronnierocketAGO
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Har Har! BTW, did you know that Brett Hart owns a minor league hockey team in Canada? Naturally, they are named THE HITMEN. I agree 100% that Hart was the best wrestler of the above-mentioned wrestlers. While Hogan and Flair are more important in "wrasslin" history, Hart was the best wrestler of the bunch. Besides, he didn't repeat the SAME MATCH ROUTINE for decades like Flair. Hart's only problem as I've said before was that his mike skills methinks was a tad weak. Still, him and the "Hart Foundation" was pretty darn good. As for his deal with that infamous SURVIVOR SERIES...ya he got screwed by Vince, and he was just never the same when he worked at WCW. Oh and Maple Leafs, thanks for your 2 cents worth of Canadian money. I'll use it when I'm done wiping my bottom with some Mexican Pesos in the bathroom. JK! ![](/threads/images/graemlins/classic/lol.gif)
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Re: WWE Raw
#262383
06/19/05 05:54 PM
06/19/05 05:54 PM
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 166
Silvio
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Originally posted by Capo de La Cosa Nostra: When do you think the WWF/E was in its prime? Who were the main-eventers, who was champion, which kind of alliances/storylines were there, and so on?
Mick Personally I think that the best time was shortly after they decided to make the show a little more adult. The Bret Hart screwjob at suvivior series got rid of the tradiontal fighter and gave every one a bad ass gimmick (ie Fighter Kama turning into Godfather and Triple H moving from a snob to DX sidekick/leader). Id say between Wrestlemaina 14 and 15 was wrestling at its best, mainly summer to March. This time included Hell in a Cell, DX in its first and only entertaining run, the Corporation (Rock, Shammrock, Bossman, Test, Vince, and Shane). We also saw Rock as a bad guy, where in my opinion he was a better performer. Mick Foley held the title a few times. Stone Cold was against all odds with Vince. The Undertaker and Kane storylines. The middle card wrestlers were entertaining too. Jeff Jarrett and Owen Hart with Debra, Val Venis, the Brood, the Oddities with ICP, Sable and Jackie. damn if wrestling were still like that id still watch it all the time. suck it
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Re: WWE Raw
#262384
06/20/05 05:09 AM
06/20/05 05:09 AM
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543 Gateshead, UK
Capo de La Cosa Nostra
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543
Gateshead, UK
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Yeah, my favourite storyline was Stone Cold against all odds with Vince. I used to love looking forward to the Royal Rumbles with them.
With that in mind, what is everybody's favourite Pay Per View, and which one of them is your favourite?
Mine is the Royal Rumble, and my favourite of those was probably (either) 1995, with Michaels and Bulldog first and last two in (or) 1998, When Austin beat The Rock to win.
Mick
...dot com bold typeface rhetoric. You go clickety click and get your head split. 'The hell you look like on a message board Discussing whether or not the Brother is hardcore?
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