If you want to make the distinction, fine, although it's a narrow one at best, I think.

When I wrote it, I guess I was thinking "How do 'we the people'" know for sure, but if you wish to separate the two, go right ahead.

How do we the people know for sure, and how does the government know for sure? [/b][/quote]When you refer to the people themselves, the citizens of the United States, we really don't know who is guilty or innocent, since we weren't witnesses to a crime in question. Then again, in any case, who *really* knows? I mean, as you have stated numerous times, there are people on death row who are innocent but have been wrongfully convicted. The only way we would every truly know is if we were intimate with the people in question. After all, even if there was a trial, who is to say that we, the public, would ever get the *true* story? Especially in a case involving terrorism; like I said beforehand, I doubt that any terrorist would ever get a fair trial here (which, as I'm sure you could ascertain, I really am not particularly concerned about). I suppose the best explanation is that we, the people, will probably never know who is truly innocent or guilty. We will have to either accept what is revealed to us by the government, or what is decided in a trial (the jurors most specifically), or both. So, to answer your first question, we don't *know* for sure whether they are guilty or not.

As far as the government is concerned, they *know* through either secret/clandestine evidence that won't ever be revealed to the general public (for security reasons, etc.), through capturing these people red handed (i.e. on the traditional battlefield, while they are on a computer, etc.), or arbitrarily detaining these people. Obviously, the government's interpretation of "guilty" would be much more broad in the instance of national security than many ordinary citizens (I would think), especially given the terrorist label of the people being detained. For the second part of that question, the best explanation would be that the government knows either through cloak-and-dagger evidence collection (that could expose national secrets and thus cannot be revealed to the public), the government knows because it caught them on the battlefield or with traditional evidence (which may or may not ever be revealed to the public in the future), or the government doesn't know, and simply suspects someone, and has detained them in the interest of national security (most likely will never be revealed to the public).

Regards,
Double-J